Prorogation will be the nail in the tories coffin. Watch

imlikeahermit
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The last few days have highlighted the immaturity, defiance and arrogance of a Tory government that is now heading down a very very dark hard right wing path in which it is polarising a large majority of the British Electorate.

How can you justify a prorogation firstly, at this time, in the middle of the biggest political crisis that we have seen in modern history, and secondly, for that length of time, which is abnormal in regards to the length of time given. It is a complete and utter joke.

He has backed himself into a corner where he faces two choices, either break the law, or go with a law which he has said umpteen times he will not support.

Like it or lump it, 48% of this country voted for us to remain in the EU. Only 72% of the electorate turned out, which is pitiful. Those who voted to leave were lied to, plain and simple.

The last few days have been an embarrassment for the Tories, topped off by scenes in the House of Commons last night, whereby they couldn't be even bothered to wait for the speaker to return. Embarrassing and shows little care for getting things done.
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_Wellies_
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Sadly it won’t be the nail in the Tory coffin.

Conservative voters tend to be obedient and deferential to their superiors. Too many of them will turn out to vote Conservative regardless of how much damage the party does to Britain.
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fallen_acorns
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the nail in the coffin.. to a party that is polling the highest of all the parties at the moment, and whose base of voters is easily identifiable and all in agreement?

Its a shift in the direction of the party thats for sure, and there will definitely be a shift in voter-base to the right, but for every voter they loose to the libs, they will pick up one from the brexit party (or UKIP before). but the nail in the coffin? if they are dead, the labour party must be a zombie, because somehow its still polling less and looking like loosing an election to a 'dead' party.

In the mean time, going into an election, if your a leave supporter, your voting tory. If your a remain supporter your voting SNP or Lib Dems...Who is voting labour? Their policy is still to back a second referendum, whilst also promising to deliver a great deal.. two things which when combined make about as much sense as Diane Abbot.

I like whats happening to the Torries at the moment.. they are showing their true colours and deviding into two smaller but far more representative groups. I hope it continues, but I fear that the gravity of power will end up pulling the two halves back together. I would much rather have a split tory party though, where each half actually propperly represents a group of the public. ERG/right in one group and the one-nation torries, center-right on the other. I hope the same thing happens with labour, and we get a split between the working-class/union labour, and the middle-class metropolitan socialist labour.

Our political climate, especially with how technology has changed our outlooks and ways of forming groups, has left the idea of grand-coalition type parties looking dated and leaving large groups feeling unrepresented. Let them both die, and let new smaller and actually representative parties form. Boris' ruthlessness, for all its awful qualities, at least is forcing things into action, I hope it continues and we see some really radical re-shaping of our parlimatary system.
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Quady
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
the nail in the coffin.. to a party that is polling the highest of all the parties at the moment, and whose base of voters is easily identifiable and all in agreement?

Its a shift in the direction of the party thats for sure, and there will definitely be a shift in voter-base to the right, but for every voter they loose to the libs, they will pick up one from the brexit party (or UKIP before). but the nail in the coffin? if they are dead, the labour party must be a zombie, because somehow its still polling less and looking like loosing an election to a 'dead' party.

In the mean time, going into an election, if your a leave supporter, your voting tory. If your a remain supporter your voting SNP or Lib Dems...Who is voting labour? Their policy is still to back a second referendum, whilst also promising to deliver a great deal.. two things which when combined make about as much sense as Diane Abbot.

I like whats happening to the Torries at the moment.. they are showing their true colours and deviding into two smaller but far more representative groups. I hope it continues, but I fear that the gravity of power will end up pulling the two halves back together. I would much rather have a split tory party though, where each half actually propperly represents a group of the public. ERG/right in one group and the one-nation torries, center-right on the other. I hope the same thing happens with labour, and we get a split between the working-class/union labour, and the middle-class metropolitan socialist labour.

Our political climate, especially with how technology has changed our outlooks and ways of forming groups, has left the idea of grand-coalition type parties looking dated and leaving large groups feeling unrepresented. Let them both die, and let new smaller and actually representative parties form. Boris' ruthlessness, for all its awful qualities, at least is forcing things into action, I hope it continues and we see some really radical re-shaping of our parlimatary system.
Anyone who wants to leave but without going to WTO terms?
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Andrew97
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72% turnout is not pitiful.
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Burton Bridge
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Of course if wont be, unfortunately. Look at the mess labour are in ffs
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by Andrew97)
72% turnout is not pitiful.
It is. It isn't even enough to get union action...
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the bear
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Boris is staying loyal to the ignorant numpties stout-hearted patriots who voted for us to leave the EU. he is fulfilling the promises he made to those tragically uninformed baboons salt of the earth Englishmen so many years ago.
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by the bear)
Boris is staying loyal to the ignorant numpties stout-hearted patriots who voted for us to leave the EU. he is fulfilling the promises he made to those tragically uninformed baboons salt of the earth Englishmen so many years ago.
Please rate some other members before rating this user again.
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Andrew97
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
It is. It isn't even enough to get union action...
That has no relevance. Personally I’d ban some unions from striking altother (although that’s a different argument)


Before the referendum the promise was clear, the result of the referendum would be implemented. The vote was too leave, more voted to leave than did so to remain. That’s all that matters.
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Quady
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
The last few days have highlighted the immaturity, defiance and arrogance of a Tory government that is now heading down a very very dark hard right wing path in which it is polarising a large majority of the British Electorate.

How can you justify a prorogation firstly, at this time, in the middle of the biggest political crisis that we have seen in modern history, and secondly, for that length of time, which is abnormal in regards to the length of time given. It is a complete and utter joke.

He has backed himself into a corner where he faces two choices, either break the law, or go with a law which he has said umpteen times he will not support.

Like it or lump it, 48% of this country voted for us to remain in the EU. Only 72% of the electorate turned out, which is pitiful. Those who voted to leave were lied to, plain and simple.

The last few days have been an embarrassment for the Tories, topped off by scenes in the House of Commons last night, whereby they couldn't be even bothered to wait for the speaker to return. Embarrassing and shows little care for getting things done.
Yes, we were lied to. We were told interest rates would rise.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
It is. It isn't even enough to get union action...
Therefore we should automatically leave no deal because there was not enough of a mandate to join the EEC in the first place. Maybe tony blair labour should remain in government because there has not been a big enough landslide to remove them.
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by Andrew97)
That has no relevance. Personally I’d ban some unions from striking altother (although that’s a different argument)


Before the referendum the promise was clear, the result of the referendum would be implemented. The vote was too leave, more voted to leave than did so to remain. That’s all that matters.
As someone who is within a union, and believes fully in the union system, we'll leave that argument about striking till another day.

However, my point still stands, it has relevance. 51% of 72% of the country voted to leave. That is not enough of a mandate and the government, quite foolishly took it as one.

Not to mention that now due to this taking the time it has, quite rightly in the my opinion, you have a lot of people now just over the age of 18 that didn't get to vote in the first place. If my memory serves me correctly, the breakdown of voters was as such that the younger generation voted to remain, while the older generation voted to leave, no?
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by Quady)
Yes, we were lied to. We were told interest rates would rise.
We have not left yet.
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nulli tertius
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)

How can you justify a prorogation firstly, at this time, in the middle of the biggest political crisis that we have seen in modern history, and secondly, for that length of time, which is abnormal in regards to the length of time given. It is a complete and utter joke.
Parliament parogued between 1st August and 28 October 1930.

On 7 August unemployment in the Great Depression passed 2 million

India brought to standstill by Gandhi's civil disobedience campaign.

Anti-Jewish rioting in Palestine, UK Government condemed by League of Nations for failining to stop it. UK Government proposes limits on Jewish entry

On 5 October R101 crashes
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fallen_acorns
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
It is. It isn't even enough to get union action...
The last general election that had a higher turnout was 27 years ago.

Think of every decision and action our governments have taken since then..

we have: gone to war multiple times, opened our boarders to mass immigration, legalised gay marriage and created the equality act, devolved the union, given the bank of england indepednace, governed our way through multiple recessions, sold our gold reserves, privatised the railways, introduced the minimum wage, made students pay for their tuition, and then raised it multiple times, privatised parts of the NHS etc.

All with less of a public mandate than Brexit.

There are many good arguments against Brexit, but voter-turn out is a nonsense one.
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ColinDent
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
As someone who is within a union, and believes fully in the union system, we'll leave that argument about striking till another day.

However, my point still stands, it has relevance. 51% of 72% of the country voted to leave. That is not enough of a mandate and the government, quite foolishly took it as one.

Not to mention that now due to this taking the time it has, quite rightly in the my opinion, you have a lot of people now just over the age of 18 that didn't get to vote in the first place. If my memory serves me correctly, the breakdown of voters was as such that the younger generation voted to remain, while the older generation voted to leave, no?
Sorry but I must correct you, 52% of those that could be bothered to vote on the matter chose to leave, the 28% are superfluous to the equation.
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ByEeek
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I would agree wholeheartedly but for the simple fact that Labour are equally unappealing and every other party is rather niche.

Even to me the Tories are the least worst which is bo compliment.
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L i b
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The Tories are doing well because the opposition is pitiful and because there's a lot of riled-up folk who want Brexit to be delivered. That doesn't look like it'll change any time soon.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
The last general election that had a higher turnout was 27 years ago.

Think of every decision and action our governments have taken since then..

we have: gone to war multiple times, opened our boarders to mass immigration, legalised gay marriage and created the equality act, devolved the union, given the bank of england indepednace, governed our way through multiple recessions, sold our gold reserves, privatised the railways, introduced the minimum wage, made students pay for their tuition, and then raised it multiple times, privatised parts of the NHS etc.

All with less of a public mandate than Brexit.

There are many good arguments against Brexit, but voter-turn out is a nonsense one.
Including joining the EU in the first place, absolutely spot on.
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