QE2
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#81
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#81
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
Brilliance, instead of smarty pant non constructive comments breaking forum rules, why dont you post an on topic post and enlighten us with you're brexit solution?

As the OP I'd like to keep this thread friendly and on topic, thank you very much
Ah, come on. It was pretty good. Admit it. Not only was the underlying idea logically sound, but there was a pop culture/literature reference and a excellent pun to boot!
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QE2
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#82
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#82
(Original post by Andrew97)
Your point being?
That without all the elderly English immigrants, Wales would have voted Remain. Just pointing that out to whoever was claiming that Wales supported Leave.
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QE2
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#83
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#83
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
What a nonsense argument, if leavers 2% were looney then that makes the vote void. Forgetting there are an equal (if not higher) a amount of looney remainers making up their vote.

The art of compromise is absent from modern politics
We've been through this before. The demographic of the referendum were that the elderly and uneducated tended to vote Leave, while the young and educated tended to vote Remain. Given the incidence of dementia in older age groups, the Leave vote also included more people suffering from mental incapacity. Of course, you will try and claim this is nonsense, but the numbers don't lie. If you have 1 million under 25s and 1 million over 75s, which group will have the highest incidence of dementia sufferers? Correct.
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QE2
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#84
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#84
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
Johnson did not shut it down to stop parliament doing their job
The 11 judges of the Supreme Court beg to differ. Ah, but I forgot, you are a constitutional law expert, cognisant of all the details of the case. :rofl:
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Burton Bridge
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#85
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#85
(Original post by AW_1983)
No, I think you're too damn frit to demand what you voted for. This is what pisses me off the most about Brexiters. They all claim to have known what they voted for, but they never demand the delivery of what was promised in 2016! Where are all those trade deals? Why are we still negotiating a deal with the EU that was meant to take 24 hours? Where is that £350m a week for the NHS? Why haven't Germany capitulated to carry on selling us cars?

Etc etc etc. Brexiters have so little backbone that if they bought a chocolate icecream, they'd sooner accept a turd in a Tupperware masquerading as such than humiliate themselves by accepting vanilla. Pathetic, each and every one of them.
Now you are just talking silly, the majority of people in the country just want this brexit debacle over, that's leavers and remainers just not the hard core variety that screem fake offence at a word like surrender whist chanting "Tony Blair can **** off and die" such liberal people friendly people and calling everyone whom disagrees with them xenophobic, racist, stupid and then there us the cliff edge.

(Original post by AW_1983)

Where are all those trade deals?
On hold, non can be arranged while we are members of the EU because the EU forbids it

(Original post by AW_1983)
Why are we still negotiating a deal with the EU that was meant to take 24 hours?
I dont think any said such a thing, but that's because mainly remainer parliament has frustrated brexit and acted against what they claim to want in their manifesto they stood for election on.

(Original post by AW_1983)
Where is that £350m a week for the NHS?
NHS has gained funding very similar to this figure however this was a misleading slogan than was not meant litterally. It amazing to me why remainers take this in a litteral manner whist chanting many inflammatory non-literal slogans themselves. Hypocrites?
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Burton Bridge
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#86
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#86
(Original post by QE2)
Ah, come on. It was pretty good. Admit it. Not only was the underlying idea logically sound, but there was a pop culture/literature reference and a excellent pun to boot!
Maybe I missed the joke, I have never seen any lord of the rings programmes.

(Original post by QE2)
That without all the elderly English immigrants, Wales would have voted Remain. Just pointing that out to whoever was claiming that Wales supported Leave.
What does that matter, that's very xenophobic are you saying immigrants should not have the same voice as a "native" inhabitant? Is that why you bring immigration up so much when nobody else is talking about immigration?

(Original post by QE2)
We've been through this before. The demographic of the referendum were that the elderly and uneducated tended to vote Leave, while the young and educated tended to vote Remain. Given the incidence of dementia in older age groups, the Leave vote also included more people suffering from mental incapacity. Of course, you will try and claim this is nonsense, but the numbers don't lie. If you have 1 million under 25s and 1 million over 75s, which group will have the highest incidence of dementia sufferers? Correct.
Oh wow, and remainers have the audacity to speak about inflammatory language of the surrender bill!

There was and is idoits on both sides, in democracy a stupid mans vote is worth the same as a successful business man, a lord or a genius. Picking up on the fact naiveity and youth are linked or dementia and old age are linked is helping nobody. As you age your opinions change with the life experience you gain.

You seem to love to quote but still have not answered my question in my OP, which is the topic matter. For the second time, please enlighten us?
Last edited by Burton Bridge; 3 weeks ago
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Burton Bridge
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#87
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#87
(Original post by QE2)
The 11 judges of the Supreme Court beg to differ. Ah, but I forgot, you are a constitutional law expert, cognisant of all the details of the case. :rofl:
I have never said such a thing, please stop lying.
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#88
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#88
(Original post by QE2)
That without all the elderly English immigrants, Wales would have voted Remain. Just pointing that out to whoever was claiming that Wales supported Leave.
Strange that, if you remove people who voted leave remain wins....

Wales voted to leave, thats a fact.
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#89
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#89
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
Maybe I missed the joke, I have never seen any lord of the rings programmes.
Really? Perhaps the films are aimed at a younger demographic, but it's a book as well. A very famous one. Published over 50 years ago.

What does that matter, that's very xenophobic are you saying immigrants should not have the same voice as a "native" inhabitant? Is that why you bring immigration up so much when nobody else is talking about immigration?
Merely saying the word "immigrant" is not indicative of racism or xenophobia. It is your attitude towards immigrants that determines that.
A detective or judge might say "rape" or "murder" many times in a single day. Does that make them rapists and murderers?
It matters because it disproves the claim that "the Welsh" voted Leave. Remember that I think immigration is good. I welcome it. Unlike yourself, I do not blame immigrants for social problems.

Oh wow, and remainers have the audacity to speak about inflammatory language of the surrender bill!
Er, last time I looked, I was't the prime minister speaking on national television.
And please explain which part of that isn't entirely factual and supported by evidence.

There was and is idoits on both sides, in democracy a stupid mans vote is worth the same as a successful business man, a lord or a genius. Picking up on the fact naiveity and youth are linked or dementia and old age are linked is helping nobody. As you age your opinions change with the life experience you gain.
You are avoiding the issue. The evidence shows that Remain voters are more likely to have a reasonable understanding of the issues than Leave voters.

You seem to love to quote but still have not answered my question in my OP, which is the topic matter. Fir the second time, please enlighten us?
I already did. A 2nd referendum is the only reasonable solution. Not because a referendum in and of itself is a good solution (we have seen that it clearly isn't), but the problem was caused by a referendum so those who claim legitimacy from a referendum will only surrender that following another referendum.
Following a referendum with properly thought through options, with properly moderated campaigning, there can be no further argument. I would certainly be prepared to accept a No Deal Brexit if the majority of the country voted for it. I would still think it was a stupid and dangerous idea though.
This is the only rational and workable solution. Unfortunately the Leave camp will always oppose it because they know that the will of the people is now Remain.
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QE2
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#90
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#90
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
I have never said such a thing, please stop lying.
Oh, behave.
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QE2
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#91
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#91
(Original post by Andrew97)
Wales voted to leave, thats a fact.
Yes, but not the Welsh. You do realise that Welsh people generally want independence from England, as well as to Remain in the EU. I wonder why the other three "countries" are pro-Remain? Is it purely based on being pro-EU, or is there an anti-English element in there? It is common knowledge that the Scots, Irish and Welsh generally hate the English.
Anywho, the point is irrelevant as the UK is one nation as far as the EU is concerned, not several.
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Burton Bridge
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#92
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#92
(Original post by QE2)
Really? Perhaps the films are aimed at a younger demographic, but it's a book as well. A very famous one. Published over 50 years ago.


Merely saying the word "immigrant" is not indicative of racism or xenophobia. It is your attitude towards immigrants that determines that.
A detective or judge might say "rape" or "murder" many times in a single day. Does that make them rapists and murderers?
It matters because it disproves the claim that "the Welsh" voted Leave. Remember that I think immigration is good. I welcome it. Unlike yourself, I do not blame immigrants for social problems.


Er, last time I looked, I was't the prime minister speaking on national television.
And please explain which part of that isn't entirely factual and supported by evidence.


You are avoiding the issue. The evidence shows that Remain voters are more likely to have a reasonable understanding of the issues than Leave voters.


I already did. A 2nd referendum is the only reasonable solution. Not because a referendum in and of itself is a good solution (we have seen that it clearly isn't), but the problem was caused by a referendum so those who claim legitimacy from a referendum will only surrender that following another referendum.
Following a referendum with properly thought through options, with properly moderated campaigning, there can be no further argument. I would certainly be prepared to accept a No Deal Brexit if the majority of the country voted for it. I would still think it was a stupid and dangerous idea though.
This is the only rational and workable solution. Unfortunately the Leave camp will always oppose it because they know that the will of the people is now Remain.
1) If I watched/read lord of the ring is not related to the topic, neither is my age.

2) A immigrants vote is worth the same as born native. You suggest otherwise by your xenophobic argument, dont attack me I've not mentioned immigration on any recent topic because I hold no issue with immigratio, you are the one forcing the immigration topic and it's becoming clear why.

You're point is nonsensical as Andrew97 pointed out, remove people who voted for one outcome to make the other outcome win, its for the birds.

3) aww so its OK for you to act irresponsible and use inflammatory language, presumably this is why you over look remainer parliamentarians for doing the same thing, including shouting racist, xenophobic, fascist, cliff edge, end of the world, crash the plane etc? You use regurgitate this bile so much I presume you support them using it?

4) no it doesn't, there is evidence which suggests that the more you are exposed the the EU funded education system and the more impressionable and naive you are the more likely you are to vote remain. However all of this is irrelevant and unhelpful. I really I should been the bigger more mature person and re-typed, in democracy a stupid mans vote is worth the same as a successful business man, a lord or a genius.

5) I'm starting to agree about a second referendum, parliament are making such a sabotage of this its untrue. I don't think it will happen but a legally blinding referendum which overrides parliamentarians with a honest and open question and campaign.

Do you wish to revoke A50 and continue membership of the EU?

Or

Do you wish to leave the EU deal or no deal by the x date.
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Burton Bridge
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#93
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#93
(Original post by QE2)
Oh, behave.
Im perfectly polight and orderly, dont accuse me of things I never said.

For the third time I'm still waiting for your on topic contribution, do you have a answer to #1?
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Burton Bridge
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#94
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#94
(Original post by QE2)
Yes, but not the Welsh. You do realise that Welsh people generally want independence from England, as well as to Remain in the EU. I wonder why the other three "countries" are pro-Remain? Is it purely based on being pro-EU, or is there an anti-English element in there? It is common knowledge that the Scots, Irish and Welsh generally hate the English.
Anywho, the point is irrelevant as the UK is one nation as far as the EU is concerned, not several.
You wish to split immigrants against natives then? That's litterally xenophobia.
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QE2
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#95
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#95
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
1) If I watched/read lord of the ring is not related to the topic, neither is my age.
Not to me, it isn't not.

2) A immigrants vote is worth the same as born native. You suggest otherwise by your xenophobic argument, dont attack me I've not mentioned immigration on any recent topic because I hold no issue with immigratio, you are the one forcing the immigration topic and it's becoming clear why.
Nice try. lol!

You're point is nonsensical as Andrew97 pointed out, remove people who voted for one outcome to make the other outcome win, its for the birds.
Unsurprisingly, you have misunderstood the point of the exchange.

3) aww so its OK for you to act irresponsible and use inflammatory language, presumably this is why you over look remainer parliamentarians for doing the same thing, including shouting racist, xenophobic, fascist, cliff edge, end of the world, crash the plane etc? You use regurgitate this bile so much I presume you support them using it?
1. My posts on a debate website are not held to the same standards as the PM talking on national TV. Do you really think I should be?
2. I have not normalised or condoned threats or violence against MPs for doing their duty as parliamentarians.
3. Whataboutery is never a defence. I similarly condemn any Remain representative who normalises threats or violence against Leave MPs.

4) no it doesn't, there is evidence which suggests that the more you are exposed the the EU funded education system and the more impressionable and naive you are the more likely you are to vote remain.
What "EU funded education system" is that? Do you really think there special EU funded schools where they educate Remainers? :rofl:. OMG, please stop!

However all of this is irrelevant and unhelpful. I really I should been the bigger more mature person and re-typed, in democracy a stupid mans vote is worth the same as a successful business man, a lord or a genius.
Of course it is, but that doesn't make a stupid vote any less stupid.

5) I'm starting to agree about a second referendum, parliament are making such a sabotage of this its untrue. I don't think it will happen but a legally blinding referendum which overrides parliamentarians with a honest and open question and campaign.
Do you wish to revoke A50 and continue membership of the EU?
Or
Do you wish to leave the EU deal or no deal by the x date.[/quote] I would agree to that on principle, but you would find Leavers complaining because the camp is fundamentally split. It is wrong to think of Leave as a monolithic, homogeneous group. It is actually two distinct and fundamentally opposed groups whose conflict is helping the opposition. (It actually reminds me of the latter days of the Spanish Civil War, although that analogy would make Remain the fascists, so forget I mentioned it! )

The issue is no longer Leave or Remain, it is actually Remain, Deal or No Deal. Noel Edmonds could adjudicate.
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QE2
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#96
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#96
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
You wish to split immigrants against natives then? That's litterally xenophobia.
Not necessarily. I could hate both groups and merely want to sow discord.
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QE2
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#97
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#97
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
For the third time I'm still waiting for your on topic contribution, do you have a answer to #1?
Look, this process only works if you actually read my posts. I have twice explained my solution. If you are having trouble with some of the longer words, let me know.
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Burton Bridge
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#98
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#98
(Original post by QE2)
Look, this process only works if you actually read my posts. I have twice explained my solution. If you are having trouble with some of the longer words, let me know.
I'm not thank you very much for your concern. You have still not made an on topic reply to #1 would you mind doing do please?
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Burton Bridge
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#99
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#99
(Original post by QE2)
Not necessarily. I could hate both groups and merely want to sow discord.
I dont think spreading hate is a good thing, I suggest you try to become a little more tolerant to people from other cultures.
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Burton Bridge
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#100
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#100
(Original post by QE2)
Not to me, it isn't not.


Nice try. lol!


Unsurprisingly, you have misunderstood the point of the exchange.


1. My posts on a debate website are not held to the same standards as the PM talking on national TV. Do you really think I should be?
2. I have not normalised or condoned threats or violence against MPs for doing their duty as parliamentarians.
3. Whataboutery is never a defence. I similarly condemn any Remain representative who normalises threats or violence against Leave MPs.


What "EU funded education system" is that? Do you really think there special EU funded schools where they educate Remainers? :rofl:. OMG, please stop!


Of course it is, but that doesn't make a stupid vote any less stupid.
.
I would agree to that on principle, but you would find Leavers complaining because the camp is fundamentally split. It is wrong to think of Leave as a monolithic, homogeneous group. It is actually two distinct and fundamentally opposed groups whose conflict is helping the opposition. (It actually reminds me of the latter days of the Spanish Civil War, although that analogy would make Remain the fascists, so forget I mentioned it! )

The issue is no longer Leave or Remain, it is actually Remain, Deal or No Deal. Noel Edmonds could adjudicate.
Replies in sentence order

You think lord of the rings is related to Brexit solutions? Ok...

I'm not trying anything, A immigrants vote is worth the same as born native. I reject you're xenophobia.

Have I please explain.

1) No
2) good
3) good I agree with you, parliamentarians, and everyone should be free to Express whatever view they wish, within reason.

Not what I said, no, Maybe do a little research into the funding of education establishments, and EU vat regulations while you are at it

Stupid to one person is not to another, are we not straying into bigotry here?

I dont think so, because remain is not a whole family either there are people, like yourself at a guess, that are totally sold to the European project and would wish to take a more head deep attitude rather than our, soft remain where we are half in half out.

Anyway by referendum rules the question needs to be uncomplicated and fair and without jargon. That's why I'd go for revoke vs leave. It needs to be clear that leave will happen on departure date deal or no deal and remain will revoke a50 and suffer the conseque the last 3 years. Then it needs to be debated and allow the public to make a choose. What you propose unites the remain vote splits the leave vote and adds complexity to the question.
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