The Student Room Group

Unusual parking restriction

At Brentwood station, there is some parking with the following restriction:

Mon-Fri
7:00-9:30am
4:30-7:00pm
30 mins
No return within 1 hour

Mon-Fri
9:30-4:30pm
2 hours
No return within 1 hour

Here it is on Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6137987,0.3001171,3a,15y,191.12h,88.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKodH3luS84FXfaDkrGJ7MQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I was wondering what is allowable when the restriction changes? For example, if I park there at 9:10am, when can I park until? 9:40? 11:10? 11:30? And similarly what if I park around 4pm?
Reply 1
I would be interested to know what @IWMTom thinks.
Original post by maths42
At Brentwood station, there is some parking with the following restriction:

Mon-Fri
7:00-9:30am
4:30-7:00pm
30 mins
No return within 1 hour

Mon-Fri
9:30-4:30pm
2 hours
No return within 1 hour

Here it is on Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6137987,0.3001171,3a,15y,191.12h,88.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKodH3luS84FXfaDkrGJ7MQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I was wondering what is allowable when the restriction changes? For example, if I park there at 9:10am, when can I park until? 9:40? 11:10? 11:30? And similarly what if I park around 4pm?

If you arrived at 9:40 you'd be permitted to stay for 30 mins, so 10:10.
Arriving at 4pm you'd be permitted to stay for 2hrs, so 6pm.

Basically your stay isn't being extended because your car is already parked up there. The time windows are for when you are arriving.

Now Tom will explain how I'm completely wrong :wink:
Original post by Admit-One
If you arrived at 9:40 you'd be permitted to stay for 30 mins, so 10:10.
Arriving at 4pm you'd be permitted to stay for 2hrs, so 6pm.

Basically your stay isn't being extended because your car is already parked up there. The time windows are for when you are arriving.

Now Tom will explain how I'm completely wrong :wink:

I suspect the highways authority in question has messed up its logic.

If I arrive at 4.25 p.m., I'd expect from that sign to be able to park until 6.25 p.m. Arriving 5 minutes later, though, I'd have to get the car moved by 5 p.m. That surely isn't the intention of rush hour limited parking at a busy commuter railway station!

But if I do arrive at 4.25 p.m., when do I have to move my car? Is it 4.55 p.m., 5 p.m. or 6.25 p.m.?

Enquiring minds need to know!
Reply 4
Original post by 学生の父
I suspect the highways authority in question has messed up its logic.

If I arrive at 4.25 p.m., I'd expect from that sign to be able to park until 6.25 p.m. Arriving 5 minutes later, though, I'd have to get the car moved by 5 p.m. That surely isn't the intention of rush hour limited parking at a busy commuter railway station!

But if I do arrive at 4.25 p.m., when do I have to move my car? Is it 4.55 p.m., 5 p.m. or 6.25 p.m.?

Enquiring minds need to know!

I would imagine though that if you park at 16:25, if a traffic warden logs your number plate at 16:35 and then 17:20, say, then you would get a penalty charge.

I personally took the opposite view and thought that if I park at 9, 2 hours would be allowed since I wouldn't exceed 30 minutes in that restriction period.
Original post by maths42
I would imagine though that if you park at 16:25, if a traffic warden logs your number plate at 16:35 and then 17:20, say, then you would get a penalty charge.

I personally took the opposite view and thought that if I park at 9, 2 hours would be allowed since I wouldn't exceed 30 minutes in that restriction period.

I suspect that you're correct. I mean the traffic warden didn't see me park at 4.25 p.m., did she? As far as she knew I got there at 4.35 p.m.

It would be nice to get a legal opinion on if the sign is too confusing to be enforceable.
Reply 6
Original post by maths42
I would be interested to know what @IWMTom thinks.

Very interesting! Yet more evidence of the confusion surrounding parking signs. They certainly need a revamp!

To me, the clock realistically begins when the traffic womble first makes a note of your registration.

If your registration was first clocked at 9:20, I would say the LA would argue that you can only park until 9:50 even though you've crossed into another boundary as the time you arrived is the zone that applies.

I would be very interested as to what the LA say if you submit a Freedom of Information request - please do feed back as I'm intrigued; it's definitely a confusing one!
Whichever gives you more time, tickets won't be enforceable due to the misleading/confusing signs.
Original post by the beer
Whichever gives you more time, tickets won't be enforceable due to the misleading/confusing signs.

I agree with this, although there is some risk.

The fact that there is a line between the two restrictions would make be argue that you crossing from one to the other should reset your arrival time. As I said, some risk - I would expect them to issue a ticket, and to have to take it further.
Reply 9
Original post by IWMTom
Very interesting! Yet more evidence of the confusion surrounding parking signs. They certainly need a revamp!

To me, the clock realistically begins when the traffic womble first makes a note of your registration.

If your registration was first clocked at 9:20, I would say the LA would argue that you can only park until 9:50 even though you've crossed into another boundary as the time you arrived is the zone that applies.

I would be very interested as to what the LA say if you submit a Freedom of Information request - please do feed back as I'm intrigued; it's definitely a confusing one!

Great idea! I have done this now: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/confusing_parking_restriction
Reply 10

Brilliant! Please post in this thread when you have received a response :smile:
Reply 11
Original post by IWMTom
Brilliant! Please post in this thread when you have received a response :smile:

Will do :smile:
I would be interested to hear of any similar situations.
There are so many places where the parking situation annoys me.

I find this space a bit bizarre as it appears that you need a permit just to park for 20 minutes! https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5529673,0.0253348,3a,28.9y,58.73h,90.34t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s8qwoZgYwAK8B139DI62W-g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Here I have seen traffic wardens issuing tickets to cars between 4pm and 7pm - I imagine that the drivers thought that it's free parking after 4 and didn't notice the yellow line, it seems like a bit of a trap! https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5787585,-0.1238641,3a,17.7y,237.19h,84.02t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1srIBmrdj90MlPcKkXqZYarA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Here it seems absurd that it is normally loading only, why not allow 10 minute free parking all of them time? https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3342589,-0.2679154,3a,17.2y,298.56h,92.36t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7v6Te_XPIXMRnhViMo7O-A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
The way I see it, you'd be down to whichever boundary your parking time would end in. Of course, if it goes from say 1 hour to 30 mins, that's a bit of a funny one.

If you parked there at 9, yes, when you park there it is originally a 1 hour stay. However, that'd take you to 10 which puts you under the new boundary so theoretically you'd be allowed to stay until 11. I wouldn't take it to assume that your time resets at the boundary as some have mentioned unless it is confirmed by an official source.

It'd be something worth looking into but honesty, if you parked there and crossed the boundary but were ticketed for being there for over an hour when the 2 hour restriction is in place, I suspect you'd win the case if it went to court. I certainly wouldn't put it past them to at least try and get a ticket out of it, but they may well rollover if you confront them about it.

Of course, I wouldn't take that as gospel, that's just the way I see it personally. For all I know there's some sort of law, or legal precedent that resulted in the parking restriction at the time of parking being the restriction placed on you.
(edited 4 years ago)
Reply 13

So it has taken them nearly a month to tell me to contact South Essex Parking Partnership - not very impressive. I have emailed South Essex Parking Partnership about this now.
Reply 14
Original post by maths42
So it has taken them nearly a month to tell me to contact South Essex Parking Partnership - not very impressive. I have emailed South Essex Parking Partnership about this now.

Typical! South Essex Parking Partnership didn't read my email properly and assumed that I had asked a more basic question as they said "If you parked at 9.10am in the restriction Mon-Fri 7am to 9.30am you could stay parked until the second restriction comes into force at 4.30pm to 7.00pm and then stay another 30mins to 5.00pm".

I have replied asking them to review my question again but I do wonder whether or not I could successfully appeal a penalty notice if I were to do what they said in their reply, armed with that email.
Reply 15
Original post by maths42
Typical! South Essex Parking Partnership didn't read my email properly and assumed that I had asked a more basic question as they said "If you parked at 9.10am in the restriction Mon-Fri 7am to 9.30am you could stay parked until the second restriction comes into force at 4.30pm to 7.00pm and then stay another 30mins to 5.00pm".

I have replied asking them to review my question again but I do wonder whether or not I could successfully appeal a penalty notice if I were to do what they said in their reply, armed with that email.

What a useless company. They have now replied to say

"It would all be dependant on which limited waiting bay you park in.

With the first restriction -7.00am to 9.30am - you can park for 30 minutes and cannot return within 1 hour. So if you parked here at 9.30am, you could remain in this bay until the restriction starts again, and then stay for a further 30 minutes. You would then have to leave and not return for 1 hour.

The second restriction you mentioned 9.30am to 7.00pm is a different bay as the restriction is different. If you choose to park here, during the restricted time, you can park for 2 hours and then you would have to leave and not return for 1 hour."


So not only have they misunderstood their own restriction and thought that it is different time restrictions for different bays, they have also given the wrong timings!

It is shocking that whoever is sending these emails and signing them off as "Parking Officer" doesn't understand their own parking restriction!

Also it is interesting to see that Google Maps has blurred out the parking restriction that I provided a link to since then. They haven't blurred all of them though and I have never noticed a parking restriction that is blurred before on there (I frequently use street view to check parking restrictions in places)!
Reply 16
Original post by IWMTom
Brilliant! Please post in this thread when you have received a response :smile:

After sending the same question to South Essex Parking Partnership three times due to them not reading it properly twice, I have finally had a satisfactory response and it seems that the restrictions are applied in the best possible way (9am is a very good time to park here!). This is what they said:

1, If you arrive at 9.10am your first parking time allowance would be 20 mins to the end of the first restriction 9.30am the second time restriction would then come into force 9.30am to 4.30pm. You can now stay for 2 hours which would take you to 11.30 am after which you must leave and not return within 1hr

2, If you arrived at 4pm you first parking time allowance would be 30mins to the end of this period restriction 4.30pm. At this time the next restriction would come into force which would allow your to park for another 30mins thus allowing you to park until 5pm after which you must leave and not return within 1hr.

3, If you parked at 8.59am you could stay until 9.29am (30min) after which you must leave and not return within 1hr

4, If you parked at 2.29pm you could stay until 4.29pm (2hrs) after which you must leave and not return within 1hr
Reassuring that it took the body responsible for enforcing the restrictions three attempts over the course of a week to explain them with any degree of clarity. But apparently as a driver you would be expected to discern this solely from the signage.
Reply 18
Original post by maths42
After sending the same question to South Essex Parking Partnership three times due to them not reading it properly twice, I have finally had a satisfactory response and it seems that the restrictions are applied in the best possible way (9am is a very good time to park here!). This is what they said:

1, If you arrive at 9.10am your first parking time allowance would be 20 mins to the end of the first restriction 9.30am the second time restriction would then come into force 9.30am to 4.30pm. You can now stay for 2 hours which would take you to 11.30 am after which you must leave and not return within 1hr

2, If you arrived at 4pm you first parking time allowance would be 30mins to the end of this period restriction 4.30pm. At this time the next restriction would come into force which would allow your to park for another 30mins thus allowing you to park until 5pm after which you must leave and not return within 1hr.

3, If you parked at 8.59am you could stay until 9.29am (30min) after which you must leave and not return within 1hr

4, If you parked at 2.29pm you could stay until 4.29pm (2hrs) after which you must leave and not return within 1hr

Thinking about points 3 and 4, it seems odd that they say you can't return within 1 hour - based on points 1 and 2, surely you would be allowed to return a minute later in the examples given in points 3 and 4 (ignoring the fact that you would be fine anyway because of the 10 minute grace period)?

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