Sharia Law Watch

Bastiat
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Following on from the comments of the Archbishop of Canterbury a few months ago, Britain's most senior judge recommends that contracts should be permitted whose terms, by agreement of the contracting parties, are arbitrated under Sharia Law.

See here.

Lord Phillips said: 'Those who are in dispute are free to subject it to mediation or to agree that it shall be resolved by a chosen arbitrator. There is no reason why principles of sharia law or any other religious code should not be the basis for mediation or other forms of dispute resolution.'
To be clear, before people start to rant about "multiculturalism" and so on: this is not insisting that Sharia law "becomes part of" British law, in the sense that it will be used in disputes where the parties have not contracted to its so being. It also does not mean that those duty-bound components of Sharia Law (the prohibtion of drinking, drugs, adultery &c) will be incumbent on anybody.

I can find no real argument with the principle that, if two parties consent to a contract which includes "arbitration by Sharia law" as one of its terms, that contract ought to be binding and, if dispute arises, arbitrated accordingly; just as if two companies agree to a contract which includes "arbitration by merchant court" it should be mediated in precisely the fashion agreed to. (For those with access, this is a fascinating piece on how medieval businesses came to agree on 'private' courts for settling disputes)

So, should people be allowed, when engaging in private contracts, to decide on a private arbiter?
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SolInvictus
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We already allow Jewish courts a far great role..... just look at the Bnai Brith. This is perfectly acceptable. Its just another form of arbitration with different rules.
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UniOfLife
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(Original post by SolInvictus)
We already allow Jewish courts a far great role..... just look at the Bnai Brith. This is perfectly acceptable. Its just another form of arbitration with different rules.
Jewish courts arbitrate on financial matters in line with English law - ie because English law allows disputing parties to choose whichever arbiter they want. They also act in civil matters of marriage and death etc. Muslims can do this too right now without any new laws as the laws allowing them are in place - they're the same laws that the Jewish courts use. What's the problem?

Also, isn't Bnei Brith a youth group?
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HodHod
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As heard in the new:

As long as it doesnt interfere with English law then its okay, it will be beneficial for British Muslims.
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ConservativeNucleophile
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It's fine to use Sharia to resolve civil disputes between consenting adults. It has no place in criminal law, however.
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Paxdax
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Damn, the world is too small. Feels like it's just a matter of time before full Sharia Law is introduced everywhere in Europe.

Off to the US!
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Varsity
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(Original post by ConservativeNucleophile)
It's fine to use Sharia to resolve civil disputes between consenting adults. It has no place in criminal law, however.
Exactly right in my book!

People need to stop being scared of Sharia, especially when its something as simple as this.
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mendelssohn
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(Original post by ConservativeNucleophile)
It's fine to use Sharia to resolve civil disputes between consenting adults. It has no place in criminal law, however.
agreed. +1.
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CHAMON
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I'd go as far as to say, let them bring shariah in and the hand cutting would go down a treat. Look at the rise in knife crime. hack the hands off. UK is too soft on *****!
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ConservativeNucleophile
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(Original post by CHAMON)
I'd go as far as to say, let them bring shariah in and the hand cutting would go down a treat. Look at the rise in knife crime. hack the hands off. UK is too soft on *****!
Admittedly, there are very low rates of theft in Saudi Arabia for exactly this reason, but even I would be weary of something like that. Even though I support capital punishment under a Western judicial system, the Saudis' fetish for head/hand chopping is a bit too gruesome for me.
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CHAMON
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(Original post by ConservativeNucleophile)
Admittedly, there are very low rates of theft in Saudi Arabia for exactly this reason, but even I would be weary of something like that. Even though I support capital punishment under a Western judicial system, the Saudis' fetish for head/hand chopping is a bit too gruesome for me.
It's there for a reason, if one want's to keep head/hands, behave. - Simple eh
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skillipedia
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When i look at those two French students who have been killed in their prime, I hope Sharia replaces the current UK INEFFECTIVE law.
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SolInvictus
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(Original post by UniOfLife)
Jewish courts arbitrate on financial matters in line with English law - ie because English law allows disputing parties to choose whichever arbiter they want. They also act in civil matters of marriage and death etc. Muslims can do this too right now without any new laws as the laws allowing them are in place - they're the same laws that the Jewish courts use. What's the problem?

Also, isn't Bnei Brith a youth group?
I meant the Beth Din...... yeah you're right, the other one is a youth group.... I had a moment of ethnic inspiration there.

I was just saying that the Beth Din does a good job of engaging in arbitration, and that if it is allowed to act as a voluntary 3rd party arbirator then why would a sharia court for civil matters be any different?
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34253
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(Original post by skillipedia)
When i look at those two French students who have been killed in their prime, I hope Sharia replaces the current UK INEFFECTIVE law.
I think this might just be a troll, either way Sharia Law hasn't done much to turn around the backwards S holes where it is the criminal law.
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UniOfLife
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(Original post by SolInvictus)
I meant the Beth Din...... yeah you're right, the other one is a youth group.... I had a moment of ethnic inspiration there.

I was just saying that the Beth Din does a good job of engaging in arbitration, and that if it is allowed to act as a voluntary 3rd party arbirator then why would a sharia court for civil matters be any different?
It wouldn't. But I don't know why they cannot have these courts already as the laws allowing 3rd party arbitration are already in place. So either this is just a lot of talk about nothing or else they mean to implement something more.
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SolInvictus
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(Original post by UniOfLife)
It wouldn't. But I don't know why they cannot have these courts already as the laws allowing 3rd party arbitration are already in place. So either this is just a lot of talk about nothing or else they mean to implement something more.
Its more a whole lot of talk about nothing, I feel. Unfortunately arbitraton use a recognised party and system, and due to the highly decentralised and disorganised nature of Sharia, there is no such established institution. I think Muslims are simply seeking approval and the formation of such a court.
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jacketpotato
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(Original post by ConservativeNucleophile)
Admittedly, there are very low rates of theft in Saudi Arabia for exactly this reason, but even I would be weary of something like that. Even though I support capital punishment under a Western judicial system, the Saudis' fetish for head/hand chopping is a bit too gruesome for me.
There are very low reported and recorded rates of theft in Saudi. I suspect the actual figure is not as low as you might think.

As long as the state has no interest in the dispute, I don't have a problem with it. It is fine as a private method of solving disputes between two individuals, as long as the issue only affects those two individuals. As soon as a third party is affected, and that third party has a legitimate interest in the dispute and that third party has not consented to Sharia law being applied, then I think the matter should go to the English courts.
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Prince Rhyus
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Where are the safeguards in ensuring that any Sharia rulings on civil/financial matters don't discriminate against certain groups of people? That goes for all other "religious" courts - who monitors arbitration and is there recourse to appeal?
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UniOfLife
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(Original post by Prince Rhyus)
Where are the safeguards in ensuring that any Sharia rulings on civil/financial matters don't discriminate against certain groups of people? That goes for all other "religious" courts - who monitors arbitration and is there recourse to appeal?
There is no recourse to appeal because arbitration must be with the consent of both parties. Once consent is given they agree to be bound by whatever decision the arbiter makes. If a party wishes not to use a certain arbiter they cannot be forced to.
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ForeverIsMyName
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(Original post by skillipedia)
When i look at those two French students who have been killed in their prime, I hope Sharia replaces the current UK INEFFECTIVE law.
Yes, because under Sharia law, no one gets burnt alive.
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