Inequality In Real Life? Watch

affinity89
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Having read through, and attempted to reason with, the many posts on the 'Should Women Earn As Much As Men?' thread, I am personally shocked by the ideas expressed.

There seems to be some very unliberal views - that women do not work as hard, that women don't deserve to earn like for like in like for like jobs because they have children, that women are a risk for businesses etc.

I am not starting the thread again or anything - far from it.

It seems that everytime a female states everyone should have equality they are shot down as a 'feminist'. Surely seeking equality is a sensible and humane desire as we are equal - no one is better than anyone else, regardless of their age, gender or ethnic background.

So, I am curious to know if you have encountered such bias in real life - from friends, family, employers etc. And, if you have, how you have overcome it.
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River85
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Such views (and ignorance) is quite common on TSR. See recent threads on the poor, the unemployed, council tennants and people with disabilities.
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Blue Rose
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(Original post by affinity89)
Having read through, and attempted to reason with, the many posts on the 'Should Women Earn As Much As Men?' thread, I am personally shocked by the ideas expressed.

There seems to be some very unliberal views - that women do not work as hard, that women don't deserve to earn like for like in like for like jobs because they have children, that women are a risk for businesses etc.

I am not starting the thread again or anything - far from it.

It seems that everytime a female states everyone should have equality they are shot down as a 'feminist'. Surely seeking equality is a sensible and humane desire as we are equal - no one is better than anyone else, regardless of their age, gender or ethnic background.

So, I am curious to know if you have encountered such bias in real life - from friends, family, employers etc. And, if you have, how you have overcome it.
I'm just as shocked. Some people have some really twisted views and frankly I pity them and anyone who encounters them because it's not going to do themselves any good or anyone that makes their aquaintance.
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blahbloo
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Went to this shop Zavvi, I don't know if it's meant to be male-orietated shop but every single worker there was male- 15 workers, all of them male. Didnt bother to give my CV into the shop, of course. Waste of time. :p:


Inequality still exists...just not as obvious. Dont think you can combat it 100% no matter how hard everyone tries.
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chr15chr15
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women should be paid the same as a man for doing equal amounts of work!
however problems arise when you consider pregnancy! many employers see this as this women doing less work which it technically is!
the one thing that is not acceptable is women being paid more than men, in comparison to the amount of work they do, like is the current situation in wimbledon!
you may argue that women were paid less for centuries and until last century this was commonplace! but it doesn't make it right to swing the balance the other way!
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qgujxj39
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(Original post by affinity89)
There seems to be some very unliberal views - that women do not work as hard, that women don't deserve to earn like for like in like for like jobs because they have children, that women are a risk for businesses etc.
I think that the bit in bold is the crux of the matter. My dad part-owns a small business (well, not really a business, but they're in control of their own finance) and he employed a female secretary. She got pregnant, and took her full entitlement of time off. Not only did he have to keep paying her, he also had to employ someone else to cover her, and it ended up costing him several thousands of pounds out of his own pocket. Employing women is a huge risk for small businesses like this, and no sensible business owner would employ many women who are likely to bear children under the current system. I'm not saying whether this is morally right or wrong, but it's the ****ing truth, and it's what's actually happening.
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eDDeboo
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I thought that they get paid the same, but men get promoted to higher positions more often so that brings up the average pay.. I agree that anyone doing the same job should have the same pay, but I also agree that it isn't wrong to promote a man over a woman if they're of equal skill or if she's just a bit better because she's more likely to take time off for maternity then come back and work less days etc.
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anonymous1432
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Women get the same pay as men at Wimbledon for 2/5 of the work. Nuff said:rolleyes:
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34253
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(Original post by tommm)
I think that the bit in bold is the crux of the matter. My dad part-owns a small business (well, not really a business, but they're in control of their own finance) and he employed a female secretary. She got pregnant, and took her full entitlement of time off. Not only did he have to keep paying her, he also had to employ someone else to cover her, and it ended up costing him several thousands of pounds out of his own pocket. Employing women is a huge risk for small businesses like this, and no sensible business owner would employ many women who are likely to bear children under the current system. I'm not saying whether this is morally right or wrong, but it's the ****ing truth, and it's what's actually happening.
Exactly, for most small time employers if you have a male and a female candidate apply the woman has to be worth that extra money she's going to cost one day, if she isn't it's common sense to employ the male.
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qgujxj39
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(Original post by timwaters2007)
Women get the same pay as men at Wimbledon for 2/5 of the work. Nuff said:rolleyes:
That's a poor argument, as they both train just as hard as each other. The argument should be, if there was actual equality, then WHY THE **** do they have separate tournaments for men and women? If there was true equality, there would just be one tournament, open to men and women, and they both get equal opportunities to play in that.
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Bornstubborn
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I have noticed a shocking amount of ineqaulity in real life. I have noticed men get the short end of the stick in reality.
I think there is a culture of men should put up with it and anything else is being weak.

This sort of ineqaulity can be seen in schools where girls are looked after by the majority female teachers whereas the boys are villanised.

In law women are often seen as innocent or as victims where as men are again villanised. For example if there was a fight between a man and a woman instigated by the woman, the man would most certainly get treated worse.

In the civil courts the law favours women in a huge way often giving assets and children to the women just because of a culture of helping women.

In the NHS where breast cancer is considered a huge priority whereas bowel cancer which kills more men than women are killed by breast cancer is seen as less important.

In employment, men have to work an extra five years for their pension.

In insurance, men have to pay a higher rate of insurance simple for being men. If this was a policy against women i am sure the government would step in.

In war men are conscripted into the army, wheras there is no form of conscription for women.

The list seriously goes on and on. When can we end the unspoken discrimination against men!
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Quady
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[QUOTE=blahbloo]Went to this shop Zavvi, I don't know if it's meant to be male-orietated shop but every single worker there was male- 15 workers, all of them male. Didnt bother to give my CV into the shop, of course. Waste of time. :p: [QUOTE]

OK... so you decided not to apply because your a woman and you saw guys working there? Don't you think thats a little silly. What if all women did that, what would happen? An all male working environment. You just shot your own arguement in the foot. If women don't apply of course its gonna be all male!
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Quady
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Yes there are areas of inequality still. I hate going to restraunts (sorry cant spell) because I get given the wine I don't like to taste and I get given the bill! couldnt they just leave it on the table...

Adverts and gameshows are still sexist too...
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affinity89
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(Original post by rnd)
I'm not disagreeing with you generally but what do you mean when you say "we are all equal" ?
I mean ever human being is equal regardless of their gender, age etc. In moral terms, no person is better than another. Clearly, in relation to jobs qualifications, experience and skills make one applicant "better" than another for that role but that doesn't mean they are "better" in general life. If you know what I mean.

Hence you are worth just as much as a bus driver or a doctor in human terms.
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theredwindmill
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I can't believe how much inequality there really is. I think there are cases on both sides for men and women. But at least it is better than it used to be, or was when women was considered to be the devil. I'd drather be alive today in terms of equality rather than 20 years ago
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Quady
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Why make the distinction of all human beings are equal? Why are rat catchers allowed?

We clearly arn't all equal, old people get pensions to equalise them with the rest of society. Same with people with disabilities which prevent them from working.
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affinity89
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(Original post by Bornstubborn)
I have noticed a shocking amount of ineqaulity in real life. I have noticed men get the short end of the stick in reality.
I think there is a culture of men should put up with it and anything else is being weak.

This sort of ineqaulity can be seen in schools where girls are looked after by the majority female teachers whereas the boys are villanised.

In law women are often seen as innocent or as victims where as men are again villanised. For example if there was a fight between a man and a woman instigated by the woman, the man would most certainly get treated worse.

In the civil courts the law favours women in a huge way often giving assets and children to the women just because of a culture of helping women.

In the NHS where breast cancer is considered a huge priority whereas bowel cancer which kills more men than women are killed by breast cancer is seen as less important.

In employment, men have to work an extra five years for their pension.

In insurance, men have to pay a higher rate of insurance simple for being men. If this was a policy against women i am sure the government would step in.

In war men are conscripted into the army, wheras there is no form of conscription for women.

The list seriously goes on and on. When can we end the unspoken discrimination against men!
I don't agree with the military but that is a different issue.

Pensions are changing - in the not to distant future (our generation for example) will be working until our 70s if things carry on the way they are. And, as has always been the case, those who can afford to will still retire earlier than the state age. It varies. For example, in the police service, you have to work a set number of years (I think it is 35 but I'd have to check to be sure) for both men and women before they get the full pension.

I agree that in some areas things are biased in the favour of women but that doesn't mean there aren't equal number of things biased in favour or men. The fact you ended your post with "when can we end the unspoken discrimination against men" implies that you think we should tackle male discrimination above female discrimination. I on the other hand think all discrimination should be stopped - be it gender, ethnic background etc discrimination.
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Quady
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(Original post by theredwindmill)
But at least it is better than it used to be, or was when women was considered to be the devil. I'd drather be alive today in terms of equality rather than 20 years ago

I get what your saying but 20 years ago Mrs T was prime minister.
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WithFlyingColours
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It seems that everytime a female states everyone should have equality they are shot down as a 'feminist'. Surely seeking equality is a sensible and humane desire as we are equal - no one is better than anyone else, regardless of their age, gender or ethnic background.
It's because, as much as you may deny it, things are more than fair for women already. Why do they want to keep taking? If women's priorities were the same as men's, women would get paid 27% more than men.

I see a hell of a lot of inequality, and it's against those who have no one to stand up for them - men.
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theredwindmill
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(Original post by Quady)
I get what your saying but 20 years ago Mrs T was prime minister.
exactly although she did do alot in terms of equality by becoming the first women prime minster. Well ok then in the 50's or even further back where it was expected that women are going to marry and be nice little obidient housewives, good for those who want that but not for me.
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