VR48 – Ministerial Report from the Education Secretary Watch

Poll: Should the contents of this Ministerial Report be implemented?
As many as are of the opinion, aye. (19)
41.3%
On the contrary, nay. (21)
45.65%
Abstain. (6)
13.04%
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Andrew97
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#1
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#1
R48, Ministerial Report from the Secretary of State for Education





Her Majesty's Government will no longer be publishing, or endorsing the publishing of online league tables to rank schools, colleges and multi academy trusts.

The government believes that there is no conclusive methodology to establish whether one school is objectively better than another, and recognises that different schools are suited to different children.* This government encourages parents and prospective children to visit primary and secondary schools to help parents to decide which may be best for their children.

The government does not subscribe to the view that the selection of a primary or secondary school ought to be done using something as reductionist as data-based ranking.*

Parents, journalists and other non-governmental organisations will have the right to access all of the data used to compile league tables, and will continue to have access to inspection reports of schools. All public data used in calculating league tables for schools and colleges will be made available on the government website.

Should they wish, parents, journalists and other organisations may use this data to produce their own ranking of institutions. These will not be endorsed by this government or any local authority.

The July 2019 Statement of Intent on School and College league tables is hereby repealed.

I commend this statement to the house.
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The Mogg
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#2
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#2
Although I feel people were blowing this out of proportion when stressing the severity of the consequences of such a report being implemented, I see little point in it, and have thus voted Nay.
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ns_2
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(Original post by The Mogg)
Although I feel people were blowing this out of proportion when stressing the severity of the consequences of such a report being implemented, I see little point in it, and have thus voted Nay.
Hear, hear.

This MR simply removes a valuable piece of information from the broad view, instead hiding it away for seemingly no genuine reason.
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Glaz
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#4
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#4
Sounds good :yy:
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JMR2019.
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#5
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#5
Aye
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Baron of Sealand
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#6
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#6
Just to say that I'm sending this to the division to make sure that government policies are scrutinized.
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Bailey14
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#7
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Aye
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snazzy viking
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#8
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#8
See no problem with the current law

nay
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04MR17
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#9
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#9
(Original post by ns_2)
Hear, hear.

This MR simply removes a valuable piece of information from the broad view, instead hiding it away for seemingly no genuine reason.
This is misleading, no information is removed at all and anyone with the basic ability to use an internet search engine will be able to easily find the same information - if you would like those physically unable to use google to be deciding what schools children go to then I do worry about your views.
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04MR17
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#10
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(Original post by snazzy viking)
See no problem with the current law

nay
Problems with the status quo are listed in the OP, and this item isn't actually a point of law as it's not a bill: just a point of government practice
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AngryRedhead
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#11
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#11
Abstain
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ns_2
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#12
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#12
(Original post by 04MR17)
This is misleading, no information is removed at all and anyone with the basic ability to use an internet search engine will be able to easily find the same information - if you would like those physically unable to use google to be deciding what schools children go to then I do worry about your views.
"no longer publishing" = withholding information = removal vis-a-vis status quo.
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04MR17
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(Original post by ns_2)
"no longer publishing" = withholding information = removal vis-a-vis status quo.
erm, no?
No longer publishing simply means the information will not be presented in the same form, not that any information is being withheld. I'm struggling to work out what part of this is confusing here...
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ns_2
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(Original post by 04MR17)
erm, no?
No longer publishing simply means the information will not be presented in the same form, not that any information is being withheld. I'm struggling to work out what part of this is confusing here...
The current format of publication is a table form, which can be sorted and filtered using a number of variables including Progress 8 scores.

I do not see what this MR changes - barring the complete non-publication of this table: in which case, my point stands.

If this MR simply means there is no one single collated table, then you are simply passing on the burden to parents which is unacceptable.
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04MR17
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#15
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#15
(Original post by ns_2)
The current format of publication is a table form, which can be sorted and filtered using a number of variables including Progress 8 scores.

I do not see what this MR changes - barring the complete non-publication of this table: in which case, my point stands.

If this MR simply means there is no one single collated table, then you are simply passing on the burden to parents which is unacceptable.
Your point really doesn't stand, no information is being removed, only changed.

I am unsure what you mean by burden, do you expect that parents should be using data to decide the best place for their child?
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ns_2
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#16
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#16
(Original post by 04MR17)
Your point really doesn't stand, no information is being removed, only changed.

I am unsure what you mean by burden, do you expect that parents should be using data to decide the best place for their child?
So, if you are 'no longer publishing league tables', what will you be publishing and in what format?
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04MR17
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#17
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#17
(Original post by ns_2)
So, if you are 'no longer publishing league tables', what will you be publishing and in what format?
"All public data used in calculating league tables for schools and colleged will be made available on the government website." So all of the same data (if not more) will be published. This will likely be a mixture between downloadable .pdf and .xml files.
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ns_2
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#18
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(Original post by 04MR17)
"All public data used in calculating league tables for schools and colleged will be made available on the government website." So all of the same data (if not more) will be published. This will likely be a mixture between downloadable .pdf and .xml files.
So, my point stands: you are hiding it away for seemingly no genuine reason; if parents wish to make an informed decision on the educational prospects of their children, they must take into account all the available data - it is not for government to say whether or not a parent should 'weigh' a school's GCSE results more or less than the general 'environment'. It is the role of government to ensure that all schools continue to improve through regular and transparent OFSTED inspections - the results of which must be made public in line with other variables in an accessible form.
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04MR17
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#19
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#19
(Original post by ns_2)
So, my point stands: you are hiding it away for seemingly no genuine reason; if parents wish to make an informed decision on the educational prospects of their children, they must take into account all the available data - it is not for government to say whether or not a parent should 'weigh' a school's GCSE results more or less than the general 'environment'. It is the role of government to ensure that all schools continue to improve through regular and transparent OFSTED inspections - the results of which must be made public in line with other variables in an accessible form.
Nothing is being hidden, again.

Parents wishing to make an informed decision can only do so (in my view) when they can see all of the data and can recognise what they see as more important as statistical factors. Rather than have the government decide how each measure should be weighted to produce this league table. I find it incredibly ironic that you oppose the government deciding things for parents then vote supporting exactly that.

School improvement has nothing to do with a league tables.
Last edited by 04MR17; 4 weeks ago
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ns_2
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(Original post by 04MR17)
Nothing is being hidden, again.

Parents wishing to make an informed decision can only do so (in my view) when they can see all of the data and can recognise what they see as more important as statistical factors. Rather than have the government decide how each measure should be weighted to produce this league table. I find it incredibly ironic that you oppose the government deciding things for parents then vote supporting exactly that.

School improvement has nothing to do with a league tables.
The government does not 'weigh' measures to produce league tables: the parent must sort by a given factor.

If you have an issue with government complied figures e.g. Progress 8 and the EBacc, address that then.
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