MP's back Boris Johnson's brexit plan Watch

Rock Fan
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50870939
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ByEeek
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Interesting that the clause calling for workers rights to be strengthen has been removed. Smells of Tories left right and centre.
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Gundabad(good)
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The Tories are strong and will get Brexit done.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Interesting that the clause calling for workers rights to be strengthen has been removed. Smells of Tories left right and centre.
And the one for asylum seekers unaccompanied children.

End of the day, remainer parliamentarians in the last parliament should of voted in May's deal as they claimed they wanted and was elected to do.
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Burton Bridge)
End of the day, remainer parliamentarians in the last parliament should of voted in May's deal as they claimed they wanted and was elected to do.
Agreed. The mistake Boris is making is rushing through a free trade agreement with the EU. Worst case for everyone is we crash out amidst total chaos, or alternatively leavers will feel let down as a rushed compromise agreement waters down many of the things folks like yourself hold dear. Canada took 8 years to negotiate. How we can do the same in 11 months is beyond me.
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the bear
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strong and stable Government is already working
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ColinDent
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Agreed. The mistake Boris is making is rushing through a free trade agreement with the EU. Worst case for everyone is we crash out amidst total chaos, or alternatively leavers will feel let down as a rushed compromise agreement waters down many of the things folks like yourself hold dear. Canada took 8 years to negotiate. How we can do the same in 11 months is beyond me.
Mainly because the EU have never relied on Canadian dollars to prop the whole project up.
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ColinDent
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Not had too much response to this on another thread so I'll try it here.
This is what's happened in simple, easy to understand terms, remainers you have lost and quite correctly the terms are now being set by the winning side.

https://youtu.be/JZJ9Q8i5XuE
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ByEeek
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(Original post by ColinDent)
Mainly because the EU have never relied on Canadian dollars to prop the whole project up.
So that is why it took 8 years? Or maybe it took 8 years because trade deals are really really complex. Where do you stand on the exporting of fluorapatite for example?
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DSilva
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(Original post by ColinDent)
Not had too much response to this on another thread so I'll try it here.
This is what's happened in simple, easy to understand terms, remainers you have lost and quite correctly the terms are now being set by the winning side.

https://youtu.be/JZJ9Q8i5XuE
The terms are being set by the winning side. My only point here is that this new law preventing any extension really has no legal effect. Its a poltical move, not a legal one. It's symbolism rather than anything substantive.

Because if Johnson for whatever reason decided we needed an extension, he could and would repeal the law as easily as he made it. If for whatever reason we had an early election and Johnson lost, his successor could also repeal it.

It's a bit like when Osborne passed a law mandating we must have a budget surplus. It was legally worthless.

My question is, what does this law actually achieve in a substantive sense?
Last edited by DSilva; 3 weeks ago
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ColinDent
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(Original post by DSilva)
The terms are being set by the winning side. My only point here is that this new law preventing any extension really has no legal effect. Its a poltical move, not a legal one. It's symbolism rather than anything substantive.

Because if Johnson for whatever reason decided we needed an extension, he could and would repeal the law as easily as he made it. If for whatever reason we had an early election and Johnson lost, his successor could also repeal it.

It's a bit like when Osborne passed a law mandating we must have a budget surplus. It was legally worthless.

My question is, what does this law actually achieve in a substantive sense?
Did you watch the video? It's all about the wording, very clever stuff.
There's not going to be another election and why would he reppeal
Last edited by ColinDent; 3 weeks ago
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DSilva
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(Original post by ColinDent)
Did you watch the video? It's all about the wording, very clever stuff.
There's not going to be another election and why would he reppeal
That's exactly the point though. Boris Johnson is the only person who could ask for an extension and he's not going to.

So what does making a law to that effect achieve? It just prevents him doing something he was never in a million years going to do anyway. Its symbolism, like Osbornes budget surplus law.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Agreed. The mistake Boris is making is rushing through a free trade agreement with the EU. Worst case for everyone is we crash out amidst total chaos, or alternatively leavers will feel let down as a rushed compromise agreement waters down many of the things folks like yourself hold dear. Canada took 8 years to negotiate. How we can do the same in 11 months is beyond me.
We agree on something :knuddel:

Canada was not a member of the EU with complete alignment on everything when negotiations started.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by ColinDent)
Mainly because the EU have never relied on Canadian dollars to prop the whole project up.
That as well lol ByEeek
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Burton Bridge)
We agree on something :knuddel:

Canada was not a member of the EU with complete alignment on everything when negotiations started.
Agreed. But going from everything to something still means a line by line negociation. After all, what is in and what is out. And if you want that, perhaps you must have the other as well. Anyone who tells you it will be easy and quick is lying. To get a deal through quickly will require massive concessions on our side. After all, the EU didn't pass a law making a hard deadline and they hold all the cards.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by DSilva)
That's exactly the point though. Boris Johnson is the only person who could ask for an extension and he's not going to.

So what does making a law to that effect achieve? It just prevents him doing something he was never in a million years going to do anyway. Its symbolism, like Osbornes budget surplus law.
The only thing it achieves is strengthens the negotiation hand of the UK and limits power if renainer parliamentarians who did so much harm in the previous parliament.
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DSilva
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(Original post by Burton Bridge)
The only thing it achieves is strengthens the negotiation hand of the UK and limits power if renainer parliamentarians who did so much harm in the previous parliament.
But the MPs only had power in the last Parliament because they had the numbers to outvote the PM. Now they don't. Which makes the law pointless and just a political gimmick. Also, if somehow a huge number of Tory MPs decided to back an extension, then they would have the votes to repeal this law anyway.

Johnson would never ask for an extension anyway, and the MPs cannot force him to. In legal terms, it's worthless.
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Burton Bridge
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(Original post by DSilva)
But the MPs only had power in the last Parliament because they had the numbers to outvote the PM. Now they don't. Which makes the law pointless and just a political gimmick. Also, if somehow a huge number of Tory MPs decided to back an extension, then they would have the votes to repeal this law anyway.

Johnson would never ask for an extension anyway, and the MPs cannot force him to. In legal terms, it's worthless.
Agreed for the most, its largely a flex my muscles bill. But it does strengthen the hand of our negotiating team, which makes a good deal more likely
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DSilva
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(Original post by Burton Bridge)
Agreed for the most, its largely a flex my muscles bill. But it does strengthen the hand of our negotiating team, which makes a good deal more likely
I think over the next few years we are going to see a lot of these gimmicks and empty flexing.

Hopefully people will start to see through it.
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UGP1023
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Since brexit is officially happening soon, is it gonna affect upcoming international students? Who starts September 2020
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