Scrap the Royal Family Watch

CTLeafez
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#41
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#41
I do find the notion of being born into a particular family makes you superior to everyone else a tad medieval.

The fact the monarchy rules via ‘Divine Right’ also seems a tad strange for the 21st century. Imagine if a CEO one day said he’d been chosen by God to run this company. You’d laugh and be rather concerned...

However, I don’t believe the monarchy should be dissolved before the Queen dies. She’s served this country for nearly 70 years and shouldn’t be usurped.

I do believe the main factor holding the monarchy together is the Queen. Once she passes away I imagine support for its dissolution will increase.
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ByEeek
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#42
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
I disagree. I think minority governments and hung parliaments are dangerous plus toxic. They are blocked at every turn that the outcome tends to be nothing more than a zombie form of government.

Let us take two examples, Scotland and Wales.

Scotland is run by the SNP in a proportional representation system that is more like a committee than a proper government. Nobody really takes the blame and everyone tends to point fingers at everyone else. The SNP constantly gets dragged down because a policy is not favoured by the tories or a piece of legislation does not have sufficient focus on the rural highlands to receive Labour support. In the end, it is a slow treacle effect that keeps Scotland at the level it really is. It is one reason Scotland apparently has the highest level of debt in the UK.

Now, Wales is a bit different. It has a Labour majority in the Assembly but is dormant because it cannot really do much without proper support from central Government. In the end, whatever policies that the Labour majority proposes are meaningless, as the tories control the purse strings and wont budge for a second.

It is fine that you prefer a dead parliament with no actual direction. I don't want such. Brexit showed us the carnage that a hung parliament can do to the nation. Nothing worked and people pointed the finger at everyone else. I’d rather want a majority government than a minority one with the silly hope that they compromise like we are at prep school.

A Presidential system also has checks and balances but can be free to push their own agenda in certain ways. To show how bad the system is, Johnson made all new Tory MPs to affirm to support his Brexit deal to run as a candidate. Imagine, such a crazy thing happened in the US or Germany, we would be calling them dictators.
A good analysis that I agree. But perhaps rather than constantly pushing wholesale reform that rarely works or has any lasting impact in terms of improvement or cost cutting, perhaps governments should focus on incremental improvement?

Big policy changes like Hunts NHS reforms, Goves educational reforms and Dunvan-Smith's benefit reforms have cost billions, created huge workloads for those charged with implementing them and have achieved little or nothing. If anything things have got worse.

These reforms needed a government with a majority. Incremental changes could have made much more impact.
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Wired_1800
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#43
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(Original post by ByEeek)
A good analysis that I agree. But perhaps rather than constantly pushing wholesale reform that rarely works or has any lasting impact in terms of improvement or cost cutting, perhaps governments should focus on incremental improvement?

Big policy changes like Hunts NHS reforms, Goves educational reforms and Dunvan-Smith's benefit reforms have cost billions, created huge workloads for those charged with implementing them and have achieved little or nothing. If anything things have got worse.

These reforms needed a government with a majority. Incremental changes could have made much more impact.
That is fair, but i think incremental changes don't have significant impact and, sometimes, it is better to rip off the bandaid.

Having a majority government helps the country to move in a direction. It may not be the direction that is supported by you or me, but it is a direction. That is why we have one CEO, one Army General in charge of a mission or one President. Ruling by committee or consensus will slow things down or even impede progress because nobody bears responsibility.

Even the financial markets seem to support majority governments, as the Sterling rose on prediction of a majority government. Another hung parliament would have caused delays until Brexit got cancelled.
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ByEeek
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#44
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
That is fair, but i think incremental changes don't have significant impact and, sometimes, it is better to rip off the bandaid.
I disagree. I can't think of one major initiative put forward by a majority government that improved anything. Governments love wholesale reorganisation. But once you have rearranged all the deckchairs, nothing has actually changed.

There are many many examples of where wholesale rewrites of software have seen those companies fold. What we fail to appreciate is that all those so called sticking practice are actually learnings from lessons, small improvements in service providing and better ways of doing things. If you get rid of the sticking plasters and start from scratch all that learning is lost.
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Wired_1800
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#45
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(Original post by ByEeek)
I disagree. I can't think of one major initiative put forward by a majority government that improved anything. Governments love wholesale reorganisation. But once you have rearranged all the deckchairs, nothing has actually changed.

There are many many examples of where wholesale rewrites of software have seen those companies fold. What we fail to appreciate is that all those so called sticking practice are actually learnings from lessons, small improvements in service providing and better ways of doing things. If you get rid of the sticking plasters and start from scratch all that learning is lost.
We do need to learn from lessons but we need to have a government with the flexibility to push forward their agenda without being dragged down.

The Gove doctrine during his time as Education Secretary, I think, helped the sector. Yes, it was painful and was met with resistance, but I think it improved standards. I read somewhere that our cumulative performance in external rankings has risen after the changes introduced by Michael Gove.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...ation-50563833

https://www.google.com/amp/s/inews.c...-1330524%3famp
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BlueIndigoViolet
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#46
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If God forbid we become the Republic of England and Wales, would much rather a strong presidential system like that of France/America where the political system is much more stable yet powerful instead of a classroom with 650 kindergarteners and a teacher to govern 67 million people.
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Wired_1800
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#47
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(Original post by BlueIndigoViolet)
If God forbid we become the Republic of England and Wales, would much rather a strong presidential system like that of France/America where the political system is much more stable yet powerful instead of a classroom with 650 kindergarteners and a teacher to govern 67 million people.
A system more like china. One strong leader with sufficient power. JK.

On a serious note, we would need a President.
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BlueIndigoViolet
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#48
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#48
(Original post by CTLeafez)
I do find the notion of being born into a particular family makes you superior to everyone else a tad medieval.

The fact the monarchy rules via ‘Divine Right’ also seems a tad strange for the 21st century. Imagine if a CEO one day said he’d been chosen by God to run this company. You’d laugh and be rather concerned...

However, I don’t believe the monarchy should be dissolved before the Queen dies. She’s served this country for nearly 70 years and shouldn’t be usurped.

I do believe the main factor holding the monarchy together is the Queen. Once she passes away I imagine support for its dissolution will increase.
Only thing that makes me reconsider is the possibility of “Queen Camilla” *shudders in horror* 🤢🤮





Do think however it is a valued, historic institution like the other European monarchies and part of our identity as a nation at this point so would continue to support it, and suspect the British public overwhelmingly agrees, beyond the ramblings of overly optimistic politics students
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ByEeek
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#49
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
We do need to learn from lessons but we need to have a government with the flexibility to push forward their agenda without being dragged down.

The Gove doctrine during his time as Education Secretary, I think, helped the sector. Yes, it was painful and was met with resistance, but I think it improved standards. I read somewhere that our cumulative performance in external rankings has risen after the changes introduced by Michael Gove.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...ation-50563833

https://www.google.com/amp/s/inews.c...-1330524%3famp
Of course scores went up. All Gove did was realign the curriculum so that British kids taking PISA tests were better prepared. Countries at the top of the PISA tables coach their students for the test. So what does that actually tell us about standards?

The reality is that a third of students who do not achieve C or 4/5 are deemed to have failed by society and that figure of a third has remained largly unchanged in the last 30 years. All Gove did was get rid of all the vocational courses that favoured the bottom third. All students now have to take 100% exam based tests. He achieved nothing of any lasting or real substance but no doubt [email protected] off to the fact he managed to fudge Britain's position in an international standing that counts for nothing unless you are a tabloid editor looking for someone to shout at.
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Wired_1800
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#50
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Of course scores went up. All Gove did was realign the curriculum so that British kids taking PISA tests were better prepared. Countries at the top of the PISA tables coach their students for the test. So what does that actually tell us about standards?

The reality is that a third of students who do not achieve C or 4/5 are deemed to have failed by society and that figure of a third has remained largly unchanged in the last 30 years. All Gove did was get rid of all the vocational courses that favoured the bottom third. All students now have to take 100% exam based tests. He achieved nothing of any lasting or real substance but no doubt [email protected] off to the fact he managed to fudge Britain's position in an international standing that counts for nothing unless you are a tabloid editor looking for someone to shout at.
You may disagree and that is fine, but I think the realignment possibly did a lot for the kids that came through after the new system was introduced.

It is fine to disagree on what political system will be good for this country. I think the current system does need to change because there are many people left with no presentation even though they pay taxes and are full members of the country.

The US system has also seen some flaws with the election of Donald Trump and there are conversations there about the need for the electoral college system.
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EggyWeggyIII
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#51
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(Original post by borisj)
In the wake of 'Megxit' why do we have even a Royal Family anymore? The behaviour of Harry and Megs are an utter disgrace. They are 2 of the most privileged muppets in the entire country yet have the nerve to complain about media intrusion but just like his mother happy for the media when it suits them. I remember his mother talking about charitable causes then going for a £500 haircut, hmmm!!

So they talk about climate change telling us not to fly yet go on private jets every week, screw the lot of them and they think they can be financially sufficient LOLLLL

Couple that with Andrews fetish for young girls its high time the taxpayer didnt have to fund this bunch of idiots.

When talking about benefit scroungers this bunch are the biggest scroungers of them all, time to get rid of them asap.
Sadly they bring in more benefits than what we spend on them. The money alone through tourism is in the billions of pounds.

Harry and Meghan are idiots, Andrew needs to be in prison - all true. But to be honest, the rest of the senior royals like the Queen, Charles, William & Kate are all VERY good. Besides, the monarch plays a vital constitutional role which prevents corrupt governments or extremist ones from getting into power (like the nazis).

We should fund the senior royals but not people like Harry and Meghan or Andrew or Zara...
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Onde
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#52
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Half of them are not terrible and it's been a while since any of them actually killed anybody.

However, it is difficult for example to see why H & M should be allowed to keep a house that cost the taxpayer £2.4 million just to renovate it.

Although if I was giving a house that cost a tenth of that value, I admit I would be less likely to complain.
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ThuggerThugger
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#53
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Lol “Megixt” you white people are to damn funny
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learner38
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#54
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(Original post by ThuggerThugger)
Lol “Megixt” you white people are to damn funny
Frrr
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ByEeek
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#55
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
You may disagree and that is fine, but I think the realignment possibly did a lot for the kids that came through after the new system was introduced.
Of course it did. It favoured those who excel in exams whilst those predisposed to coursework lost out. Total net sum gain was zero. The grown up thing to do would have been to look at what tweeks and improvements can be made to a system that was already successful. Its a bit like replacing the athlete you have been training for 5 years because they are 1 second off the mark. Goves reforms will only last until the next major total reorganisation, probably in 5 or so years time, at which point I will probably leave the teaching profession just as many teachers left after Gove. The rule of thumb is that there is no such thing as a new idea in education. We are currently moving back towards a system that would have looked familiar to wealthy people in the 50s and 60s. That's progress kids!
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Wired_1800
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#56
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Of course it did. It favoured those who excel in exams whilst those predisposed to coursework lost out. Total net sum gain was zero. The grown up thing to do would have been to look at what tweeks and improvements can be made to a system that was already successful. Its a bit like replacing the athlete you have been training for 5 years because they are 1 second off the mark. Goves reforms will only last until the next major total reorganisation, probably in 5 or so years time, at which point I will probably leave the teaching profession just as many teachers left after Gove. The rule of thumb is that there is no such thing as a new idea in education. We are currently moving back towards a system that would have looked familiar to wealthy people in the 50s and 60s. That's progress kids!
So, as a teacher, you dont think your kids are better off with a more streamlined approach?
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
So, as a teacher, you dont think your kids are better off with a more streamlined approach?
No. Setting and streaming clearly benefits higher ability students but adversely affects lower ability students. And the higher ability students tend to be those with advantages in society provided by their parents. In other words, streaming benefits those who already have an advantage.

If schools exist to allow all students to reach their full potential, streaming is counterproductive.
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Wired_1800
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#58
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(Original post by ByEeek)
No. Setting and streaming clearly benefits higher ability students but adversely affects lower ability students. And the higher ability students tend to be those with advantages in society provided by their parents. In other words, streaming benefits those who already have an advantage.

If schools exist to allow all students to reach their full potential, streaming is counterproductive.
What do you think about Academies? Should we expand the Grammar school system? Do you think public schools should be abolished?
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ColinDent
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#59
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Personally I'm totally ambivalent towards the royal family, don't give a flying **** as to what they do.
The Royals lives are about as interesting and real as those on Love Island, Made in Chelsea and other such ****e
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
What do you think about Academies? Should we expand the Grammar school system? Do you think public schools should be abolished?
In the right hands academies are fine. Free of council spending limits they can borrow wisely. However, free of teaching legislation they can do what they like without checks and balances. Also, without central oversight centralised services like referal units, mental health and special needs have become disbanded and fragmented.

The grammar system helps only those rich enough or pushy enough to get their kids through the exam. Everyone else is a failure and go to mop up schools.

Public schools are fine but should not get the advantages of charitable status.
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