Will Brexit be good for Britain? Watch

DeesideEwan
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What do you think, can Britain make a success of leaving the E.U?
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ecolier
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(Original post by DeesideEwan)
What do you think, can Britain make a success of leaving the E.U?
Well it's happening whether we want it or not, and whether it will be good or not.

It's best to just try and make the best out of this situation.
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Ferrograd
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(Original post by DeesideEwan)
What do you think, can Britain make a success of leaving the E.U?
It can do, depends on who is leading it and ultimately we have an absolute muppet running Britain, so the chance of success is low. That is, if we don't sell out our country to go from being a member of the EU and having full voting rights etc to being the 51st state of the USA or some protectorate or colony, which looks entirely feasible
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Karisa96
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I personally think in the long term it will.

That said I think it will take between 18, months and 2 years before we notice things getting better. Just my opinion.
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Karisa96)
I personally think in the long term it will.

That said I think it will take between 18, months and 2 years before we notice things getting better. Just my opinion.
Do you mean like we noticed things better 18 months after the 2008 financial crisis we still haven't recovered from?

Brexit is just another step back. In 2 years time all you will notice is a step back in the right direction. We are a long way off being back to where we were in 2016 and even further from 2008. And if we jump into bed with the US as is looking ever more likely we are likely to go back even further as they shaft us for everything we have...


Unless you are a millionaire/ billionaire / friend of the government.
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SaucissonSecCy
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Regardless of how well it goes, the UK is over. United Ireland and independent Scotland a matter of time IMO.
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BlueIndigoViolet
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Not by any stretch in imagination but..... blue passports am i right or am i right?

It won't be the end of the world, but does come with economic losses certainly in the long term
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watershower
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i’m not sure. i suspect the UK will disband due to it, which is a shame because the english flag is quite ugly lmao
if something good is to come out of brexit, it will take place years after 2021 so we’ll have to wait and see.
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Rakas21
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(Original post by DeesideEwan)
What do you think, can Britain make a success of leaving the E.U?
The simple answer is that it depends on the actions taken over the next decade.

If the government signs up to full EU alignment and grants the EU long term control of British fisheries then the answer is no because they will maintain largely the status-quo bar signing a few trade deals (beneficial but not enough to counter reduced growth in trade with the EU).

If the government can keep out of obligations relating to state aid, tax and fisheries policy in addition to being imaginative enough to use Brexit as an excuse to change the economic structure of the country then yes, Brexit could prove to be a fantastic opportunity even if many of things done could be done as part of the EU (but require the political cover - British electorates are generally pretty adverse to significant change).

I'm somewhat optimistic but we will at least have a clue once the negotiations conclude and we see how much Boris surrenders.
(Original post by watershower)
i’m not sure. i suspect the UK will disband due to it, which is a shame because the english flag is quite ugly lmao
if something good is to come out of brexit, it will take place years after 2021 so we’ll have to wait and see.
While i was not going to rise to the bait (there's actually very little chance of Ireland uniting anytime in the next decade imo albeit i do accept my home and birth lands are at risk - Scotland) i would point out that Wales in either case will still remain a part of the United Kingdom. There is no evidence of any surge in the polls to Plaid or the Greens (indeed the Tories have broken their Welsh vote record in the past two elections).
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Captain Haddock
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(Original post by Rakas21)
The simple answer is that it depends on the actions taken over the next decade.

If the government signs up to full EU alignment and grants the EU long term control of British fisheries then the answer is no because they will maintain largely the status-quo bar signing a few trade deals (beneficial but not enough to counter reduced growth in trade with the EU).

If the government can keep out of obligations relating to state aid, tax and fisheries policy in addition to being imaginative enough to use Brexit as an excuse to change the economic structure of the country then yes, Brexit could prove to be a fantastic opportunity even if many of things done could be done as part of the EU (but require the political cover - British electorates are generally pretty adverse to significant change).

I'm somewhat optimistic but we will at least have a clue once the negotiations conclude and we see how much Boris surrenders.

While i was not going to rise to the bait (there's actually very little chance of Ireland uniting anytime in the next decade imo albeit i do accept my home and birth lands are at risk - Scotland) i would point out that Wales in either case will still remain a part of the United Kingdom. There is no evidence of any surge in the polls to Plaid or the Greens (indeed the Tories have broken their Welsh vote record in the past two elections).
In what universe will our fisheries be a deciding factor in whether or not Brexit is an economic success story?
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Rakas21
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(Original post by Captain Haddock)
In what universe will our fisheries be a deciding factor in whether or not Brexit is an economic success story?
I admit that was an exaggeration, it has little impact outside of fishing communities.
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ByEeek
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(Original post by Captain Haddock)
In what universe will our fisheries be a deciding factor in whether or not Brexit is an economic success story?
Agreed. We get bleary eyed over our fish because of that time when the fish industry was a force to be reckoned with. That was before we over fished and mismanaged our stocks before we allowed the EU to over fish and mismanage our stocks. But either way we are only walking about 12 miles offshore and 90% of the fish we catch there is sold to the EU. Brexit could be the final straw for UK fishing if the EU imposed tarrifs on imported fish.
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MonkeyChunks
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(Original post by Ferrograd)
It can do, depends on who is leading it and ultimately we have an absolute muppet running Britain, so the chance of success is low. That is, if we don't sell out our country to go from being a member of the EU and having full voting rights etc to being the 51st state of the USA or some protectorate or colony, which looks entirely feasible
What a ridiculous statement. The UK values independence, can make its own rules, and run its own ship perfectly well.
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MonkeyChunks
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Agreed. We get bleary eyed over our fish because of that time when the fish industry was a force to be reckoned with. That was before we over fished and mismanaged our stocks before we allowed the EU to over fish and mismanage our stocks. But either way we are only walking about 12 miles offshore and 90% of the fish we catch there is sold to the EU. Brexit could be the final straw for UK fishing if the EU imposed tarrifs on imported fish.
If they do that the continentals wont have the fish they want and we will impose tarrifs on their goods. And no, it is a lot more than 12 miles, it is 200. UK fishing waters after brexit
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fallen_acorns
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More likely for me is that no, it won't be good for Britain in the long-run.

I do think its possible to make a success of things in the next 10-20 years, but the world is becoming more and more connected, and looking at the way that power is balancing out in the world, a single connected Europe seems likes a necessity to me. My suspicion is that even if we manage to make a good go of it for the next few years, slowly we will be pulled back towards the EU and end up still bassically in it, even if not in name. Just look at the trend over the past 100 years.. they don't favour nations going out on their own, and individualism.. they point firmly towards closer and closer cooperation, the breakdown of the idea of single nations and borders, globalization and international business, international languages etc. We are becoming one, slowly (and painfully in some circumstnaces), and brexit is against the trend.

The EU will shift around and re-arrange itself quite a bit over the next 20-30 years, but we will find ourselves basically inside it, whether we like it or not eventually.
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MonkeyChunks
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
they point firmly towards closer and closer cooperation, the breakdown of the idea of single nations
The EU is trying to be a 'single nation', Brexit is breaking it down.


(Original post by fallen_acorns)
and borders, globalization and international business,
The UK has beeion doing that for a very long time, much much longer then most of Europe.

(Original post by fallen_acorns)
international languages etc.
English.

(Original post by fallen_acorns)
We are becoming one, slowly (and painfully in some circumstnaces), and brexit is against the trend.
Indeed, one with our fellow English speaking friends around the world.

(Original post by fallen_acorns)
The EU will shift around and re-arrange itself quite a bit over the next 20-30 years, but we will find ourselves basically inside it, whether we like it or not eventually.
I cant see it lasting to be honest, Denmark, Italy, France, Holland, are all fairly close to leaving.
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fallen_acorns
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(Original post by MonkeyChunks)
The EU is trying to be a 'single nation', Brexit is breaking it down.

Any group of nations that acts as a block takes on some of the characteristics of a single nation. My point is that this is happening more and more, and the trend is towards blocks and global cooperation, not away from it. The EU is recognising this, and has become somewhat less protectionist than it used to be, and will continue to make deals/work with other groups.

Sure on our own, you could argue that we could be even more globalist without being in the EU - and its true we could embrace globalisation even more, but that's exactly what the majority of Brexit voters didn't want. They didn't want to leave the EU to become more globalist, they left to do the opposite, which is emotionally what I support, but logically its never going to work. It goes entirely againts the global trend over the past 100 years.


The UK has beeion doing that for a very long time, much much longer then most of Europe.

Even for me as someone who likes to defend our historical legacy, that's a reach. Our legacy is a global one for sure.. but not one of peaceful cooperation, trading, boarder-less movement, equality/access etc, barrier-less communication/sharing of information etc.

English.

So? It doesn't stop it being an example of how the world is unifying itself, which is the context I used it in.


Indeed, one with our fellow English speaking friends around the world.

Not going to happen unfortunately. Its a nice idea, that all the nations we like and speak the same language as can form a new club that will work together.. but its a daydream. Outside of the EU we could be in a better possition to embrace the new global future than inside the EU, but that means embracing far more nations that are far more culturally dissimilar than we had while in the EU, which is the opposite of what most brexiteers want.

I cant see it lasting to be honest, Denmark, Italy, France, Holland, are all fairly close to leaving.

It will last, it will just reform itself to avoid collapse. Brexit is their wake-up call, and over the next 5-10 years we will see a re-think of how the EU functions to both avoid more nations leaving, and to entice the UK back in. Don't get me wrong, its not going to radically change.. but they will shift things around enough to quell the unrest.
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MonkeyChunks
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
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So, you think devolution is bad?

I think that we can act and work together in increasingly large groups, as you say, this is the natural run of things, however, this must not be forced!

So the English, Welsh and Scottish work together, despite our devolved Union. The EU would go the other way, increasing central control, regulation, and loss of regional autonomy.

I dont see that as progress, I see it as an ideology pushing a childish dream.

It is also undemocratic, protectionist, and economically stagnant.
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Doones
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(Original post by MonkeyChunks)
I cant see it lasting to be honest, Denmark, Italy, France, Holland, are all fairly close to leaving.
They really aren't.

Denmark: https://www.thelocal.dk/20190104/dan...cord-high-poll

And the others:
Name:  Screenshot 2020-01-29 at 10.36.56.jpg
Views: 50
Size:  155.3 KB

Source: https://www.kantar.com/public/our-th...ew-from-europe
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Doones
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(Original post by MonkeyChunks)
So, you think devolution is bad?

I think that we can act and work together in increasingly large groups, as you say, this is the natural run of things, however, this must not be forced!

So the English, Welsh and Scottish work together, despite our devolved Union. The EU would go the other way, increasing central control, regulation, and loss of regional autonomy.

I dont see that as progress, I see it as an ideology pushing a childish dream.

It is also undemocratic, protectionist, and economically stagnant.
If devolution is so important (and it is) why did the UK Government ignore the votes of Scotland, Wales and NI national parliaments to remain in the EU?

So the Gov wants the UK to "take back control", just not too much...
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