M583 - Use of the Whip in British Horse Racing Motion 2019 Watch

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SoggyCabbages
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#21
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#21
Nay the precautions already in place are suitable enough.
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abucha3
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#22
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#22
(Original post by The Mogg)
Just for the record, I never denied your commitment to the party. Of course as a party of 17 MPs we will have differing views, but I will say it's great to see you taking a more active role in producing items and debating them. I may not particularly agree with them but I hope to see them continue coming.
Thank you, and no it was Jammy that seemed to question
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abucha3
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#23
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#23
(Original post by LiberOfLondon)
Nay; the whip is foam padded and can only be used twice in a race.
Padded whips have a shock-absorbent layer between the inner spine and outer sleeve. The padding does not extend along the full shaft of the whip – only for about one-third of the whip’s length. The claim is that such a whip “will cause less pain and less damage to the body being struck” compared to a conventional whip, however there is no evidence to support this argument.

Padded whips do cause pain. Jockeys wouldn’t use them if they didn’t inflict some pain on the horse. A study found that in 64% of impacts, the unpadded part of the whip came in contact with the horse. It may be that jockeys are using the padded whip in a different way to overcome the possibility that it has less impact on the horse.
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abucha3
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#24
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#24
(Original post by SoggyCabbages)
Nay the precautions already in place are suitable enough.
(Original post by Saracen's Fez)
No, I don't think the use of a horse whip on horses is a great problem.
Why should we whip horses though? Unless to ensure their safety.
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shadowdweller
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#25
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#25
In full support of this.
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CatusStarbright
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#26
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#26
Well my friend would agree with this motion apparently, but I think I'll personally abstain on this. This seems like an area that requires an understanding and knowledge of the industry that I do not possess.
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SoggyCabbages
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#27
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#27
(Original post by abucha3)
Why should we whip horses though? Unless to ensure their safety.
To control naughty horses.
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abucha3
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#28
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#28
(Original post by CatusStarbright)
Well my friend would agree with this motion apparently, but I think I'll personally abstain on this. This seems like an area that requires an understanding and knowledge of the industry that I do not possess.
Listen to your friend
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Rakas21
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#29
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#29
Mr Speaker, i intend to abstain on this motion out of deference to my loyal and valued glorious Conservative colleague.

While i would ordinarily tend to side with the animals on most issues put before this House (i would extend your chicken bill to all poultry for example and have opposed the badger and fox hunting bills historically - bar once or twice when Jammy was a member of the party) i would actually be opposed to this. Although i accept that whipping in horse racing is somewhat 'cruel', it is a commercial sport for which horses are actually bred in many cases and the vast majority do not die of any injury they sustain from being whipped. Unlike threats to their lives, this motion for me would represent too much state intervention in horse racing.
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SankaraInBloom
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#30
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#30
I shan't back this, unfortunately. Whipping restrictions are in place - horses are treated better in racing stables than anywhere else.
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Jammy Duel
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#31
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#31
(Original post by abucha3)
Unsure why my commitment to the Conservative Party is being questioned. I have never suggested anything radical; a lot of environmental beliefs are actually in line with a lot of the work Gove did whilst at DEFRA.

I am also Shadow Environment Secretary, so this is my brief. The legislation brought forward on eggs was part of a manifesto commitment, which all TSR Conservative MPs stood on.

With regards to whipping of racing horses, it was based on an article I read the other day, and felt the matter warranted debate. You will notice I did not request for this to be submitted on behalf of the party, but as a private motion. I believe in animal welfare and looking after the animals on this planet, there is nothing wrong with that.

I would certainly never advocate veganism (by God I cannot stand some vegans), or should we ban horse racing or the slaughter of animals. I am just after a society where we conduct ourselves with animals in a more humane manner.
You don't advocate veganism and yet condemn others for not pretending they don't derive pleasure from the death of animals...

Why should we not ban horse racing if we're going to go on about animal rights?For instance in 2018 there were 202 horses killed while racing, so we humans can enjoy ourselves. You opt for going after the whipping of horses (ever been hit with a riding crop?) because 400 times somebody whipped too much but the fact that 200 horses were killed in 2018 isn't a problem, it's just the price of a afternoon of fun. Just as your fine with people raising cows just to be killed so you can enjoy a nice steak; raising sheep just to kill them so you can enjoy a nice haggis; raise chickens just to kill them so you can have a nice chicken tikka.

Morally you are no better with your choice consume animal products, have leather upholstery in your car, or go to the races where a horse dies every other day than I am in my choice to do all those things, and go on a hunt if I were able to; the only difference is I don't get on my high horse and pretend that somebody who chooses to do things where animals may get hurt I don't want to is some amoral pig because of that choice.
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Jammy Duel
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#32
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#32
(Original post by SankaraInBloom)
I shan't back this, unfortunately. Whipping restrictions are in place - horses are treated better in racing stables than anywhere else.
What about other equestrian sports?
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barnetlad
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#33
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#33
(Original post by SoggyCabbages)
To control naughty horses.
The horses probably don’t think they are naughty.
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barnetlad
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#34
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#34
(Original post by SankaraInBloom)
I shan't back this, unfortunately. Whipping restrictions are in place - horses are treated better in racing stables than anywhere else.
That doesn’t exclude even better treatment I think.
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SankaraInBloom
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#35
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#35
(Original post by Jammy Duel)
What about other equestrian sports?
Horses in equestrian stables are generally treated really well, I think it's broadly the same across the board.
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barnetlad
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#36
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#36
Apparently a whip can be used seven or eight times in a race. Not just to keep it on course.

https://www.britishhorseracing.com/regulation/the-whip/
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Jammy Duel
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#37
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#37
Why am I not surprised the proposer has disappeared
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snazzy viking
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#38
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#38
Like many of you all I am not a horse riding expert, but I don't think I need to be to know voting nay to this will be the right decision
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Andrew97
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#39
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#39
This item has entered cessation.
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Andrew97
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#40
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#40
Division, clear the lobby!
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