cf_99
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I've noticed that in the UK, a system of "predicted grades" is being used. I think that this seems really sketchy. It seems like these "predicted grades" can pulled out of no where. In Ireland such a system does not exist and offers are only made after the results come out. In fact, unis here have no prior knowledge of you whatsoever (ie they don't know about your mock results or Junior Cert/GCSE results). What do you think is fairer? The Irish one is far from perfect either, mind you.
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SarcAndSpark
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(Original post by cf_99)
I've noticed that in the UK, a system of "predicted grades" is being used. I think that this seems really sketchy. It seems like these "predicted grades" can pulled out of no where. In Ireland such a system does not exist and offers are only made after the results come out. In fact, unis here have no prior knowledge of you whatsoever (ie they don't know about your mock results or Junior Cert/GCSE results). What do you think is fairer? The Irish one is far from perfect either, mind you.
I saw an article recently that said about 1/3 predicted grades is actually correct. However, the UK system is trying to place considerably more students than the Irish system, and so needs a longer time to process applications. There are often conversations in the UK about moving to a post results offers system, but realistically this would mean unis starting their courses in January, which would require a huge shift.

So, the short answer is I think the Irish system is fairer, but not necessarily practical in the UK.
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PL1234
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(Original post by cf_99)
I've noticed that in the UK, a system of "predicted grades" is being used. I think that this seems really sketchy. It seems like these "predicted grades" can pulled out of no where. In Ireland such a system does not exist and offers are only made after the results come out. In fact, unis here have no prior knowledge of you whatsoever (ie they don't know about your mock results or Junior Cert/GCSE results). What do you think is fairer? The Irish one is far from perfect either, mind you.
Couldn’t agree more. I think it’s a ridiculous system that could favour schools who are more willing to gamble. My friend told me his school refused to bump up his grade dues to them predicting incorrectly too many times for students before which is completely unfair for him.
In addition for people who worked hard to achieve their grades and get predicted their ASs while others with inferior grades at their mocks get predicted the same. It can be sort of unfair and disheartening but then their grades could be hire due to previous work.
The whole system of accepting someone without ever seeing them also appears bizarre to me. I had 3 interview for my UCAS and felt that they made sense because they could tell what I was about even a little bit to make sure they didn’t make sense. Obviously there are constraints but maybe uni tests like the SAT (even that could be just as bad but that’s another rant) could offer a solution. I keep reading somewhere like 60% of students don’t meet their offer or something. Someone always posts the statistic and it proves how poor the system is.
Anyway it’s just my rambling apologies.
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Realitysreflexx
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(Original post by PL1234)
Couldn’t agree more. I think it’s a ridiculous system that could favour schools who are more willing to gamble. My friend told me his school refused to bump up his grade dues to them predicting incorrectly too many times for students before which is completely unfair for him.
The whole system of hiring someone without ever seeing them also appears bizarre to me. I had 3 interview for my UCAS and felt that they made sense because they could tell what I was about even a little bit to make sure they didn’t make sense. Obviously there are constraints but maybe uni tests like the SAT (even that could be just as bad but that’s another rant) could offer a solution. I keep reading somewhere like 60% of students don’t meet their offer or something. Someone always posts the statistic and it proves how poor the system is.
I doubt it's 60 percent.
Either way there isn't much competition for a uni place anyways... And there's no real harm in people missing their offers. Though the dutch system seems smarter. Where if you pass great, you can go to uni. If you flop at uni that's fair and your kicked out of that education stream for a while. But surely all systems have errors. Uni's could become more efficient at handling applications though. Or what should happen is A level results get marked much faster...like two to three weeks. Then you could create an application window from June to Mid September. With the amount going into clearing..

Uni's are already dealing with nearly 200,000 applicants in two weeks. So why not three months???
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anonymousmedic02
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Problem is, if schools bump them up and the student doesn’t achieve their firm (or their insurance) then it looks worse on the school so they tend to be pretty fair and if a pupil asks for them to be bumped up some schools say they have to do extra exams to show proof of their capabilities...
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cf_99
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Oh well, look. It's not fair to compare both systems as only 60000 people sit the Leaving Cert compared to like 5 times that number sitting the A-levels.

Although I would have thought that a less subjective system (like the points based CAO system in Ireland) would be more suited for a larger population than that requiring a personal statement and all. I think the points system is pretty awful because it doesn't take into account what subjects people do. I personally disagree with the notion of "soft" and "hard" subjects (believe me, I'd do far worse in Business or Religion, for example, than I do now in Physics or Applied Maths in spite of the latter two being considered "hard" subjects). However, a person could end up sitting the former two subjects when applying for an engineering degree and it would make absolutely no difference as all subjects are "equal" under the points system. It fosters a culture of regurgitation and learning off essays and all (which is 90% of a typical LC subject) and they could get into a course over someone who is better prepared.

Anyway, I think a predicted grades system will cause uproar here as the standard of teaching is so poor in Ireland that I don't think they'd be able to cope with that responsibility. Who knows, maybe in Britain, teachers have higher standards and so are able to cope with such responsibilities.
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PL1234
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(Original post by Realitysreflexx)
I doubt it's 60 percent.
Either way there isn't much competition for a uni place anyways... And there's no real harm in people missing their offers. Though the dutch system seems smarter. Where if you pass great, you can go to uni. If you flop at uni that's fair and your kicked out of that education stream for a while. But surely all systems have errors. Uni's could become more efficient at handling applications though. Or what should happen is A level results get marked much faster...like two to three weeks. Then you could create an application window from June to Mid September. With the amount going into clearing..

Uni's are already dealing with nearly 200,000 applicants in two weeks. So why not three months???
You're right it's not perfect but it is still good enough. And clearing would be hell for the last period, getting uni applications done before A levels is a good thing. What are your thoughts on an SAT type thing like in America?
I took the SAT i found it unbelievably idiotic (i might be a bit salty coz my score was not as good as I wanted it to be) but I thought the system does not determine the true best at maths because the bar is so low and that the English section was a pain.
Anyone else please feel free to answer.
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Realitysreflexx
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(Original post by PL1234)
You're right it's not perfect but it is still good enough. And clearing would be hell for the last period, getting uni applications done before A levels is a good thing. What are your thoughts on an SAT type thing like in America?
I took the SAT i found it unbelievably idiotic (i might be a bit salty coz my score was not as good as I wanted it to be) but I thought the system does not determine the true best at maths because the bar is so low and that the English section was a pain.
Anyone else please feel free to answer.
That's because the SAT is designed to test your focus also....your not used to sitting a really long multiple choice test. That is literally the basis of American study to put it mildly, i'm american so went through the school system. The UK is more essay based which is arguably harder and requires a much higher level of thinking. The fact you didn't get the score is simply inexperience in that format. When i went to school in the US from the third grade onward (age 8) we took end of year tests every year to see if we had reached the level of achievement required to pass. I regularly failed all my classes, then took the EOG test and was happily progressed to the next year lol. Because i was intelligent but couldn't be asked to do homework lol. I much prefer the UK system of education and think it's alot better, if you want to ace the SAT you need to practice the grind, it's not just about being smart/knowledge. A levels basically are UK style SAT's their just in the british format of needing to write essays and minimal multiple choice questions. Switching to the SAT would hence imo be pretty pointless.
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cf_99
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Oh I can't stand multiple choice tests. Thank God there is none for the Leaving Cert (except the music listening paper which is like 30% multiple choice, but it's so easy and sometimes there is more than one correct answer so for example, if there are three options, two of the answers could be correct thus awarded marks). Multiple choice is way harder overall since partial credit can be ridiculously generous in Maths (where you can get 4out of 5 marks for barely doing anything). The only problem is that certain subjects are really really pedantic as to what counts as definitions or explanations (cough Economics cough) meaning that you have to learn off the marking scheme in order to stand a chance. Multiple choice would be easier in those cases.
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PL1234
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(Original post by Realitysreflexx)
That's because the SAT is designed to test your focus also....your not used to sitting a really long multiple choice test. That is literally the basis of American study to put it mildly, i'm american so went through the school system. The UK is more essay based which is arguably harder and requires a much higher level of thinking. The fact you didn't get the score is simply inexperience in that format. When i went to school in the US from the third grade onward (age 8) we took end of year tests every year to see if we had reached the level of achievement required to pass. I regularly failed all my classes, then took the EOG test and was happily progressed to the next year lol. Because i was intelligent but couldn't be asked to do homework lol. I much prefer the UK system of education and think it's alot better, if you want to ace the SAT you need to practice the grind, it's not just about being smart/knowledge. A levels basically are UK style SAT's their just in the british format of needing to write essays and minimal multiple choice questions. Switching to the SAT would hence imo be pretty pointless.
Have you applied? Are you studying in the UK or you’ve just finished your cycle?
and truthfully could you understand the SAT reading and writing. I struggled so much with it so many times. I just sort of guessed. I think should have read the strategies. And you’re right about the grind, someone in my yesr got 1550 accepted into MIT and Princeton.
And I flopped the SAT essay which was quite funny. I got 15 when I take an essay subject and got predicted A* and consistently get very good marks.
That was why I didn’t apply US tbh and I wasn’t happy with my reading score.
but do you study here or in the US?
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Realitysreflexx
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(Original post by PL1234)
Have you applied? Are you studying in the UK or you’ve just finished your cycle?
and truthfully could you understand the SAT reading and writing. I struggled so much with it so many times. I just sort of guessed. I think should have read the strategies. And you’re right about the grind, someone in my yesr got 1550 accepted into MIT and Princeton.
And I flopped the SAT essay which was quite funny. I got 15 when I take an essay subject and got predicted A* and consistently get very good marks.
That was why I didn’t apply US tbh and I wasn’t happy with my reading score.
but do you study here or in the US?
I'm a 3rd year Management BSc, going to do my master in the Netherlands next year. I'm at Nottingham uni now heading to Groningen next to do a Master's in Change Management . Yeah had lots of people do well in SAT but you definitely need a strategy for all American type tests....the same goes for GMAT so MBA admissions.
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smaoineadh
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(Original post by cf_99)
I've noticed that in the UK, a system of "predicted grades" is being used. I think that this seems really sketchy. It seems like these "predicted grades" can pulled out of no where. In Ireland such a system does not exist and offers are only made after the results come out. In fact, unis here have no prior knowledge of you whatsoever (ie they don't know about your mock results or Junior Cert/GCSE results). What do you think is fairer? The Irish one is far from perfect either, mind you.
Ive got a conditional offer for a course and the grades they want me to get are the same as 560points ! In ireland i can study this course for 420points,such a difference !
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cf_99
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(Original post by smaoineadh)
Ive got a conditional offer for a course and the grades they want me to get are the same as 560points ! In ireland i can study this course for 420points,such a difference !
Yeah, I don't think people on TSR realise how hard they have it. The English/Welsh system seems so stressful to me, not saying that it's bad, but good god, it's nothing like that in Ireland. France and Germany don't seem to be as stressful either. Obviously East Asian countries are worse, but that's stress on a whole new level.

You're right, conditional offers demand ridiculously high grades in England. I know that there's higher demand there, but still, it's absolutely nuts. The fact that they even take GCSE grades really seriously is something that kind of scares me. You know the Irish government are thinking of cancelling the JC in order to leave more space for LC students? Yeah, that's how useless the JC is here.
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smaoineadh
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Leaving cert might not even go ahead as planned! Also 500 points is unrealistic for me anyways nevermind trying without Being in class or any online teaching from my teachers!
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