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Logarithms and exponential functions

The variables x and y satisfy the equation y=K(b^x). The graph of ln y against x is a st line passing thro the points (2.3,1.7) and (3.1,2.1) . Find the values of K and b correct to 2 dp
So when I did this I get the ans b =1.65 and K=0.05
But the text book says K=1.73

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Original post by Shas72
The variables x and y satisfy the equation y=K(b^x). The graph of ln y against x is a st line passing thro the points (2.3,1.7) and (3.1,2.1) . Find the values of K and b correct to 2 dp
So when I did this I get the ans b =1.65 and K=0.05
But the text book says K=1.73


Though your teacher probably hasn't told you, if you learn to use your calculator properly you will find that it can give you the value of k and b for data sets of equations of this type.
Reply 2
Original post by Shas72
The variables x and y satisfy the equation y=K(b^x). The graph of ln y against x is a st line passing thro the points (2.3,1.7) and (3.1,2.1) . Find the values of K and b correct to 2 dp
So when I did this I get the ans b =1.65 and K=0.05
But the text book says K=1.73

Can you upload your working?
K being 0.05 (initial value) would be way too small
Original post by David Getling
Though your teacher probably hasn't told you, if you learn to use your calculator properly you will find that it can give you the value of k and b for data sets of equations of this type.


Can you give a hint of which submenu to go to? I'd have thought that finding the gradient and hence the intercept was the way. I was unaware that the calculator was able to shortcut all of this, and would welcome your insight.
Original post by dextrous63
Can you give a hint of which submenu to go to? I'd have thought that finding the gradient and hence the intercept was the way. I was unaware that the calculator was able to shortcut all of this, and would welcome your insight.

DO NOT do this as you need to show working.
Reply 5
Original post by mqb2766
Can you upload your working?
K being 0.05 (initial value) would be way too small

So I did ln y=ln k+ xlnb
Gradient= 0.5
So lnb =0.5
b=1.65 correct to 2dp
Y=1.6487x +c
2.1=1.6487×3.1+c
C=-3.01097
Lnk =-3.01097
K=0.05 correct to 2dp
Original post by dextrous63
Can you give a hint of which submenu to go to? I'd have thought that finding the gradient and hence the intercept was the way. I was unaware that the calculator was able to shortcut all of this, and would welcome your insight.

Assuming you are using the Classwiz, it's Menu 6, then scroll down and option 2.

There's so much more that this calculator can do, that students don't get told about. Is it really asking too much that someone teaching A-level maths should know how to use the calculator, that most of his/her class are using, well, so that he/she can teach it to his/her students?
Reply 7
Original post by David Getling
Assuming you are using the Classwiz, it's Menu 6, then scroll down and option 2.

There's so much more that this calculator can do, that students don't get told about. Is it really asking too much that someone teaching A-level maths should know how to use the calculator, that most of his/her class are using, well, so that he/she can teach it to his/her students?

Thanks let me try to do it using calculator
Reply 8
Original post by Shas72
So I did ln y=ln k+ xlnb
Gradient= 0.5
So lnb =0.5
b=1.65 correct to 2dp
Y=1.6487x +c
2.1=1.6487×3.1+c
C=-3.01097
Lnk =-3.01097
K=0.05 correct to 2dp

When finding C you need
ln(b)
not b in the linear equation. Other than that, the method is fine.
Reply 9
Original post by mqb2766
When finding C you need
ln(b)
not b in the linear equation. Other than that, the method is fine.


So I do y= ln bX+c
Original post by Shas72
So I do y= ln bX+c


You've written the correct equation
ln y=ln k+ xlnb
just plug the values in.
Reply 11
Original post by mqb2766
You've written the correct equation
ln y=ln k+ xlnb
just plug the values in.

Ok thanks. Yeah I did that and got the ans. Thank you!
Original post by David Getling
Assuming you are using the Classwiz, it's Menu 6, then scroll down and option 2.

There's so much more that this calculator can do, that students don't get told about. Is it really asking too much that someone teaching A-level maths should know how to use the calculator, that most of his/her class are using, well, so that he/she can teach it to his/her students?


Thanks David. Looks like I might have to invest in buying a book after all!
Original post by Muttley79
DO NOT do this as you need to show working.


I agree about showing working out on this one. Was asking out of interest. But, it's always useful if people can check their answers, and hence correct themselves.
Original post by dextrous63
I agree about showing working out on this one. Was asking out of interest. But, it's always useful if people can check their answers, and hence correct themselves.

You can check by substituting back - that's what a good teacher will recommend. At university you may just be given a standard scientific calculator in exams - don't rely on a specific model.
Original post by David Getling
Assuming you are using the Classwiz, it's Menu 6, then scroll down and option 2.

There's so much more that this calculator can do, that students don't get told about. Is it really asking too much that someone teaching A-level maths should know how to use the calculator, that most of his/her class are using, well, so that he/she can teach it to his/her students?

Yes of course teachers show students but there are FAR more important things to focus on when teaching A level - developing problem solving skills, estimating answers, etc. etc. No-one should be a slave to their calculator which may not even been allowed at uni.

Over-reliance on a calculator also risks students writing down insufficient working and losing method marks.
Original post by Muttley79
Yes of course teachers show students but there are FAR more important things to focus on when teaching A level - developing problem solving skills, estimating answers, etc. etc. No-one should be a slave to their calculator which may not even been allowed at uni.

Over-reliance on a calculator also risks students writing down insufficient working and losing method marks.

Makes one wonder why manufacturers even bother adding useful features to mainstream calculators if hardly anyone is told how to use them. Perhaps we should resort to simple calculators and log books, like the good old days.
Original post by dextrous63
Makes one wonder why manufacturers even bother adding useful features to mainstream calculators if hardly anyone is told how to use them. Perhaps we should resort to simple calculators and log books, like the good old days.


They want to sell them so adding new functions is an easy way to 'encourage' people to buy a new one. Even log books had pages no-one ever used!

You do need the Classwiz or similar for the stats paper.

I'm certainly not against calculators - one like my first is in the National Computing museum - but I'm not a slave to mine :smile:
Original post by dextrous63
Makes one wonder why manufacturers even bother adding useful features to mainstream calculators if hardly anyone is told how to use them. Perhaps we should resort to simple calculators and log books, like the good old days.


The features are good and often very useful. But, it's up to students to learn how to use them. Don't take any notice of nonsense about being a slave to the calculator. Yes, you should know the underlying maths, but if there's a tool that can perform it quickly and efficiently for you then it's well worth knowing how to use it.

Believe me. Most teachers do not know how to use a Classwiz well. Banging on about not being a slave to the calculator is just their attempt to hide this fact.
Reply 19
Original post by David Getling
Yes, you should know the underlying maths, but if there's a tool that can perform it quickly and efficiently for you then it's well worth knowing how to use it.

I agree with this. What I disagree with though is only relying on a calculator and your first post in this thread didn't even mention any understanding of the maths. Students could see your post and think that they can get by in this topic with a calculator and no understanding.

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