I want to be a barrister. Should I apply to the GDL with a low 2.1 from Cambridge?

I have a place on a GDL course in London. I obtained a low 2.1 (62) in music at the University of Cambridge. Various sources suggest that low 2.1 applicants simply won't get a look in for London-based pupilage further down the line. If I qualify with a very good grade in the GDL will that mitigate my poor performance at undergraduate enough to make the process and financial risk worthwhile?

Should I embark on the GDL with my current grades?

(edited 4 years ago)

Reply 1

crime_doesnt_pay

10

Original post by np678

I have a place on a GDL course in London. I obtained a low 2.1 (62) in music at the University of Cambridge. Various sources suggest that low 2.1 applicants simply won't get a look in for London-based pupilage further down the line. If I qualify with a very good grade in the GDL will that mitigate my poor performance at undergraduate enough to make the process and financial risk worthwhile?

Should I embark on the GDL with my current grades?

Yes absolutely! There are some sets that only want a first, and some that only want a first from oxbridge (although you're okay on that front!). However that is the minority, there are many London sets who are perfectly happy with a 2:1. The commercial sets tend to be the more fussy ones. There's so much other experience that chambers look for - work experience, mooting, competitions, etc. In terms of financial risk, I would definitely look into scholarships, the inns of court offer them for the GDL and the BPTC. Good luck!

Reply 2

joematt40

OP

2

Original post by crime_doesnt_pay

Yes absolutely! There are some sets that only want a first, and some that only want a first from oxbridge (although you're okay on that front!). However that is the minority, there are many London sets who are perfectly happy with a 2:1. The commercial sets tend to be the more fussy ones. There's so much other experience that chambers look for - work experience, mooting, competitions, etc. In terms of financial risk, I would definitely look into scholarships, the inns of court offer them for the GDL and the BPTC. Good luck!

Thank you very much for your reply! At the moment I'm very interested in criminal law, but of course that could all change over the GDL year.

Reply 3

Reality Check

22

Original post by np678

I have a place on a GDL course in London. I obtained a low 2.1 (62) in music at the University of Cambridge. Various sources suggest that low 2.1 applicants simply won't get a look in for London-based pupilage further down the line. If I qualify with a very good grade in the GDL will that mitigate my poor performance at undergraduate enough to make the process and financial risk worthwhile?

Should I embark on the GDL with my current grades?

This is my understanding of it, to be honest. Academic achievement is more important with pupillage than training contracts, and a very low 2i such as you have would not be remotely competitive. You sort of won on the swings (Cambridge) but lost on the slides (62). I think to stand even a chance with a lot of London sets you'd have to bring an awful lot more to the table in terms of 'added value' to your application.

I'm not an expert on this and this is my knowledge from a while ago. It would be good to hear from some current pupils for their input. I obviously hope, for your sake, that things have changed a bit and the expected level of attainment isn't quite as high as it used to be :smile:

Original post by Reality Check

This is my understanding of it, to be honest. Academic achievement is more important with pupillage than training contracts, and a very low 2i such as you have would not be remotely competitive. You sort of won on the swings (Cambridge) but lost on the slides (62). I think to stand even a chance with a lot of London sets you'd have to bring an awful lot more to the table in terms of 'added value' to your application.

I'm not an expert on this and this is my knowledge from a while ago. It would be good to hear from some current pupils for their input. I obviously hope, for your sake, that things have changed a bit and the expected level of attainment isn't quite as high as it used to be :smile:

Fortunately for the OP, this is not how things work in practice. There are a minority of sets (generally the top end London sets in commercial and other areas) where you need to have obtained a First. But for the vast majority of sets, a 2:1 is absolutely fine and ticks that box. The emphasis on whether it is a 'low' or 'high' 2:1 is largely irrelevant because the vast majority of sets do not ask for a breakdown. The pupillage gateway, for example, does not ask for breakdown, and a substantial number of sets recruit directly through the gateway. Even those that have non gateway processes do not usually ask for breakdowns.

So ultimately a 2:1 from Cambridge is fine. It is for you to assess your own prospects at becoming a barrister and whether or not you are willing to take the risk of entering into the process of trying to secure pupillage, but in and of itself a low 2:1 from Cambridge is not going to be a barrier to that.

Reply 5

Reality Check

22

Original post by Crazy Jamie

Fortunately for the OP, this is not how things work in practice. There are a minority of sets (generally the top end London sets in commercial and other areas) where you need to have obtained a First. But for the vast majority of sets, a 2:1 is absolutely fine and ticks that box. The emphasis on whether it is a 'low' or 'high' 2:1 is largely irrelevant because the vast majority of sets do not ask for a breakdown. The pupillage gateway, for example, does not ask for breakdown, and a substantial number of sets recruit directly through the gateway. Even those that have non gateway processes do not usually ask for breakdowns.

So ultimately a 2:1 from Cambridge is fine. It is for you to assess your own prospects at becoming a barrister and whether or not you are willing to take the risk of entering into the process of trying to secure pupillage, but in and of itself a low 2:1 from Cambridge is not going to be a barrier to that.

Thanks for that advice - it sounds like things have changed, and for the better.

Just out of interest for both me and the OP, a 2i might be fine in terms of ticking a box, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's competitive. When it comes to ranking candidates in a competitive entry such as securing a pupilage is, how relevant would the fact be that a lot of applicants have a better academic result? After all, everyone has a 2i minimum, so are you saying that the actual quanta of that 2i plays no further part in ranking candidates?

Original post by Reality Check

Thanks for that advice - it sounds like things have changed, and for the better.

Just out of interest for both me and the OP, a 2i might be fine in terms of ticking a box, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's competitive. When it comes to ranking candidates in a competitive entry such as securing a pupilage is, how relevant would the fact be that a lot of applicants have a better academic result? After all, everyone has a 2i minimum, so are you saying that the actual quanta of that 2i plays no further part in ranking candidates?

For the vast majority of sets, yes, the level of the 2:1 plays no further part in determining what score a candidate gets on the paper application. Mainly because that's not information that the vast majority of sets have when making that assessment. I appreciate that may seem strange, particularly to undergraduates who are spending years working towards as high a mark as they can obtain, but the answer is that a lot of things go into assessing whether or not a candidate is strong enough for interview. Academic ability is probably one of four, five or more areas that a barrister will look at when sifting (obviously that will vary depending on the scoring matrix used by the individual set). To that end, I normally say that a 2:1 ticks a box, a First ticks the box with a bit more of an emphasis, and a 2:2 gives you serious problems. All of that needs to be put into the context of an application that is far wider ranging, and needs to show many more things than just your academic ability. Talking about my set in particular, I do have to grade academic ability when I'm sifting, but that includes A-Levels, undergraduate degree, postgraduate degree (if applicable), the Bar course, and anything else that may be relevant. I genuinely don't think that a candidate scoring a 68 instead of a 62 would be likely by itself to make them come out with a different mark even in that one category. Though as I say, it's never an assessment I've had to make.

Reply 7

Mpishi

5

Original post by np678

I have a place on a GDL course in London. I obtained a low 2.1 (62) in music at the University of Cambridge. Various sources suggest that low 2.1 applicants simply won't get a look in for London-based pupilage further down the line. If I qualify with a very good grade in the GDL will that mitigate my poor performance at undergraduate enough to make the process and financial risk worthwhile?

Should I embark on the GDL with my current grades?

Well, the trouble is that a lot of Chambers have rather obscure pupillage recruitment policies so it is hard to give any general opinion. A 2:1 from anywhere is a bit pedestrian but a Distinction on the GDL plus outstanding on the Bar Course (to which you can add an LLM) are all very helpful. You can add a lot of value with other things as, contrary to popular belief, academic excellence is insufficient. So things like mooting (particularly if you can win a few), getting articles published, being able to demonstrate ability to interact with others (the service element of being a barrister is becoming far more important than it used to be), determination and gumption, commitment to the Bar are all factors that will influence selection for pupillage. Other added value can be getting a qualification in Mediation/ADR, charity work, a number of mini-pupillages (although too many just shows a lack of imagination), work experience with solicitors (know your clients!), volunteering for things like the Central London Litigant in person scheme, or the Free Representation Unit. Evidence of understanding what life at the Bar is all about is helpful. There is nothing which can guarantee you a pupillage and it is a very high risk course for anyone, even those with Firsts.

I want to be a barrister. Should I apply to the GDL with a low 2.1 from Cambridge?

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