UK £ now regarded as 'emerging market' currency

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Napp
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Money controls the wheels of power. They are not bowing to the UK but trying to protect their own interests.

I don't think it has anything to do with the UK dumping **** into their markets. I think it probably has to do with what they can get from the UK without anything tangible in return.

They move carefully with China because the EU is dependent on China. Most of the West is dependent on China, despite the public pretence that we are not dependent.
My point was you seem to be misunderstanding what their interests are. Berlins interest is the preservation of the union.

Maybe so, probably not. The fact of the matter is that is what they believe and whether you or anyone else disagrees is immaterial.. There is not a single plausable reason why they should give the UK the status of a member nation without actually being one though.

Ah gotcha. What public pretense sorry? It's a well known fact.
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Wired_1800
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#42
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(Original post by Napp)
My point was you seem to be misunderstanding what their interests are. Berlins interest is the preservation of the union.

Maybe so, probably not. The fact of the matter is that is what they believe and whether you or anyone else disagrees is immaterial.. There is not a single plausable reason why they should give the UK the status of a member nation without actually being one though.

Ah gotcha. What public pretense sorry? It's a well known fact.
The preservation of the Union is dependent on the economic and political stability of its members. If the EU decides to try countries esp the UK with contempt because we left and in the process risking economic stability, then they would have failed to preserve their project.

I don't think that is the deal that is on the table. Sources have claimed, which was reported on Newsnight, that the UK offered terms similar to Canada and it was rejected. Then terms similar to Norway was offered but controls against contributing to the European budget and forfeiting certain access rights and those were rejected too.

The Government has come out to publicly accept WTO terms if no deal is reached by December and the Bank of England has begun preparations to protect the economy. If German and French businesses lose access to the UK market, then Merkel and Macron would have to explain to them why they have chosen to wreck their own economies. Merkel’s popularity is waning due to certain decisions she made in the past such as the refugee crisis. Macron’s time is numbered and a knock on the French economy will only add to the anger. He has had to change his Prime Minister as well.

It is a well known fact that the West is not dependent on China’s money? Ok.
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Napp
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#43
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
The preservation of the Union is dependent on the economic and political stability of its members. If the EU decides to try countries esp the UK with contempt because we left and in the process risking economic stability, then they would have failed to preserve their project.

I don't think that is the deal that is on the table. Sources have claimed, which was reported on Newsnight, that the UK offered terms similar to Canada and it was rejected. Then terms similar to Norway was offered but controls against contributing to the European budget and forfeiting certain access rights and those were rejected too.

The Government has come out to publicly accept WTO terms if no deal is reached by December and the Bank of England has begun preparations to protect the economy. If German and French businesses lose access to the UK market, then Merkel and Macron would have to explain to them why they have chosen to wreck their own economies. Merkel’s popularity is waning due to certain decisions she made in the past such as the refugee crisis. Macron’s time is numbered and a knock on the French economy will only add to the anger. He has had to change his Prime Minister as well.
I'm deeply questioning what you know of the EU outside of the propaganda fed by the DM... Especially if you don't know why the Canada offer was laughed out of the door, as well it should have been.
Merkels popularity is waning is it? :rolleyes: Where do you get this 'info' from? Her popularity has spiked quite significantly in recent months. Unlike Boris who has collapsed. Of course Macrons time is limited, he's a politician. If you think that has anything to do with Brexit though, that is just bizarre.
Where on earth do you get these opinions on politicians fortunes from?!

It is a well known fact that the West is not dependent on China’s money? Ok.
Try reading that again, Wired.
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Wired_1800
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#44
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#44
(Original post by Napp)
I'm deeply questioning what you know of the EU outside of the propaganda fed by the DM... Especially if you don't know why the Canada offer was laughed out of the door, as well it should have been.
Merkels popularity is waning is it? :rolleyes: Where do you get this 'info' from? Her popularity has spiked quite significantly in recent months. Unlike Boris who has collapsed. Of course Macrons time is limited, he's a politician. If you think that has anything to do with Brexit though, that is just bizarre.
Where on earth do you get these opinions on politicians fortunes from?!


Try reading that again, Wired.
I am not reading propaganda for the DM because I try to obtain a wide range of views.

I don't think Merkel’s popularity has spiked and she even agreed to step down next year after poor performance in regional elections.

Here are some links:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft....5-8e03987b7b20

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft....1-482eed0038b1

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...urope-46020745

There was an article that I read some weeks ago that provided a full timeline of when her popularity began to wane. The article claimed it started from the refugee crisis. If i find the article, I will share it with you.

For Macron, have you been living under a rock? Did you fail to see the protests that happened some months ago? I watch and read widely to understand both home and foreign news.
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Napp
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#45
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(Original post by Wired_1800)

For Macron, have you been living under a rock? Did you fail to miss the protests that happened some months ago? I watch and read widely to understand both home and foreign news.
Apparently not if you think it is due to Brexit :lol:
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Wired_1800
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#46
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(Original post by Napp)
Apparently not if you think it is due to Brexit :lol:
I don't think it is due to Brexit. I think Macron’s problems are driven mainly by domestic policies such as labour reforms. I think the negative outcome of Brexit trade negotiations may add to his misery, if French businesses began to feel the pinch.
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paul514
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#47
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(Original post by Napp)
Try reading that again, Wired.
The UK has already been offered what it is asking for now early on under May (Canada deal).

Rather than getting into a argument over this perhaps we should just sit it out over the next few months and wait to see what happens.

Theres really nothing more to be said on it.
Last edited by paul514; 3 weeks ago
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Fullofsurprises
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#48
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#48
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Because money oils the wheels of power. Do we think that the EU would continue down the path of economic self-harm because they want to punish the UK? Of course not, once German and French businesses begin to feel the pinch, they would adjust accordingly. It is also the reason why they move carefully with China because we are dependent on China’s economic might.
Just to put this into perspective, the UK consumes around 5% of German vehicle manufacture. So no, we don't have them over a barrel.
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Napp
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#49
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(Original post by paul514)
The UK has already been offered what it is asking for now early on under May (Canada deal).

Rather than getting into a argument over this perhaps we should just sit it out over the next few months and wait to see what happens.

Theres really nothing more to be said on it.
What's this got to do with China's moolah sorry?
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
Just to put this into perspective, the UK consumes around 5% of German vehicle manufacture. So no, we don't have them over a barrel.
5% is still a lot. If the Germans produce 1million vehicles in a year, we account for 50,000 of those vehicles. If the average new vehicle costs £20,000 (i think it is much higher esp for Mercedes), that amounts to £1 billion lost. I doubt Dieter Zetsche (Chairman of Mercedes) or Herbert Diess (Chairman of Volkswagen) would be pleased to see £1 billion wiped from the revenue because Merkel fancies herself too much. We are not even discussing the other damage to other sectors such as financial services with Deutsche Bank or other goods and services.

The above is just for Germany. France also has lots to lose if Macron choose to cut his nose to spite his face.
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imlikeahermit
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#51
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Wales' Ineos plant suspended. Another victim of #brexitreality.

This, the same company that pledged it allegiance to the UK. 55% of the Bridgend constituency also voted to leave.

Incidentally they've moved to France. What possible benefit could being in a single market and customs union be?

Tremendous scenes. :aetsch:
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paul514
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#52
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
Wales' Ineos plant suspended. Another victim of #brexitreality.

This, the same company that pledged it allegiance to the UK. 55% of the Bridgend constituency also voted to leave.

Incidentally they've moved to France. What possible benefit could being in a single market and customs union be?

Tremendous scenes. :aetsch:
What a complete div you are.

First you are joyous at the prospect of the UK not prospering and then go on about the single market like that is the reason.

First it’s not confirmed and secondly the story online is that they may buy an existing plant in France and build it there instead of in wales and Portugal.... the latter being in the EU 🤡

Also these are new jobs not existing jobs for a British company.
Last edited by paul514; 3 weeks ago
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imlikeahermit
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#53
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(Original post by paul514)
What a complete div you are.

First you are joyous at the prospect of the UK not prospering and then go on about the single market like that is the reason.

First it’s not confirmed and secondly the story online is that they may buy an existing plant in France and build it there instead of in wales and Portugal.... the latter being in the EU 🤡

Also these are new jobs not existing jobs for a British company.
Firstly, you guys have been telling remainers like myself for years now that everything is gonna be hunky dory and that we won't suffer economically. I've accepted that it's past the point now of complaining about it, so I enjoy watching as the chips fall, because I know in the end I'll be able to say 'I told you so.'

Secondly, the comments that were made in the article I read suggested this was all but done. Speaks volumes that they're willing to buy a plant in France which is in the single market, and not willing to pursue opportunities in this country, despite seemingly committing to it. They've led Bridgend a merry dance for all intents and purposes.

Thirdly, you are correct, they were new jobs, however, they were to help make up for 1700 job losses in a Ford factory in Bridgend. This is the second time that Bridgend has been screwed by a car company.
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paul514
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#54
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
Firstly, you guys have been telling remainers like myself for years now that everything is gonna be hunky dory and that we won't suffer economically. I've accepted that it's past the point now of complaining about it, so I enjoy watching as the chips fall, because I know in the end I'll be able to say 'I told you so.'

Secondly, the comments that were made in the article I read suggested this was all but done. Speaks volumes that they're willing to buy a plant in France which is in the single market, and not willing to pursue opportunities in this country, despite seemingly committing to it. They've led Bridgend a merry dance for all intents and purposes.

Thirdly, you are correct, they were new jobs, however, they were to help make up for 1700 job losses in a Ford factory in Bridgend. This is the second time that Bridgend has been screwed by a car company.
Portugal is also in the EU

Inios obviously just think it is a better place to do build the car if it goes ahead.

The only way you will be able to go I told you so is by looking at the macro data in a few years and then a decade later.

Even then you will be going on a supposition of what it would have been other wise as that is basically an alternate reality
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by paul514)
Portugal is also in the EU

Inios obviously just think it is a better place to do build the car if it goes ahead.

The only way you will be able to go I told you so is by looking at the macro data in a few years and then a decade later.

Even then you will be going on a supposition of what it would have been other wise as that is basically an alternate reality
I'll still turn around and say I told you so...

Us, as a country, being so petty and arrogant as to opt out of the EU vaccine scheme has told me all I need to know about our Brexit strategy going forward. This will be an utter shambles. It's interesting that getting brexit done comes before saving lives.
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paul514
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
I'll still turn around and say I told you so...

Us, as a country, being so petty and arrogant as to opt out of the EU vaccine scheme has told me all I need to know about our Brexit strategy going forward. This will be an utter shambles. It's interesting that getting brexit done comes before saving lives.
Ok
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DJKL
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#57
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
5% is still a lot. If the Germans produce 1million vehicles in a year, we account for 50,000 of those vehicles. If the average new vehicle costs £20,000 (i think it is much higher esp for Mercedes), that amounts to £1 billion lost. I doubt Dieter Zetsche (Chairman of Mercedes) or Herbert Diess (Chairman of Volkswagen) would be pleased to see £1 billion wiped from the revenue because Merkel fancies herself too much. We are not even discussing the other damage to other sectors such as financial services with Deutsche Bank or other goods and services.

The above is just for Germany. France also has lots to lose if Macron choose to cut his nose to spite his face.
And how many cars do Nissan UK currently sell ? Clue, currently over 400k cars of which circa 90k -100k are registered in the UK, rest go elsewhere, turnover last accounts circa £6.17 bn
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by DJKL)
And how many cars do Nissan UK currently sell ? Clue, currently over 400k cars of which circa 90k -100k are registered in the UK, rest go elsewhere, turnover last accounts circa £6.17 bn
I think they still lose the UK market if they don't invest here.
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DJKL
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#59
(Original post by Wired_1800)
I think they still lose the UK market if they don't invest here.
Why on earth does one run a factory with a circa 100k vehicle output into the UK market and 300k output elsewhere requiring to pay tariffs to get to end destination, and that is before one considers JIT re parts coming in for the operation of the production line. Business 101, set up in your larger market (the EU) and take the frictions for your lower volume exports into the UK.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by DJKL)
Why on earth does one run a factory with a circa 100k vehicle output into the UK market and 300k output elsewhere requiring to pay tariffs to get to end destination, and that is before one considers JIT re parts coming in for the operation of the production line. Business 101, set up in your larger market (the EU) and take the frictions for your lower volume exports into the UK.
Businesses esp the large ones tend to have operations across multiple markets and regions. It is not rocket science for a company like Nissan, VW or Ford to have manufacturing plants in the UK and the EU.

It is annoying for one to state that it is a zero sum game, where companies with operations in the EU must cease to operate in the UK and vice versa. The EU is not the be all and end all. There more more than 150 countries that are not in the EU and these companies still operate there as well.
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