TSRMedics™ BASICS 2 Postgrad medical exams - What are they and how hard is it really?
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TSRMedics™BASICS is the section for discussion of basic (basic to us anyway!) information about different roles and information in the medical, nursing and allied health professions.
TSRMedics™BASICS 2 Postgraduate Medical Exams
What are postgraduate medical exams?
In order to complete specialty training you will need, in some cases, to pass relevant membership exams. These are widely regarded as challenging, and some candidates may need to sit exams more than once to be successful. You must also be aware of the demands of combining a full-time job with the level of study required to pass these exams.
Membership exams are offered by the following Royal Colleges, colleges and faculties responsible for groups of specialties. You are required to pass membership exams to gain the qualifications indicated below.
What are the types of exams?
The so-called entrance exams are usually the Membership exams listed above. These are the exams that you have to take and pass before entering Specialty Training.
There are also "exit exams". A junior doctor has to pass these exams before they finish training. These are mostly Specialty exams taken when you are a registrar (for specific specialties - read below) but a notable exception is GP. There is no entrance exam for GP training and all trainees must pass all parts of the MRCGP by the end of GP training.
What entrance exams are there?
These are usually Diplomas, but called Fellowship or Membership instead of Diploma in Anaesthestics etc.
Anaesthetics (FRCA = Fellowship of the Royal College of Anaesthetists)
Emergency medicine (MCEM = Membership of the College of Emergency Medicine)
General Practitioners (nMRCGP = Membership of the Royal College of General Practitioners)
Obstetrics and gynaecology (MRCOG = Membership of the Royal College of Obstetrics and Gynaecologists)
Occupational medicine (MFOM = Membership of the Faculty of Occupational Medicine)
Ophthalmology (MRCOphth = Membership of the Royal College of Ophthalmology)
Paediatrics and child health (MRCPCH = Membership of the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health)
Pathologists (FRCPath = Fellowship of the Royal College of Pathologists)
Physicians (MRCP = Membership of the Royal College of Physicians)
Psychiatry (MRCPsych = Membership of the Royal College of Psychiatrists)
Public health (MFPH = Membership of the Faculty of Public Health)
Radiology (FRCR = Fellowship of the Royal College of Radiologists)
Surgeons (MRCS = Membership of the Royal College of Surgeons)
References
https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/explore-roles/doctors/medical-specialty-training/membership-exams
Post originally created by ecolier.
(edited 3 years ago)
Scroll to see replies
Page being updated.
Currently planned:
- Parts of each membership exam:
(How much are they?)
(What's the pass rate)
(What's the pass mark)
(Example questions)
- A brief mention of exit exams (they are literally hundreds, if not thousands)
- A very brief mention of overseas exit exams (I really don't know much about these.... so it will be brief)
Tell us below what else you want to see!
Remember this thread is not for doctors preparing. If you are a junior doctor preparing for post-grad exams, proceed to @Democracy's excellent thread at https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5202178
Post originally created by ecolier.
Currently planned:
- Parts of each membership exam:
(How much are they?)
(What's the pass rate)
(What's the pass mark)
(Example questions)
- A brief mention of exit exams (they are literally hundreds, if not thousands)
- A very brief mention of overseas exit exams (I really don't know much about these.... so it will be brief)
Tell us below what else you want to see!
Remember this thread is not for doctors preparing. If you are a junior doctor preparing for post-grad exams, proceed to @Democracy's excellent thread at https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5202178
Post originally created by ecolier.
Nice one ecolier.
I wonder whether the use of the terms entrance and exit exams is entirely accurate? There are several specialties where you can't register for the exams until you are firmly in the specialty training programme e.g. radiology and pathology. So I don't think it's quite accurate to say that GP is alone in not having an "entrance" exam.
There are also some MRCP specialties which don't have an SCE i.e. don't have an "exit" exam.
If applicants should take away anything from this it is that there are myriad subtleties and exceptions in medical training
Finally, I think the NHS website is a little out of date in places: I don't think MRCGP is referred to as nMRCGP any longer (it is now well established vs the old MRCGP) and A&E doctors sit the FRCEM not MCEM.
I wonder whether the use of the terms entrance and exit exams is entirely accurate? There are several specialties where you can't register for the exams until you are firmly in the specialty training programme e.g. radiology and pathology. So I don't think it's quite accurate to say that GP is alone in not having an "entrance" exam.
There are also some MRCP specialties which don't have an SCE i.e. don't have an "exit" exam.
If applicants should take away anything from this it is that there are myriad subtleties and exceptions in medical training
Finally, I think the NHS website is a little out of date in places: I don't think MRCGP is referred to as nMRCGP any longer (it is now well established vs the old MRCGP) and A&E doctors sit the FRCEM not MCEM.
Original post by Democracy
Nice one ecolier.
I wonder whether the use of the terms entrance and exit exams is entirely accurate? There are several specialties where you can't register for the exams until you are firmly in the specialty training programme e.g. radiology and pathology. So I don't think it's quite accurate to say that GP is alone in not having an "entrance" exam.
There are also some MRCP specialties which don't have an SCE i.e. don't have an "exit" exam.
If applicants should take away anything from this it is that there are myriad subtleties and exceptions in medical training
Finally, I think the NHS website is a little out of date in places: I don't think MRCGP is referred to as nMRCGP any longer (it is now well established vs the old MRCGP) and A&E doctors sit the FRCEM not MCEM.
I wonder whether the use of the terms entrance and exit exams is entirely accurate? There are several specialties where you can't register for the exams until you are firmly in the specialty training programme e.g. radiology and pathology. So I don't think it's quite accurate to say that GP is alone in not having an "entrance" exam.
There are also some MRCP specialties which don't have an SCE i.e. don't have an "exit" exam.
If applicants should take away anything from this it is that there are myriad subtleties and exceptions in medical training
Finally, I think the NHS website is a little out of date in places: I don't think MRCGP is referred to as nMRCGP any longer (it is now well established vs the old MRCGP) and A&E doctors sit the FRCEM not MCEM.
Excellent, I will get the first post updated the next time I add more content!
Post originally created by ecolier.
FRCA is neither an entrance or an exit exam really. You can't sit the Primary until you're in an approved training programme and have got your Initial Assessment of Competency. Then you need to have passed all parts of it to apply for ST3 jobs and complete core training (so both entrance and exit!)
The Final must be completed by halfway through ST5.
The Final must be completed by halfway through ST5.
Cheers. Yeah, the more I think about it the less I think entry/exit exams exists as a general concept. Already mentioned radiology/pathology/GP as specialties where you simply can't do the exams prior to specialty training, but even those specialties where you technically can e.g. paeds/A&E/psych, it's not actually mandatory for gaining an ST1 position, so is it actually an entry exam?
Possibly the specialties where the entry/exit exam idea works best are medicine and surgery with MRCP/SCE and MRCS/FRCS respectively, but even that may have exceptions as I alluded to above.
Anyway, thanks for making the thread, I'm sure the applicants will find it helpful
Possibly the specialties where the entry/exit exam idea works best are medicine and surgery with MRCP/SCE and MRCS/FRCS respectively, but even that may have exceptions as I alluded to above.
Anyway, thanks for making the thread, I'm sure the applicants will find it helpful
Original post by Democracy
Cheers. Yeah, the more I think about it the less I think entry/exit exams exists as a general concept. Already mentioned radiology/pathology/GP as specialties where you simply can't do the exams prior to specialty training, but even those specialties where you technically can e.g. paeds/A&E/psych, it's not actually mandatory for gaining an ST1 position, so is it actually an entry exam?
Possibly the specialties where the entry/exit exam idea works best are medicine and surgery with MRCP/SCE and MRCS/FRCS respectively, but even that may have exceptions as I alluded to above.
Anyway, thanks for making the thread, I'm sure the applicants will find it helpful
Possibly the specialties where the entry/exit exam idea works best are medicine and surgery with MRCP/SCE and MRCS/FRCS respectively, but even that may have exceptions as I alluded to above.
Anyway, thanks for making the thread, I'm sure the applicants will find it helpful
for your contribution, I'll tweak some words in the OP.Post originally created by ecolier.
That's a big expansion!
What is the target audience here?
An indication of the amount of effort put in might be useful - a little tricky due to variation but probably what a medical applicant/med student is wondering. Also what happens when you fail, maybe how many times you can retake?
What is the target audience here?
An indication of the amount of effort put in might be useful - a little tricky due to variation but probably what a medical applicant/med student is wondering. Also what happens when you fail, maybe how many times you can retake?
Original post by nexttime
That's a big expansion!
What is the target audience here?
An indication of the amount of effort put in might be useful - a little tricky due to variation but probably what a medical applicant/med student is wondering. Also what happens when you fail, maybe how many times you can retake?
What is the target audience here?
An indication of the amount of effort put in might be useful - a little tricky due to variation but probably what a medical applicant/med student is wondering. Also what happens when you fail, maybe how many times you can retake?
It will be a big expansion, perhaps just a tiny bit every day or every week.... It took me a whole year to finish the first one
But
I will add those in!Post originally created by ecolier.
Original post by Democracy
One of the good things about the wiki was that anyone could edit it which meant all the "pressure" wasn't piled onto a single author. Is there any way of linking the two together? 
I don't know how
I did tag the CS for a section on UCAT / UKCAT that needed editing. @becausethenight can you remember what happened? Did anything come of it?
Post originally created by ecolier.
The lovely @StrawberryDreams (tagged in case they have more they can add on wiki editing) was happy to add my stuff into the medicine GCSE wiki (isn't it shiny: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/results/gcse/medical-school-gcse-requirements) I don't think the UCAT wiki has actually been updated (it's still all 2020 entry) but I wasn't involved in that and it all happens via PM I think.
I think only certain mods/admins can edit a wiki - I had to PM over my word doc, and then Strawberry had to manually enter in all the changes. Unless there's a way to increase the number of people who can edit a wiki, it might not be the best thing for collab work?
I think only certain mods/admins can edit a wiki - I had to PM over my word doc, and then Strawberry had to manually enter in all the changes. Unless there's a way to increase the number of people who can edit a wiki, it might not be the best thing for collab work?
Not wiki-related, but: I like the idea of this thread 
As a (hopefully) soon-to-be-med-student, I do want to have an idea of what I might be aiming for in the future, just as I was looking up what the UCAT and BMAT were in Y9 or so (I was a bit precocious 
)
It might be interesting to include some basic information on what it's actually like to sit/prepare for the exams? Maybe just a short 'personal experience' type thing from a couple of people, as I can imagine it would be impossible to do it for all of them And maybe an idea of how 'hard' the postgrad exams are (in terms of needing to resit, not progressing etc?)
As a (hopefully) soon-to-be-med-student, I do want to have an idea of what I might be aiming for in the future, just as I was looking up what the UCAT and BMAT were in Y9 or so (I was a bit precocious )It might be interesting to include some basic information on what it's actually like to sit/prepare for the exams? Maybe just a short 'personal experience' type thing from a couple of people, as I can imagine it would be impossible to do it for all of them
And maybe an idea of how 'hard' the postgrad exams are (in terms of needing to resit, not progressing etc?)Original post by becausethenight
Not wiki-related, but: I like the idea of this thread As a (hopefully) soon-to-be-med-student, I do want to have an idea of what I might be aiming for in the future, just as I was looking up what the UCAT and BMAT were in Y9 or so (I was a bit precocious )
It might be interesting to include some basic information on what it's actually like to sit/prepare for the exams? Maybe just a short 'personal experience' type thing from a couple of people, as I can imagine it would be impossible to do it for all of them And maybe an idea of how 'hard' the postgrad exams are (in terms of needing to resit, not progressing etc?)
As a (hopefully) soon-to-be-med-student, I do want to have an idea of what I might be aiming for in the future, just as I was looking up what the UCAT and BMAT were in Y9 or so (I was a bit precocious )It might be interesting to include some basic information on what it's actually like to sit/prepare for the exams? Maybe just a short 'personal experience' type thing from a couple of people, as I can imagine it would be impossible to do it for all of them
And maybe an idea of how 'hard' the postgrad exams are (in terms of needing to resit, not progressing etc?)Excellent suggestions, they will be added (there are a few "personal experience" posts in Democracy's thread, linked in the second post).
Post originally created by ecolier.
Original post by becausethenight
I think only certain mods/admins can edit a wiki - I had to PM over my word doc, and then Strawberry had to manually enter in all the changes. Unless there's a way to increase the number of people who can edit a wiki, it might not be the best thing for collab work?
Why is that though? Back in the day anyone could edit the TSR Wiki
Obviously I don't want to take this thread off topic but changing the permissions is the most straightforward way of speeding up editing and content addition imho.
Thanks, I'll have a look!
No idea, just my experience
I agree with you, though - no one uses the wikis for medicine because they're all out of date! So clearly something needs to be changed and editing sped up.
Original post by Democracy
Why is that though? Back in the day anyone could edit the TSR Wiki
Obviously I don't want to take this thread off topic but changing the permissions is the most straightforward way of speeding up editing and content addition imho.
Obviously I don't want to take this thread off topic but changing the permissions is the most straightforward way of speeding up editing and content addition imho.
No idea, just my experience
I agree with you, though - no one uses the wikis for medicine because they're all out of date! So clearly something needs to be changed and editing sped up.
Original post by Democracy
Why is that though? Back in the day anyone could edit the TSR Wiki
Obviously I don't want to take this thread off topic but changing the permissions is the most straightforward way of speeding up editing and content addition imho.
Obviously I don't want to take this thread off topic but changing the permissions is the most straightforward way of speeding up editing and content addition imho.
You might be still be able to edit it if you were a supermod, before they moved it over to section leader. I honestly don't remember the permissions, it's been years.
I can edit the page. See if you can https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/w/index.php?title=Medical_School_GCSE_Requirements&action=edit
Original post by EierVonSatan
You might be still be able to edit it if you were a supermod, before they moved it over to section leader. I honestly don't remember the permissions, it's been years.
I can edit the page. See if you can https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/w/index.php?title=Medical_School_GCSE_Requirements&action=edit
I can edit the page. See if you can https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/w/index.php?title=Medical_School_GCSE_Requirements&action=edit
Hey dude, yes I've just seen that some pages are available to edit but some others aren't or appear to be duplicated.
I can edit the page you've linked but not this one: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/results/gcse/medical-school-gcse-requirements - so there appear to be two GCSE pages floating around?
I've just updated the "studying medicine in the US" article as there have been a lot of questions about that lately
Original post by Democracy
Hey dude, yes I've just seen that some pages are available to edit but some others aren't or appear to be duplicated.
I can edit the page you've linked but not this one: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/results/gcse/medical-school-gcse-requirements - so there appear to be two GCSE pages floating around?
I've just updated the "studying medicine in the US" article as there have been a lot of questions about that lately
I can edit the page you've linked but not this one: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/results/gcse/medical-school-gcse-requirements - so there appear to be two GCSE pages floating around?
I've just updated the "studying medicine in the US" article as there have been a lot of questions about that lately
I could be wrong but I think the article page (the one you just linked) is linked from the wiki i.e. in the top right corner of the editable page I linked to there is a ''what links here'' button which links to the article.
So if my hunch if right, if you edit the wiki, the changes would appear on the article as well
edit: nope they are different pages
what a mess!(edited 3 years ago)
Original post by EierVonSatan
I could be wrong but I think the article page (the one you just linked) is linked from the wiki i.e. in the top right corner of the editable page I linked to there is a ''what links here'' button which links to the article.
So if my hunch if right, if you edit the wiki, the changes would appear on the article as well
edit: nope they are different pages what a mess!
So if my hunch if right, if you edit the wiki, the changes would appear on the article as well
edit: nope they are different pages
what a mess!Yes unfortunately at some point it seems certain wiki pages were duplicated or converted to uneditable articles e.g. also here: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/university/courses/medicine/graduate-entry-medicine-a-guide which is possibly why the whole Wiki project has fallen by the wayside and become increasingly out of date.
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