BLM performance on Britain’s got talent sparks complaints

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imlikeahermit
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Underscore__)
This seems somewhat hard to believe given that he’s probably one of the top three F1 drivers ever. That level of skill can’t simply be explained away by opportunity.
Hold on. He’s a good driver, don’t get me wrong, but let’s not pretend he hasn’t had the best car for the majority of his career, which has subsequently led to his success. He is not an underdog, he has never been in a struggling team. Also, this post describes the beginnings of his career and the ‘extra’ opportunities he was given.
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Underscore__
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#42
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
Hold on. He’s a good driver, don’t get me wrong, but let’s not pretend he hasn’t had the best car for the majority of his career, which has subsequently led to his success. He is not an underdog, he has never been in a struggling team. Also, this post describes the beginnings of his career and the ‘extra’ opportunities he was given.
I’m not sure what your argument is, are you saying he’s not one of the best ever? The post made it sound like was an unremarkable kart driver who got to F1 because he was given more opportunity. Given how good he is that seems difficult to imagine. It feels almost like saying Messi was an average footballer but got lucky and was picked by Barcelona which is the only reason he’s become the best ever.

It annoys me to be defending him because he comes across as such a self righteous, sanctimonious ****
Last edited by Underscore__; 2 weeks ago
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N. Auditoré
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(Original post by Napp)
A myth perpetrated by pseudo academic quacks and racists (irony abounds).
But for example, why is it racist for me to reference white fragility in a situation where it is clearly displayed? For example, that picture i posted about Anthony Joshua and the other athletes was very clearly white fragility. I mean telling athletes not to complain about racism just because they’re successful? Seems pretty fragile to me. It isn’t much of a myth when u can see it in real time
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Napp
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(Original post by N. Auditoré)
But for example, why is it racist for me to reference white fragility in a situation where it is clearly displayed? For example, that picture i posted about Anthony Joshua and the other athletes was very clearly white fragility. I mean telling athletes not to complain about racism just because they’re successful? Seems pretty fragile to me. It isn’t much of a myth when u can see it in real time
It isnt racist to post it, in of itself, it just happens to be used by racist. Never mind the irony of calling 'white people fragile' whilst in the same breath being, well, fragile.
It is when we look at the crank who came up with the pseudothought behind it. The 'academic' being little more than a disgrace to the profession and only marginally less despicable than Krug.


Case in point, calling people 'fragile' because you're insulting them based on race is really not a good path to be going down. A) Because it can be turned back on you very quickly and B) Because its not just poor debating but needlessly offensive to insinuate someone is 'fragile' because of their race. As an example, imagine if the table was flipped 180, i rather doubt the same tune would be being whistled... I can only imagine the outrage if i started calling blacks "fragile". Do you see my point?
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DiddyDec
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#45
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(Original post by Napp)
I can only imagine the outrage if i started calling blacks "fragile". Do you see my point?
I think black victim complex would be more applicable.
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Napp
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(Original post by DiddyDec)
I think black victim complex would be more applicable.
Indeed. One can just imagine the howls of righteous outrage if i used the exact same language, albeit reversed.
By all means fight for equality but its somewhat undercut if you immediately go and say things are only okay for one specific group and not the other.
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Ascend
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(Original post by Napp)
Indeed. One can just imagine the howls of righteous outrage if i used the exact same language, albeit reversed.
By all means fight for equality but its somewhat undercut if you immediately go and say things are only okay for one specific group and not the other.
There aren't even any coherent proposals for an end goal to this "fight discrimination with discrimination" attitude. It's just a vicious cycle of racialising everything. So there aren't even any ends to at least try to justify the means.
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fallen_acorns
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Fragile is a brilliant attack though - no wonder its stuck so much recently.

Its both simultaneously insulting and patronizing, whilst also rendering any reply you can make as an example of your 'fragility'..

Its quite brilliant in undermining your oppositions argument.

I mean its also bat **** crazy and makes no sense at all, but its so effective. It leaves white people no choice.. Strong in your identity? Racist. Weak in your identity? Fragile, and racist..

The only thing that's permited is subservient/submissive... for now.
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Ascend
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^ Kafkatrap.
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fallen_acorns
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(Original post by Ascend)
^ Kafkatrap.
great word - didn't know that.
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DiddyDec
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(Original post by Ascend)
^ Kafkatrap.
I have learnt so many great words this week, as always PRSOM.
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imlikeahermit
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#52
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(Original post by Underscore__)
I’m not sure what your argument is, are you saying he’s not one of the best ever? The post made it sound like was an unremarkable kart driver who got to F1 because he was given more opportunity. Given how good he is that seems difficult to imagine. It feels almost like saying Messi was an average footballer but got lucky and was picked by Barcelona which is the only reason he’s become the best ever.

It annoys me to be defending him because he comes across as such a self righteous, sanctimonious ****
He's one of the best ever because he's been in good teams all of his life. Stick him on a team at the back of the grid and see if he still performs. I think, that is exactly what the post was saying. Some people were quite possibly better but didn't get the same opportunities. Messi has the statistics he has because he's been part of one of the worlds best teams for the majority of his career. Look at the Champions League this year against Bayern. The team played terrible and as a result he was unremarkable. Either way, I'd trust that Twitter post more than trusting your opinions on Hamiltons skill.

Your last sentence is something we can agree on.
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Underscore__
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
He's one of the best ever because he's been in good teams all of his life. Stick him on a team at the back of the grid and see if he still performs. I think, that is exactly what the post was saying. Some people were quite possibly better but didn't get the same opportunities. Messi has the statistics he has because he's been part of one of the worlds best teams for the majority of his career. Look at the Champions League this year against Bayern. The team played terrible and as a result he was unremarkable. Either way, I'd trust that Twitter post more than trusting your opinions on Hamiltons skill.

Your last sentence is something we can agree on.
I wasn't going to reply to this but the flagrant disrespect shown to the greatest footballer of all time is something I can't ignore. Messi was so remarkably good that Barcelona paid to move him to Spain when he was a child (which was uncommon in 2001) and paid for him to have hormone therapy because he has a HGH deficiency. He was then so much better than all of the other players who had grown up with the same training as him that he started playing regularly in one of the best teams in the world when he was 17 and by 22 he was the best footballer in the world. To suggest he is simply the beneficiary of playing in a good team and citing one bad game as proof shows a complete lack of knowledge of football. Neymar, Suarez, Pedro, Ibrahimovic, Villa, Eto'o, Henry and so many others played for Barcelona yet no sensible person would suggest they're anywhere near as good as Messi. All of the best footballers in history have played for good teams, it stands to reason that the best teams will have the best players.

Back to Lewis Hamilton; the same logic applies here, of course he has had tremendous opportunities but so has every professional F1 driver. Let's suppose it's true that he got his break because he was the only black kid and it was a PR move of sorts, that simply makes him look even better. It would mean that he got his place due to skin colour and the other drivers are there on merit yet he still beats all of them. Don't just take my word for it, google 'best F1 drivers ever' - I'd imagine any list published in the last few years will include him very close to the top.
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by Underscore__)
I wasn't going to reply to this but the flagrant disrespect shown to the greatest footballer of all time is something I can't ignore. Messi was so remarkably good that Barcelona paid to move him to Spain when he was a child (which was uncommon in 2001) and paid for him to have hormone therapy because he has a HGH deficiency. He was then so much better than all of the other players who had grown up with the same training as him that he started playing regularly in one of the best teams in the world when he was 17 and by 22 he was the best footballer in the world. To suggest he is simply the beneficiary of playing in a good team and citing one bad game as proof shows a complete lack of knowledge of football. Neymar, Suarez, Pedro, Ibrahimovic, Villa, Eto'o, Henry and so many others played for Barcelona yet no sensible person would suggest they're anywhere near as good as Messi. All of the best footballers in history have played for good teams, it stands to reason that the best teams will have the best players.

Back to Lewis Hamilton; the same logic applies here, of course he has had tremendous opportunities but so has every professional F1 driver. Let's suppose it's true that he got his break because he was the only black kid and it was a PR move of sorts, that simply makes him look even better. It would mean that he got his place due to skin colour and the other drivers are there on merit yet he still beats all of them. Don't just take my word for it, google 'best F1 drivers ever' - I'd imagine any list published in the last few years will include him very close to the top.
Oh I'm so glad you deemed it worth enough to reply... when your finished licking both of their arses if you can get back to me...

Stick Messi at Bournemouth and see how he does. Nothing more to say on the subject.

On Lewis Hamilton, your deluded. Either that or you haven't read that post properly. I'm not denying he's a good driver. To be fair, I couldn't care less. F1's as boring as hell at the moment. However, stick him in an average team and see how he does. Doing well with a **** car is the sign of a good driver. He beats them all because he has the best car. I don't think you'd deny that. Put Lando Norris in that Mercedes and he'd win every week.
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Underscore__
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(Original post by imlikeahermit)
Oh I'm so glad you deemed it worth enough to reply... when your finished licking both of their arses if you can get back to me...

Stick Messi at Bournemouth and see how he does. Nothing more to say on the subject.

On Lewis Hamilton, your deluded. Either that or you haven't read that post properly. I'm not denying he's a good driver. To be fair, I couldn't care less. F1's as boring as hell at the moment. However, stick him in an average team and see how he does. Doing well with a **** car is the sign of a good driver. He beats them all because he has the best car. I don't think you'd deny that. Put Lando Norris in that Mercedes and he'd win every week.
If Messi played for Bournemouth this season he'd score 50 goals at a canter but even trying to raise that point shows how little you know about football. No player would look as good playing for a bad team because football is a team sport and no one can go 1 v 11 but if you watched Messi playing at Bournemouth it would still be glaringly obvious how far ahead of the competition he is.

My point isn't that Hamilton is a 'good' driver, he's one of the greatest of all time, to suggest it's all the car is completely ignorant. It's interesting that you say that you don't care about F1 but you're so certain that Hamilton only wins because he apparently has the best car, what are you basing this on?
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N. Auditoré
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#56
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(Original post by Napp)
It isnt racist to post it, in of itself, it just happens to be used by racist. Never mind the irony of calling 'white people fragile' whilst in the same breath being, well, fragile.
It is when we look at the crank who came up with the pseudothought behind it. The 'academic' being little more than a disgrace to the profession and only marginally less despicable than Krug.


Case in point, calling people 'fragile' because you're insulting them based on race is really not a good path to be going down. A) Because it can be turned back on you very quickly and B) Because its not just poor debating but needlessly offensive to insinuate someone is 'fragile' because of their race. As an example, imagine if the table was flipped 180, i rather doubt the same tune would be being whistled... I can only imagine the outrage if i started calling blacks "fragile". Do you see my point?
I hate when ppl say ‘flip it 180°’ as that isn’t a fair representation, it defeats historical context. For example, what situations what you use black fragility in? Black people complaining about disparities in social class? Lack of resources. I’m flipping the script and well it doesn’t make sense.

Case in point: Black person gets killed by white person, black ppl get angry, white people call us fragile. That doesn’t look sensible to me.

Who actually made the point isn’t really relevant (that’s an ad hominem) the important thing is whether or not it’s factual in my opinion. If Adolf Hitler invented Pythagoras Theorem I wouldn’t be saying it isn’t correct just because an evil weirdo created it
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DiddyDec
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(Original post by N. Auditoré)
I hate when ppl say ‘flip it 180°’ as that isn’t a fair representation, it defeats historical context. For example, what situations what you use black fragility in? Black people complaining about disparities in social class? Lack of resources. I’m flipping the script and well it doesn’t make sense.

Case in point: Black person gets killed by white person, black ppl get angry, white people call us fragile. That doesn’t look sensible to me.

Who actually made the point isn’t really relevant (that’s an ad hominem) the important thing is whether or not it’s factual in my opinion. If Adolf Hitler invented Pythagoras Theorem I wouldn’t be saying it isn’t correct just because an evil weirdo created it
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Gundabad(good)
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(Original post by Andrew97)
https://news.sky.com/story/britains-...aints-12066382


The performance saw Ashley Banjo be knelt on by a white officer while officers with riot shields danced around in reference to the killing of George Floyd. The dance was performed by a group called diversity and received 1,100 or so complaints
Entertainment shows shouldn't get political unless they are specifically made to be political.
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04MR17
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I have seen the dance, I didn't see anything questionable about it.
Performance art has commented on social issues for centuries, I don't see why a dance troupe called Diversity(!) should be any different.

EDIT #1: Those arguing that the broadcasters ought to show balance need to distinguish between a public broadcaster with impartiality rules and a private companies that can present whatever it legally wants to. Why don't ITV deserve to make decisions for themselves?

EDIT #2: I'm really struggling to work out what this dance has to do with Spanish Footballers or Formula 1 to be honest.
Last edited by 04MR17; 2 weeks ago
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Iñigo de Loyola
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(Original post by N. Auditoré)
Those 2 are not the same as you purposely made Jews, the marginally oppressed group the aggressor to fuel a stereotype and make me look bad. Also, my joke was still based on an element of realism, if u think it’s ’racist’ then that’s cute. I would think your ancestors were slave traders if you found black men being murdered by an institution created by slavery offensive, no? Or are you offended that the institution created originally to catch slaves (the American Police) aren’t killing enough black ppl? See how ur comparison makes no sense when contextualised? Wouldn’t you find it weird if a German person got offended by another German killing a Jew but instead of taking offence at the German they were offended at the Jews?????

I’m pretty certain that hermit person is white. Assuming someone’s race isn’t racist depending on the reason, if I assume you’re white because you go around saying that BLM groups are Marxist zionists or whatever that ain’t really a me problem.

I’m talking about a number of killings. All lives matter is definitely fragility because you somehow feel that you matter less because people are fighting for equality, pretty fragile if u ask me

I didn’t say they can’t be targeted in racial attacks i said they aren’t the ‘targeted demographic’ i.e. they are not the most likely to be on receiving end, read my messages properly. The 2 are incomparable.
Saying Jews were ”marginally oppressed” is anti-Semitic.

The institution of policing was not created by slavery.

None of my family were slave traders, and just because your distant ancestors held objectionable beliefs doesn't mean you hold those beliefs.

If BLM aren't Marxists why do I keep seeing Socialist Workers' Party signs at BLM protests?

What race is more likely to be targeted in attacks hugely depends on where in the world you are.
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