Please help - reporting my dad for tax evasion.

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Anonymous #1
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So my mum and dad have never married and have an extremely strained relationship when it comes to money. Unfortunately, we still live with my dad as that is the only way he’ll provide support for my sister (I’m now at uni and he makes nearly zero contribution for my studies). He’s repeatedly lied to HMRC about his income, declaring it as something like 19k a year when he owns his own business, boasts about thousands of pounds of deals he makes and receives over 4k in dividends per month (he’s told us this). He lied so that he didn’t need to pay child maintenance when we lived apart - my mum was unemployed at the time so we didn’t have any other choice but to move in so that he’d pay something towards me and my sisters living costs.

I don’t know whether to report him as he keeps making threats to take my mum to court, call social services on her etc and still pays far below what he should in terms of child maintenance. I’m reluctant to report him since we live together and he’d definitely suspect me since he’s divulged so much information to me. I know it’s anonymous and he deserves to be reported (he’s been convicted of domestic violence and related abuses) so I don’t feel bad but I don’t know what kind of impact this would have and if it would backfire. Please help
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Anonymous #2
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Be honest, if you do the right thing and report your dad, it will allow your mum to receive more money to take care of you and your siblings. Doing this doesn’t just protect you, but also your mum.
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PhoenixFortune
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(Original post by Anonymous)
So my mum and dad have never married and have an extremely strained relationship when it comes to money. Unfortunately, we still live with my dad as that is the only way he’ll provide support for my sister (I’m now at uni and he makes nearly zero contribution for my studies). He’s repeatedly lied to HMRC about his income, declaring it as something like 19k a year when he owns his own business, boasts about thousands of pounds of deals he makes and receives over 4k in dividends per month (he’s told us this). He lied so that he didn’t need to pay child maintenance when we lived apart - my mum was unemployed at the time so we didn’t have any other choice but to move in so that he’d pay something towards me and my sisters living costs.

I don’t know whether to report him as he keeps making threats to take my mum to court, call social services on her etc and still pays far below what he should in terms of child maintenance. I’m reluctant to report him since we live together and he’d definitely suspect me since he’s divulged so much information to me. I know it’s anonymous and he deserves to be reported (he’s been convicted of domestic violence and related abuses) so I don’t feel bad but I don’t know what kind of impact this would have and if it would backfire. Please help
There's a few things you need to think about: yes, your dad has (and continues to) commit a crime, but you don't want to do anything that could make your living situation worse.

1) If your dad was arrested and then released on bail, would he become aggressive and violent towards your mum/sister? Given that he may strongly suspect you, you must put your own safety and that of your family first.
2) Depending on how much he profited from his tax evasion and how long he has done this for, your dad may get a county court judgement put out against him. If he owns the house that your sister/mum live in (and doesn't have any other assets), then he will most likely be forced to sell to pay back all the money he was given due to his lies. How would this affect you and your family's living situation? Will you have somewhere else you can live, or afford to live elsewhere?
3) Again, depending on how severe they judge his crime to be, he may serve prison time.
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shak101
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(Original post by Anonymous)
So my mum and dad have never married and have an extremely strained relationship when it comes to money. Unfortunately, we still live with my dad as that is the only way he’ll provide support for my sister (I’m now at uni and he makes nearly zero contribution for my studies). He’s repeatedly lied to HMRC about his income, declaring it as something like 19k a year when he owns his own business, boasts about thousands of pounds of deals he makes and receives over 4k in dividends per month (he’s told us this). He lied so that he didn’t need to pay child maintenance when we lived apart - my mum was unemployed at the time so we didn’t have any other choice but to move in so that he’d pay something towards me and my sisters living costs.

I don’t know whether to report him as he keeps making threats to take my mum to court, call social services on her etc and still pays far below what he should in terms of child maintenance. I’m reluctant to report him since we live together and he’d definitely suspect me since he’s divulged so much information to me. I know it’s anonymous and he deserves to be reported (he’s been convicted of domestic violence and related abuses) so I don’t feel bad but I don’t know what kind of impact this would have and if it would backfire. Please help
I don't think you should - at least for the time being. Not because I don't think tax dodgers should be hounded, but because it sounds like you and your mum aren't in a good position financially. You said he receives £48k in dividends a year, depending upon how many years he's done this for - that's a hell of a lot of tax due, bearing in mind HMRC are allowed to go back 20 years.

He is going to get a combined tax bill. Does he have assets other than his home to pay for it? If not, and he ends up having to sell the home, where are your mum and sister going to go?
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Etomidate
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Corporation tax is much more complicated than reporting an earnings figure to the HMRC.

Dividend income can be received in a tax-free wrapper and therefore aren't susceptible to tax.
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shak101
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(Original post by Anonymous)
Be honest, if you do the right thing and report your dad, it will allow your mum to receive more money to take care of you and your siblings. Doing this doesn’t just protect you, but also your mum.
That's not necessarily true. He will get a tax bill and possibly an additional fine. He may or may not have assets to pay for it. You don't know whether he has saved his money or not, if he hasn't then OP is in a situation where his dad is selling the house - that's not great for their mum/sister.

Waiting a couple years would probably be better, criminal liability for tax avoidance lasts for decades anyway.
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Anonymous #3
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As much as your dad might be a **** and not doing right by you and your mum you don’t report family..tax evasion is serious time depending where you are like **** me in UK people are in prison with more time for tax evasion than they are assaults and rape. Personally would never report my family to police and if you do then all it’s going to do is push him more away and he’ll never speak to you or pay anything towards you either way not to mention he would hate all of you and probably would become aggressive, Think the guy above explained it well.

Don’t report family and even if they are being ***** all it will do is destroy the relationship fully and put you and your mum at risk, don’t think you’ve thought it through enough.
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mnot
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(Original post by Anonymous)
So my mum and dad have never married and have an extremely strained relationship when it comes to money. Unfortunately, we still live with my dad as that is the only way he’ll provide support for my sister (I’m now at uni and he makes nearly zero contribution for my studies). He’s repeatedly lied to HMRC about his income, declaring it as something like 19k a year when he owns his own business, boasts about thousands of pounds of deals he makes and receives over 4k in dividends per month (he’s told us this). He lied so that he didn’t need to pay child maintenance when we lived apart - my mum was unemployed at the time so we didn’t have any other choice but to move in so that he’d pay something towards me and my sisters living costs.

I don’t know whether to report him as he keeps making threats to take my mum to court, call social services on her etc and still pays far below what he should in terms of child maintenance. I’m reluctant to report him since we live together and he’d definitely suspect me since he’s divulged so much information to me. I know it’s anonymous and he deserves to be reported (he’s been convicted of domestic violence and related abuses) so I don’t feel bad but I don’t know what kind of impact this would have and if it would backfire. Please help
If he owns a business, its likely he's not lying about his income.

As income taxes are high its well known you take a low/modest income then take most of the cash as dividend payments.
So essentially he would likely pay corporate tax & depending how much money in dividends their will be an additional dividend tax.
Its really just about maximising accounting efficiency & is common practice for business owners.
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marple
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(Original post by Anonymous)
So my mum and dad have never married and have an extremely strained relationship when it comes to money. Unfortunately, we still live with my dad as that is the only way he’ll provide support for my sister (I’m now at uni and he makes nearly zero contribution for my studies). He’s repeatedly lied to HMRC about his income, declaring it as something like 19k a year when he owns his own business, boasts about thousands of pounds of deals he makes and receives over 4k in dividends per month (he’s told us this). He lied so that he didn’t need to pay child maintenance when we lived apart - my mum was unemployed at the time so we didn’t have any other choice but to move in so that he’d pay something towards me and my sisters living costs.

I don’t know whether to report him as he keeps making threats to take my mum to court, call social services on her etc and still pays far below what he should in terms of child maintenance. I’m reluctant to report him since we live together and he’d definitely suspect me since he’s divulged so much information to me. I know it’s anonymous and he deserves to be reported (he’s been convicted of domestic violence and related abuses) so I don’t feel bad but I don’t know what kind of impact this would have and if it would backfire. Please help
I'm sorry you are in this position, but realistically you don't know his financial/taxation situation and these things can be complicated. A more constructive approach would be to get your mum to seek proper legal advice so that she can move forward with her life and leave this abusive relationship.
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by shak101)
That's not necessarily true. He will get a tax bill and possibly an additional fine. He may or may not have assets to pay for it. You don't know whether he has saved his money or not, if he hasn't then OP is in a situation where his dad is selling the house - that's not great for their mum/sister.

Waiting a couple years would probably be better, criminal liability for tax avoidance lasts for decades anyway.
At the moment we’re renting as my dad sold our family home and kept all the profit as he threatened my mum to remove her name from the house a long time ago - I don’t know how this happened but he used to attack her and throw her down the stairs so I imagine she was afraid. I think it might be better if he was behind bars since he won’t support us either way
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by Anonymous)
As much as your dad might be a **** and not doing right by you and your mum you don’t report family..tax evasion is serious time depending where you are like **** me in UK people are in prison with more time for tax evasion than they are assaults and rape. Personally would never report my family to police and if you do then all it’s going to do is push him more away and he’ll never speak to you or pay anything towards you either way not to mention he would hate all of you and probably would become aggressive, Think the guy above explained it well.

Don’t report family and even if they are being ***** all it will do is destroy the relationship fully and put you and your mum at risk, don’t think you’ve thought it through enough.
I don’t care about my relationship with him at this point - he isn’t family to me. Honestly I’d be very happy if he went to prison.
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by mnot)
If he owns a business, its likely he's not lying about his income.

As income taxes are high its well known you take a low/modest income then take most of the cash as dividend payments.
So essentially he would likely pay corporate tax & depending how much money in dividends their will be an additional dividend tax.
Its really just about maximising accounting efficiency & is common practice for business owners.
Yes, this is what I expect however surely he needs to declare his income from dividends?
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vix.xvi
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(Original post by shak101)
I don't think you should - at least for the time being. Not because I don't think tax dodgers should be hounded, but because it sounds like you and your mum aren't in a good position financially. You said he receives £48k in dividends a year, depending upon how many years he's done this for - that's a hell of a lot of tax due, bearing in mind HMRC are allowed to go back 20 years.

He is going to get a combined tax bill. Does he have assets other than his home to pay for it? If not, and he ends up having to sell the home, where are your mum and sister going to go?
i agree...
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by shak101)
I don't think you should - at least for the time being. Not because I don't think tax dodgers should be hounded, but because it sounds like you and your mum aren't in a good position financially. You said he receives £48k in dividends a year, depending upon how many years he's done this for - that's a hell of a lot of tax due, bearing in mind HMRC are allowed to go back 20 years.

He is going to get a combined tax bill. Does he have assets other than his home to pay for it? If not, and he ends up having to sell the home, where are your mum and sister going to go?
He’s already sold our family home and has kept the profit (£500k). My mum has a job now that pays over 50k a year so we’re in a position to move out of our rented home
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mnot
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(Original post by Anonymous)
Yes, this is what I expect however surely he needs to declare his income from dividends?
technically its different from personal income, its more like a payout from an investment.

I guess it depends what was agreed when the child support arrangement was drawn up.
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by mnot)
technically its different from personal income, its more like a payout from an investment.

I guess it depends what was agreed when the child support arrangement was drawn up.
Child maintenance is based on income - he’s concealed his income and sold the family home in the meantime, pocketing it all. Oh well, if there’s nothing to be done then good on him for being able to ruin as many lives as possible I guess
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mnot
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(Original post by Anonymous)
Child maintenance is based on income - he’s concealed his income and sold the family home in the meantime, pocketing it all. Oh well, if there’s nothing to be done then good on him for being able to ruin as many lives as possible I guess
The thing is its fairly standard practice for business owners to pay themselves a modest income and take the rest as efficiently as possible. Had your parents been married your mother may have been entitled to a share of the business, but they weren't.
If the house is in his name and he bought it then technically it was his asset to cash in.

I understand you feel as a father he should contribute more. But moral & legal obligations are not the same thing.
(if you want advise you should ask a lawyer, rather then an anonymous forum).
Last edited by mnot; 4 weeks ago
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by mnot)
The thing is its fairly standard practice for business owners to pay themselves a modest income and take the rest as efficiently as possible. Had your parents been married your mother may have been entitled to a share of the business, but they weren't.
If the house is in his name and he bought it then technically it was his asset to cash in.

I understand you feel as a father he should contribute more. But moral & legal obligations are not the same thing.
(if you want advise you should ask a lawyer, rather then an anonymous forum).
Tbh I’m more frustrated at this country’s legislation surrounding this issue as it’s pretty common from what I’ve seen online. Of course I feel it personally as I feel sick whenever he’s around but that’s not the point. In other countries such as Germany there’s legislation to help children and single parents in these situations and I’m pretty shocked/disappointed at how backward it is in the UK
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shak101
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(Original post by Anonymous)
He’s already sold our family home and has kept the profit (£500k). My mum has a job now that pays over 50k a year so we’re in a position to move out of our rented home
Fair enough, go for it then I suppose. Even if you are incorrect (which as other's have pointed out you may well be) you don't actually lose anything - HMRC doesn't do anything to you if you're claims weren't correct. That being said, if you are correct then it's far more likely that the government is going to benefit rather then you, your mum or sister.
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Anonymous #1
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(Original post by shak101)
Fair enough, go for it then I suppose. Even if you are incorrect (which as other's have pointed out you may well be) you don't actually lose anything - HMRC doesn't do anything to you if you're claims weren't correct. That being said, if you are correct then it's far more likely that the government is going to benefit rather then you, your mum or sister.
Tbh I don’t know what to do, I’m stuck in this toxic household with no way out it seems. I can’t save up as I can only get the minimum maintenance loan (my dad will not provide his income information to SFE to spite me as he thinks I should be paying my own way and it’s against data protection for SFE to demand this info from HMRC). At times I want to drop out of uni and get away from his constant threats and demands to pay him back for the money he spent on me when I was growing up
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