How about clinical neuropsychology?

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kester.t_
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So my chances of getting into medicine aren’t looking great which was really heart breaking but here I am just moving on and I found clinical neuropsychology.

I love the idea if helping people and I love the brain hence why this profession however all the information about it is scattered and I’m not too sure what to do so I’m here asking for someone to tell me how to become a clinical neuropsychologist and the stages of it including the degrees and any research if needed.

If there are any other careers similar to medicine and relating to the brain then please do tell me and not trying to be all about the money but I’d rather a fairly high paying job so that I can secure financial stability
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bones-mccoy
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From my understanding, you'd follow a Psychology path and then do a postgraduate qualification in Neuropsychology

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/exp...ropsychologist
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ecolier
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(Original post by kester.t_)
So my chances of getting into medicine aren’t looking great which was really heart breaking but here I am just moving on and I found clinical neuropsychology.

I love the idea if helping people and I love the brain hence why this profession however all the information about it is scattered and I’m not too sure what to do so I’m here asking for someone to tell me how to become a clinical neuropsychologist and the stages of it including the degrees and any research if needed.

If there are any other careers similar to medicine and relating to the brain then please do tell me and not trying to be all about the money but I’d rather a fairly high paying job so that I can secure financial stability
Why not consider Physician Associate? It's literally like working as a junior doctor.

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/exp...cian-associate

UCLan and Reading offer this at undergraduate level, taking 4 years.
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marinade
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(Original post by kester.t_)
I love the idea if helping people and I love the brain hence why this profession however all the information about it is scattered and I’m not too sure what to do so I’m here asking for someone to tell me how to become a clinical neuropsychologist and the stages of it including the degrees and any research if needed.
Because it's pretty rare.

You become an clinical neuropsychologist by completing a doctorate in clinical or educational psychology and then by invitation completing a professional post-doctoral qualification called QiCN which it happens is a master's or postgraduate diploma/certificate, which confuses people.

To be brief the chances of you becoming a clinical neuropsychologist are far worse than getting into medicine.
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Lord Asriel
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(Original post by marinade)
Because it's pretty rare.

You become an clinical neuropsychologist by completing a doctorate in clinical or educational psychology and then by invitation completing a professional post-doctoral qualification called QiCN which it happens is a master's or postgraduate diploma/certificate, which confuses people.

To be brief the chances of you becoming a clinical neuropsychologist are far worse than getting into medicine.
Clinical neuropsychology is something that is frequently misunderstood. In its applied form it's really a sub speciality of clinical psychology (or sometimes educational psychology). Or it can be approached from an research perspective, where it becomes a part of the more empirical end of academic psychology.

Here is a link that tells you more about it: https://www.bps.org.uk/sites/bps.org...psychology.pdf

If you can do try to attend talks or lectures given by CNs in your local area, as they can be really interesting and you may get a chance to ask them questions.

As marinade suggests, in order to become a CN who directly works with patients you will be looking at 3 year undergrad psychology + relevant experience (2 years plus) + 3 year clinical doctorate + post doctoral Msc/PGdip in neuropsychology (1-2 years depending on if full or part time). You would be looking at being about 30 before you are fully qualified in that area.

In contrast, even if you were to do graduate medicine as a second degree you would qualify in something like neurology a lot sooner (and possibly be at consultant grade around a comparable age depending on the part of the country you are in).
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kester.t_
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(Original post by bones-mccoy)
From my understanding, you'd follow a Psychology path and then do a postgraduate qualification in Neuropsychology

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/exp...ropsychologist
Does the undergraduate psychology degree need to be accredited though because I plan to go to university if Leicester but I don’t think they’re undergraduates psychology courses are accredited.

Also do U think it’s possible to go through via neuroscience?
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marinade
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(Original post by kester.t_)
Does the undergraduate psychology degree need to be accredited though because I plan to go to university if Leicester but I don’t think they’re undergraduates psychology courses are accredited.

Also do U think it’s possible to go through via neuroscience?
You need BPS accreditation.
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kester.t_
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(Original post by Lord Asriel)
Clinical neuropsychology is something that is frequently misunderstood. In its applied form it's really a sub speciality of clinical psychology (or sometimes educational psychology). Or it can be approached from an research perspective, where it becomes a part of the more empirical end of academic psychology.

Here is a link that tells you more about it: https://www.bps.org.uk/sites/bps.org...psychology.pdf

If you can do try to attend talks or lectures given by CNs in your local area, as they can be really interesting and you may get a chance to ask them questions.

As marinade suggests, in order to become a CN who directly works with patients you will be looking at 3 year undergrad psychology + relevant experience (2 years plus) + 3 year clinical doctorate + post doctoral Msc/PGdip in neuropsychology (1-2 years depending on if full or part time). You would be looking at being about 30 before you are fully qualified in that area.

In contrast, even if you were to do graduate medicine as a second degree you would qualify in something like neurology a lot sooner (and possibly be at consultant grade around a comparable age depending on the part of the country you are in).
I’m in the UK and thanks for your reply that was very helpful, however do you think I can go into the same profession with a neuroscience undergraduate degree rather than a psychology degree.

And is there any other similar careers that deal with neurology that doesn’t require a medicine degree but still has high pay (as of course to become financially stable is everyone’s goal)
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GabiAbi84
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(Original post by kester.t_)
I’m in the UK and thanks for your reply that was very helpful, however do you think I can go into the same profession with a neuroscience undergraduate degree rather than a psychology)
Not really as a neuroscience degree would not be BPS accredited and you would then have to do a further masters conversion course after undergrad
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Interrobang
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(Original post by kester.t_)
Does the undergraduate psychology degree need to be accredited though because I plan to go to university if Leicester but I don’t think they’re undergraduates psychology courses are accredited.

Also do U think it’s possible to go through via neuroscience?
Leicester has a few accredited courses
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GabiAbi84
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(Original post by kester.t_)
Does the undergraduate psychology degree need to be accredited though because I plan to go to university if Leicester but I don’t think they’re undergraduates psychology courses are accredited.

Also do U think it’s possible to go through via neuroscience?
Leicester university’s website says that all their undergrad psychology degrees are BPS accredited.
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kester.t_
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(Original post by GabiAbi84)
Leicester university’s website says that all their undergrad psychology degrees are BPS accredited.
Yepp i just checked it all as well, ok clear with doing the psychology degree then masters in neuropsychology but I’m still in the woods about how the phd would be done and roughly how many years all this would take me including if work experience is necessary
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GabiAbi84
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(Original post by kester.t_)
Yepp i just checked it all as well, ok clear with doing the psychology degree then masters in neuropsychology but I’m still in the woods about how the phd would be done and roughly how many years all this would take me including if work experience is necessary
I suggest you re-read lord Asriel’s response. They have laid it all out there.
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marinade
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(Original post by kester.t_)
Yepp i just checked it all as well, ok clear with doing the psychology degree then masters in neuropsychology but I’m still in the woods about how the phd would be done and roughly how many years all this would take me including if work experience is necessary
BSc Psychology (BPS) ---> years of experience --> clinical/educational doctorate --> QiCN (let's call it a master's)

Or
Neuroscience (non-BPS) ---> MSc Psychology conversion (BPS) ---> years of experience ---> clinical/educational doctorate --> QiCN (let's call it a master's)

If you want to do other things in neuropsychology or brain stuff I don't know.

Generally Psychology graduates do not have particularly high earnings.
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kester.t_
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(Original post by Lord Asriel)
Clinical neuropsychology is something that is frequently misunderstood. In its applied form it's really a sub speciality of clinical psychology (or sometimes educational psychology). Or it can be approached from an research perspective, where it becomes a part of the more empirical end of academic psychology.

Here is a link that tells you more about it: https://www.bps.org.uk/sites/bps.org...psychology.pdf

If you can do try to attend talks or lectures given by CNs in your local area, as they can be really interesting and you may get a chance to ask them questions.

As marinade suggests, in order to become a CN who directly works with patients you will be looking at 3 year undergrad psychology + relevant experience (2 years plus) + 3 year clinical doctorate + post doctoral Msc/PGdip in neuropsychology (1-2 years depending on if full or part time). You would be looking at being about 30 before you are fully qualified in that area.

In contrast, even if you were to do graduate medicine as a second degree you would qualify in something like neurology a lot sooner (and possibly be at consultant grade around a comparable age depending on the part of the country you are in).

So just to be clear let’s say I’m a graduate with a psychology bsc degree my next step would be to find work experience right? But can I go straight into a masters on neuropsychology or is it a must that I do work experience and if so what kind of work experience.

Also I saw on websites that you also have to do a phd so can that be done during ur masters or must it be done after ur masters and what do you do in a phd and what type of phd am I looking for.

Finally how long would this all be in years like so what’s the shortest number of years this can be done it and what’s the longest number of years to be able to be a fully qualified clinical neuropsychologist that can work full time at the NHS for example.

Sorry for so many questions but I’m really pedantic and like planning everything out very well.
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kester.t_
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(Original post by marinade)
BSc Psychology (BPS) ---> years of experience --> clinical/educational doctorate --> QiCN (let's call it a master's)

Or
Neuroscience (non-BPS) ---> MSc Psychology conversion (BPS) ---> years of experience ---> clinical/educational doctorate --> QiCN (let's call it a master's)

If you want to do other things in neuropsychology or brain stuff I don't know.

Generally Psychology graduates do not have particularly high earnings.
I’ve checked the pay of an clinical neuropsychologist in the NHS and it says that I’d enter at band 7 once fully qualified
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marinade
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(Original post by kester.t_)
I’ve checked the pay of an clinical neuropsychologist in the NHS and it says that I’d enter at band 7 once fully qualified
It is indeed and you could have asked us that, but that doesn't have very much to do with my points.

All right. Let's do this in rough numbers.

Every year around 40,000 people graduate with a Psychology undergrad degree.
Every year around 10,000 people graduate with a Psychology postgraduate master's degree.
Every year there are 203 educational Psychology doctorate places.
Every year there are something like 600 clinical doctorate places.

50,000 is a much bigger number than the (less than) 1,000 doctorate places.
Of those (less than) 1000 places per year few go on to become clinical neuropsychologists.
Last edited by marinade; 1 year ago
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ecolier
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(Original post by kester.t_)
...And is there any other similar careers that deal with neurology that doesn’t require a medicine degree but still has high pay (as of course to become financially stable is everyone’s goal)
I am a neurologist and there aren't many non-medical careers* that deal with neurology... I would argue that psychology and psychiatry / clinical neurology etc. are very very different.

*Excluding allied-healthcare professions like neurology specialist nurses, neurophysiologists etc.
Last edited by ecolier; 1 year ago
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GabiAbi84
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(Original post by kester.t_)
So just to be clear let’s say I’m a graduate with a psychology bsc degree my next step would be to find work experience right? But can I go straight into a masters on neuropsychology or is it a must that I do work experience and if so what kind of work experience.

Also I saw on websites that you also have to do a phd so can that be done during ur masters or must it be done after ur masters and what do you do in a phd and what type of phd am I looking for.

Finally how long would this all be in years like so what’s the shortest number of years this can be done it and what’s the longest number of years to be able to be a fully qualified clinical neuropsychologist that can work full time at the NHS for example.

Sorry for so many questions but I’m really pedantic and like planning everything out very well.
Undergrad psychology degree 3 years
Experience (AP or similar) bare minimum 2 years
Clinical doctorate/educational psych 3 years
Work in specialist service -Bare minimum 1 years
Then post doctoral QiCN 2 years

Bare Minimum 11 years

Competition for clinical doctorate is immense as is going on to the post doctoral QiCn
Last edited by GabiAbi84; 1 year ago
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marinade
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(Original post by kester.t_)
So just to be clear let’s say I’m a graduate with a psychology bsc degree my next step would be to find work experience right? But can I go straight into a masters on neuropsychology or is it a must that I do work experience and if so what kind of work experience.

Also I saw on websites that you also have to do a phd so can that be done during ur masters or must it be done after ur masters and what do you do in a phd and what type of phd am I looking for.

Finally how long would this all be in years like so what’s the shortest number of years this can be done it and what’s the longest number of years to be able to be a fully qualified clinical neuropsychologist that can work full time at the NHS for example.
You cannot do the QiCN aka accredited master's in neuropsychology straight away. It's effectively by invitation only as you need a supervisor. You cannot. You must have a doctorate in educational or clinical psychology and then apply having picked up someone to supervise you.

Max age is not defined. There are people in their 30s who get on the clinical doctorate. I personally know one.

The 'PhD' you want is called a doctorate in clinical psychology, aka 'clinical doctorate', aka DClinPsy, aka DClinPsych, aka DClinPsychol, aka PsychD (rare) and aka ClinPsyD (unusual). There are other PhDs in the 'area' of clinical psychology, in fact lots of them depending on the uni you go to, but they aren't practicing chartered psychologists and their jobs will have some overlaps.

PhD is often used as a generic name for a variety of doctorates. So the one we're talking about is called a clinical doctorate, if it isn't on this page https://www.bps.org.uk/public/become...edited-courses then you can't become a clinical psychologist and therefore a clinical neuropsychologist eventually .

Same thing for educational doctorate.

The confusion here is that you seem to think there won't be qualifications after a doctorate. In the workforce if there is some kind of regulation by a body or a statutory regulator there are all sorts of qualifications required. To do a silly example to understand become a clinical neuropsychologist the BPS selects the level it thinks is right, it could be a GCSE in Clinical Neuropsychology which you can only get on by invitation. It isn't it's a master's or PGDip/Cert. A postdoctoral qualification could be many different levels.

---------------------------
What work experience is, especially the lower levels is another whole vast thread in itself.
Last edited by marinade; 1 year ago
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