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State of the developer careers market?
What is the state of the current jobs market? I am looking on sites like GradCracker and TargetJobs for technology (Developer) jobs, whether it is mobile development, desktop applications, web development, and there doesn't seem to be many jobs, only 1-2 pages for each type in my city (Birmingham).
What is the current state of the market due to COVID-19? Much fewer jobs? About the same?
What is the current state of the market due to COVID-19? Much fewer jobs? About the same?
Roles are thin on the ground whilst companies await the fallout of the pandemic. There are still positions, but mostly for senior engineers (5+ years).
It’s a difficult time to get a junior role.
It’s a difficult time to get a junior role.
Original post by Spratty
What is the current state of the market due to COVID-19? Much fewer jobs? About the same?
It depends what sector. Online retailers have seen a lot more traffic directed from the high streets to their online stores, hence a need for more IT staff. My company, in public services, hasn't really been impacted much financially by the pandemic.
Hi - Sorry for jumping in on your chat topic - however I am looking to see if there is any such thing as being able to use students studying certain topics such as
Original post by TurkeyDinosa79
Hi - Sorry for jumping in on your chat topic - however I am looking to see if there is any such thing as being able to use students studying certain topics such as
can you elaborate?
Ah, the “if you don’t hire juniors, you don’t hire seniors” meme.
Let me put it from the employer’s perspective.
Juniors are not usually net contributors. They require a lot of support, usually from expensive senior developers. They need a lot of time, and they can’t get much done by themselves. They aren’t as highly paid as seniors but they are still quite pricey compared to most staff in a company. They want investment but are prone to jump ship as soon as their conditions improve.
Here’s how I’ve seen it happen with more than one junior: they join as a new grad and require a year of support before they’re competent. At this point their employment opportunities improve and they suddenly demand a big salary hike. Now the employer must either go through the process again or pay the same amount they would if they’d hired someone trained in the first place.
It doesn’t work. There’s no incentive. Juniors are a really difficult thing to justify in many teams. Many of them wash out or discover the job isn’t for them, so it’s not like a guaranteed return on investment. Companies routinely underestimate how much support juniors need and it burns them.
What we could really do with is extended education, maybe a four of five year process with industrial placements, and the extra years sponsored by an employer on condition of work. That’s how it works in other engineering sectors.
Let me put it from the employer’s perspective.
Juniors are not usually net contributors. They require a lot of support, usually from expensive senior developers. They need a lot of time, and they can’t get much done by themselves. They aren’t as highly paid as seniors but they are still quite pricey compared to most staff in a company. They want investment but are prone to jump ship as soon as their conditions improve.
Here’s how I’ve seen it happen with more than one junior: they join as a new grad and require a year of support before they’re competent. At this point their employment opportunities improve and they suddenly demand a big salary hike. Now the employer must either go through the process again or pay the same amount they would if they’d hired someone trained in the first place.
It doesn’t work. There’s no incentive. Juniors are a really difficult thing to justify in many teams. Many of them wash out or discover the job isn’t for them, so it’s not like a guaranteed return on investment. Companies routinely underestimate how much support juniors need and it burns them.
What we could really do with is extended education, maybe a four of five year process with industrial placements, and the extra years sponsored by an employer on condition of work. That’s how it works in other engineering sectors.
Original post by IWMTom
Dunno about you guys but since the new year my LinkedIn has been going absolutely nuts with roles. They seem plentiful, even up here in the North East!
Totally agree! A good LinkedIn profile can be invaluable.
A few years ago, someone at the careers service at my university said she reckons CVs will be a thing of the past and LinkedIn will be the go to
Original post by yojimbo_beta
Ah, the “if you don’t hire juniors, you don’t hire seniors” meme.
Let me put it from the employer’s perspective.
Juniors are not usually net contributors. They require a lot of support, usually from expensive senior developers. They need a lot of time, and they can’t get much done by themselves. They aren’t as highly paid as seniors but they are still quite pricey compared to most staff in a company. They want investment but are prone to jump ship as soon as their conditions improve.
Here’s how I’ve seen it happen with more than one junior: they join as a new grad and require a year of support before they’re competent. At this point their employment opportunities improve and they suddenly demand a big salary hike. Now the employer must either go through the process again or pay the same amount they would if they’d hired someone trained in the first place.
It doesn’t work. There’s no incentive. Juniors are a really difficult thing to justify in many teams. Many of them wash out or discover the job isn’t for them, so it’s not like a guaranteed return on investment. Companies routinely underestimate how much support juniors need and it burns them.
What we could really do with is extended education, maybe a four of five year process with industrial placements, and the extra years sponsored by an employer on condition of work. That’s how it works in other engineering sectors.
Let me put it from the employer’s perspective.
Juniors are not usually net contributors. They require a lot of support, usually from expensive senior developers. They need a lot of time, and they can’t get much done by themselves. They aren’t as highly paid as seniors but they are still quite pricey compared to most staff in a company. They want investment but are prone to jump ship as soon as their conditions improve.
Here’s how I’ve seen it happen with more than one junior: they join as a new grad and require a year of support before they’re competent. At this point their employment opportunities improve and they suddenly demand a big salary hike. Now the employer must either go through the process again or pay the same amount they would if they’d hired someone trained in the first place.
It doesn’t work. There’s no incentive. Juniors are a really difficult thing to justify in many teams. Many of them wash out or discover the job isn’t for them, so it’s not like a guaranteed return on investment. Companies routinely underestimate how much support juniors need and it burns them.
What we could really do with is extended education, maybe a four of five year process with industrial placements, and the extra years sponsored by an employer on condition of work. That’s how it works in other engineering sectors.
There was talk of making degrees part time in my uni, full time degrees useless if you don't get experience. The problem is companies would have to open many more degree apprenticeships or take on undergrads that study part time.
Original post by oglez92
So you don't have time to develop and invest in people? So you're just expecting the finished product? Are people allowed to make mistakes in your culture? If you don't have time for juniors you don't deserve seniors
Not exactly easy when every is working remotely. Time isn't the only factor there.
Also nobody deserves anything, one pays money to get people. If you pay the cash you get the people. Having junior staff just means you create a talent pipeline that you can typically pay less than their true market rate through their career.
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