Should there be a lockdown referendum in the UK?

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Lucifer323
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#41
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
They don’t ask you to not drink drive for example. They pass laws to tell you. Not only to protect you, but more importantly to protect others.

Lockdowns not going to stop Covid, but it slows the rate of it spreading to give hospitals a chance to deal with those who have caught it, are unlucky enough to need treatment and give them a chance to survive it.

I don’t know what controls you think as being implemented by having to wear a face mask. You only have to wear it when you’re in an environment around others to minimise the risk of you catching it, or speeding it. Number star coming down, but people don’t wear masks all of the time. I don’t wear one at home.

It’s a crappy time for everybody, but to be honest other than not being able to take the kids out at the weekend, I see no attack on my ordinal liberties.

I’m more than happy to follow the rules. Then again I have a friend whose an A&E consultant who’s on the front line dealing with this stuff. She’s delay with people who have had it. She’s had it herself. She’s dealt with the fall out of the excessive pressure it’s pit on the NHS dealing with other non Covid related Iain’s in hospitals. She’s had to deal with patients dying from it. She even told me about one guy who she treated who was fighting for breath who refused to wear a mask as he believed it was all made up and she didn’t know what she was talking about.

Suck it up cupcake. Baboons have been developed, they’re rolling them out at a rate of knots and the end is in site.
Again you remind us of the other user who appealed to emotion and created stories that he was a teacher and his wife a nurse.

You have a very similar writing style by the way.

Now you have claim that you have a female consultant friend who works at A&E. She had Covid herself and had to deal with patients dying from it.

Same old stories, a few characters have changed.

Why does someone have to take these stories seriously or you as the matter of fact?
It's best if you debate these stories somewhere else as here they have been debated and dismissed already.
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Lucifer323
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#42
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#42
(Original post by MatureStudent37)
It is temporary. They’re in place till vaccinations are rolled out.

We got hit by a global pandemic in March last year. We’ve developed a vaccine since then. Have developed domestic supply chains as well as secured external vaccine supplies. As well a being in the process of building additional vaccine production capacities to export.

The U.K. should be vaccinated by September this year. That’s 18 months from start to finish. We had three times more warning about WW2 happening and that still took 6 years to get over.

I know it’s no pain. It was a kick in the teeth with the school closures. Massively impacted both my wife and my kids. It’s need d and it will be over soon.

I don’t think people have been lied to. Tags have been constantly changing. We went into this with planning going on for mass graves to cope with the fallout. Fortunately that never materialised.

If you had red some of the earlier acientofic reports, they modelled these different peaks and troughs.

Personally, I’m suorised how well things have gone and have reactive we’ve been. Mistakes have been made, but to quite Sir John Bell, meritorious professor of medicine at Oxford. Nobody living has had to deal with something like this before .
We don't need constant propaganda and assertions by the way that are false. There is no need for you or the other person to try to prove the effectiveness of lockdowns. Simply because they are not. Furthermore these arguments have been debated and long time ago and have been defeated.

You can still tell these stories somewhere else in other threads. I sto don't think they will be taken seriously as you are lacking knowledge, and you don't seem to know anything in terms of scientific and public health matters.
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Megacent
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#43
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#43
(Original post by MatureStudent37)
The U.K. should be vaccinated by September this year. That’s 18 months from start to finish. We had three times more warning about WW2 happening and that still took 6 years to get over.

I know it’s no pain. It was a kick in the teeth with the school closures. Massively impacted both my wife and my kids. It’s need d and it will be over soon.

I don’t think people have been lied to. Tags have been constantly changing. We went into this with planning going on for mass graves to cope with the fallout. Fortunately that never materialised.

If you had red some of the earlier acientofic reports, they modelled these different peaks and troughs.

Personally, I’m suorised how well things have gone and have reactive we’ve been. Mistakes have been made, but to quite Sir John Bell, meritorious professor of medicine at Oxford. Nobody living has had to deal with something like this before .
They did claim we would have 4000 deaths a day without a lockdown. And later it seemed to emerge that deaths wouldn't actually have been that high, and they knew that when they made their claim. That certainly feels like a lie, like they were trying to frighten us with false figures.

Patrick Unbalanced said in March that we actually want the virus to spread, that completely suppressing it is a bad idea because when you lift restrictions it just bounces back and there's no immunity in the population. When did we move from that "flatten the curve" narrative to a far stricter keep everyone in lockdown until vaccination approach? And why wasn't that clearly communicated? I feel completely betrayed because I was led into these restrictions believing it was for a few weeks, and now they've turned around and extended it for almost a year. You say they will lift restrictions once people are vaccinated but because of all the false promises right from the initial "it's just three weeks!", I no longer trust that they will in fact keep their word this time and actually lift them.
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Lucifer323
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(Original post by Megacent)
They did claim we would have 4000 deaths a day without a lockdown. And later it seemed to emerge that deaths wouldn't actually have been that high, and they knew that when they made their claim. That certainly feels like a lie, like they were trying to frighten us with false figures.

Patrick Unbalanced said in March that we actually want the virus to spread, that completely suppressing it is a bad idea because when you lift restrictions it just bounces back and there's no immunity in the population. When did we move from that "flatten the curve" narrative to a far stricter keep everyone in lockdown until vaccination approach? And why wasn't that clearly communicated? I feel completely betrayed because I was led into these restrictions believing it was for a few weeks, and now they've turned around and extended it for almost a year. You say they will lift restrictions once people are vaccinated but because of all the false promises right from the initial "it's just three weeks!", I no longer trust that they will in fact keep their word this time and actually lift them.
It's almost a year. And of course the only way to be able to convince people lockdowns are ways of dealing with epidemics or pandemics when in fact we know that this is not the case, as this is a new measure which is politically driven, is to scare to terrify an entire population. What has followed was hysteria and paranoia thanks to the media and most citizens who don't know much about epidemics and how you deal with them.
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MatureStudent37
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#45
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(Original post by Lucifer323)
We don't need constant propaganda and assertions by the way that are false. There is no need for you or the other person to try to prove the effectiveness of lockdowns. Simply because they are not. Furthermore these arguments have been debated and long time ago and have been defeated.

You can still tell these stories somewhere else in other threads. I sto don't think they will be taken seriously as you are lacking knowledge, and you don't seem to know anything in terms of scientific and public health matters.
Wow.

are you one of these conspiracy theory people who think this is a government conspiracy.

Are you actually trying to say that in order to control a communicable virus we shouldn’t enact some method of control of interaction by carriers/potential carriers to mitigate its spread until vaccines are available?

can I also clarify with you. You’re claiming I’m not allowed to defend an existing public health matter that’s been based on scientific understanding, because I don’t understand the logic behind the scientific understanding in the aforementioned public health issue.
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MatureStudent37
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#46
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(Original post by Lucifer323)
It's almost a year. And of course the only way to be able to convince people lockdowns are ways of dealing with epidemics or pandemics when in fact we know that this is not the case, as this is a new measure which is politically driven, is to scare to terrify an entire population. What has followed was hysteria and paranoia thanks to the media and most citizens who don't know much about epidemics and how you deal with them.
Why is the government trying to scare me?
I understand people don’t know much about epidemics, which is why they ask scientific experts ( these people are called epidemiologists). I haven’t seen many scientific experts out there advocating the removal of current restriction ms. I’ve seen some scientific experts saying we’re not going far enough.

Why’s the government trying to make me scared?

So far, all lockdown has resulted in is my wife working from home. (Saved fortune in petrol)

An inability to take the kids to soft play at the weekend. (Saved some money and missed out on a nice cooked breakfast)

Cancelled skiing holiday ( saved me some money)

Increase Amazon deliveries ( cost me some
Money)

Are you trying to imply lockdown is a big conspiracy to boost Amazon sales?
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Lucifer323
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#47
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#47
(Original post by MatureStudent37)
Why is the government trying to scare me?
I understand people don’t know much about epidemics, which is why they ask scientific experts ( these people are called epidemiologists). I haven’t seen many scientific experts out there advocating the removal of current restriction ms. I’ve seen some scientific experts saying we’re not going far enough.

Why’s the government trying to make me scared?

So far, all lockdown has resulted in is my wife working from home. (Saved fortune in petrol)

An inability to take the kids to soft play at the weekend. (Saved some money and missed out on a nice cooked breakfast)

Cancelled skiing holiday ( saved me some money)

Increase Amazon deliveries ( cost me some
Money)

Are you trying to imply lockdown is a big conspiracy to boost Amazon sales?
We have explained already that lockdowns can only serve as short term fixes. In the long term they are catastrophic. Other than that the conversation has already concluded long time ago.

You have a striking similarity in writing with another user called ByEeek who came here and exposed himself with the same arguments.

I am not interested in having the debate with ByEeek again or with someone who looks like him. The debate has been lost for ByEeek and for you a long time ago. So you know...

You haven't answered us yet whether you are ByEeek. Your style is very similar to him.

Megacent
TCA2b
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Lucifer323
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#48
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#48
(Original post by MatureStudent37)
Wow.

are you one of these conspiracy theory people who think this is a government conspiracy.

Are you actually trying to say that in order to control a communicable virus we shouldn’t enact some method of control of interaction by carriers/potential carriers to mitigate its spread until vaccines are available?

can I also clarify with you. You’re claiming I’m not allowed to defend an existing public health matter that’s been based on scientific understanding, because I don’t understand the logic behind the scientific understanding in the aforementioned public health issue.
We don't need propaganda with the writing style of another user who has been already defeated in terms of the arguments he provided.

No interest in debating anything with users who have similar writing styles. If you know what I mean. His arguments and yours have been defeated long time ago.

It's best to go open a book and stop the conversations.
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MatureStudent37
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#49
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#49
(Original post by Lucifer323)
We don't need propaganda with the writing style of another user who has been already defeated in terms of the arguments he provided.

No interest in debating anything with users who have similar writing styles. If you know what I mean. His arguments and yours have been defeated long time ago.

It's best to go open a book and stop the conversations.
What propaganda are you taking about?

Do you think that lockdown and the mandatory requirement of wearing face masks is propaganda?
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Lucifer323
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
What propaganda are you taking about?

Do you think that lockdown and the mandatory requirement of wearing face masks is propaganda?
I am not interested in having a conversation with you as you may have (or not realised). Similar arguments that you make, have already been made by another user who had his arguments answered and defeated long time ago.

So again, bye bye.
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MatureStudent37
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(Original post by Lucifer323)
I am not interested in having a conversation with you as you may have (or not realised). Similar arguments that you make, have already been made by another user who had his arguments answered and defeated long time ago.

So again, bye bye.
And yet again, you keep engaging.

Is this what’s known as no platforming/ cancel culture, or as I used to call it. Calling out sensitive people who can’t cope with people holding different views.

Why are you claiming that lockdowns/quarantines have no effect on pandemics when they’ve been used in the last very effectively in the absence of suitable medical care/ treatment.

Here’s a historical example of them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leper_colony
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Lucifer323
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
And yet again, you keep engaging.

Is this what’s known as no platforming/ cancel culture, or as I used to call it. Calling out sensitive people who can’t cope with people holding different views.

Why are you claiming that lockdowns/quarantines have no effect on pandemics when they’ve been used in the last very effectively in the absence of suitable medical care/ treatment.

Here’s a historical example of them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leper_colony
It is you who first came into this thread and answered my replies just like the other user ByEeek. I am not interested in having conversations with you as you don't have valid arguments.

You should understand the meaning of bye bye
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MatureStudent37
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(Original post by Lucifer323)
It is you who first came into this thread and answered my replies just like the other user ByEeek. I am not interested in having conversations with you as you don't have valid arguments.

You should understand the meaning of bye bye
You asked if there should be a lockdown referendum. I answered no.

I explained that I answered that here shouldn’t be a lockdown referendum because the scientific and healthcare advice is that these measure are needed, but they won’t work unless everybody is made to do it.
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Kitten in boots
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(Original post by Lucifer323)
I am not interested in having a conversation with you as you may have (or not realised). Similar arguments that you make, have already been made by another user who had his arguments answered and defeated long time ago.

So again, bye bye.
Rather than addressing actual arguments, you are having a childish tantrum.

I hope you grow out of this behaviour before you enter the adult world.
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Lucifer323
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(Original post by Kitten in boots)
Rather than addressing actual arguments, you are having a childish tantrum.

I hope you grow out of this behaviour before you enter the adult world.
Yes Mrs!

I won't do it again!
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Lucifer323
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(Original post by Kitten in boots)
Rather than addressing actual arguments, you are having a childish tantrum.

I hope you grow out of this behaviour before you enter the adult world.
Hello Mrs Kitten,

As I didn't have the time to respond earlier I would like to make a few comments.

The arguments made by the other user have been answered several times by myself and other users not only in this thread but in other threads. Hence there is no point in answering again.

Furthermore I have the suspicion that this user who appears to be a new one and claims he is new, is nothing more than another known user who is the last couple of weeks came to several threads and had his arguments dismantled in most cases.

He had a unique style. He made a wide range of unsubstantiated & uneducated claims and when challenged he started appealing to emotion. When this tactic didn't work either he accused everyone else of having no morals, no compassion, no empathy, and the rest.. Then he gave it a few days and started all over again in another thread. Now as he is recognized by many of us he probably changed his username.

But I suppose you didn't know all these ? Or maybe your judgement has been affected by left wing ideas? You know, if you are ideologically sympathetic to one side then sometimes your judgements and views can be affected quite a lot. For example the left has sided with very strict lockdowns in this occasion, as if lockdowns ever existed in the map of epidemiology and public health as effective measures of dealing with epidemics or pandemics.

I find it amusing that someone who hasn't taken part in any of the conversations made in regards to lockdowns and the other measures taken by the Government, to isolate one of my replies, without read any others which exist in various relevant threads.

Great understanding of matters and great debating skills for once more!

TCA2b
Megacent
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TCA2b
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(Original post by lucifer323)
but i suppose you didn't know all these ? Or maybe your judgement has been affected by left wing ideas? You know, if you are ideologically sympathetic to one side then sometimes your judgements and views can be affected quite a lot. For example the left has sided with very strict lockdowns in this occasion, as if lockdowns ever existed in the map of epidemiology and public health as effective measures of dealing with epidemics or pandemics.
ding ding ding we have a winner!
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