AstraZeneca vaccine for over-65s

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UnclePete
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#41
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
The empire was fought over. And in many areas caught over, with force . We paid their leaders in gold (see the Kinnock family ) suppressed their culture, imposed our religion on them and our laws. We then got them indebted to us.

Yugoslavia was pushed together. It only held together because of Tito. Once he went, it collapsed .

nobody asked me or even my parents generation if they wanted to be part of a federal European super state. My parents were asked to join a trading block.

The EU is the only trading block I now of that has its own judiciary, flag, national anthem, currency, central bank and parliament.

I don’t want to be part of it. When the continent goes on its new European order crusades it inevitably ends with lots of dead people. They can’t help themselves.

the similarities of what’s happening now with what’s happened in history are there.

I understand that Germany is the dominant power in Europe. I also like Germans and they respect U.K.
Never once in my extensive travels in Germany, and this was when some of the war generation were still around, did I come across any animosity, in fact the exact opposite. I work sometimes with German engineers- recently when they commissioned some new kit ( clean or pure steam Bosch generators) and have always found them diligent to work with, and good socially afterwards. The only incident I did have was on a train between Koln and Hannover when some skinheads who a bit worse for wear, started abusing an American Air Force guy but this was soon squashed by the train conductors who locked them ranting in their compartment ( this was when separate compartment coaches were still used on some trains), the train then made an unscheduled stop where the police with a dog were waiting right where that coach stopped, and on to them no messing. But I've seen worse here.

It's a great shame that in and around 1914 Prince Albert Queen Victoria's husband who was German, a good diplomat, and King Federick the third of Germany the latter, who although trained in the Prussian military order, wanted very much to model Germany on the liberal English constitutional one and who sadly died of cancer after only a very short term in office, were not still alive. The events of 1914 onwards may well have been kept localised. But that's for the history section.

My cousin and his wife had their Covid jabs last week, the AZ one, with no after effects so far. In fact he said he has felt more from a flue jab.
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MatureStudent37
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#42
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(Original post by UnclePete)
Never once in my extensive travels in Germany, and this was when some of the war generation were still around, did I come across any animosity, in fact the exact opposite. I work sometimes with German engineers- recently when they commissioned some new kit ( clean or pure steam Bosch generators) and have always found them diligent to work with, and good socially afterwards. The only incident I did have was on a train between Koln and Hannover when some skinheads who a bit worse for wear, started abusing an American Air Force guy but this was soon squashed by the train conductors who locked them ranting in their compartment ( this was when separate compartment coaches were still used on some trains), the train then made an unscheduled stop where the police with a dog were waiting right where that coach stopped, and on to them no messing. But I've seen worse here.

It's a great shame that in and around 1914 Prince Albert Queen Victoria's husband who was German, a good diplomat, and King Federick the third of Germany the latter, who although trained in the Prussian military order, wanted very much to model Germany on the liberal English constitutional one and who sadly died of cancer after only a very short term in office, were not still alive. The events of 1914 onwards may well have been kept localised. But that's for the history section.

My cousin and his wife had their Covid jabs last week, the AZ one, with no after effects so far. In fact he said he has felt more from a flue jab.
Likewise. Always found that in the U.K. seem to always get on with the Germans. Once you get past the Teutonic reserve, we share the same humour, and I think there’s always been a high degree of respect.

However, think the mid 19th century, there’s been a power struggle on the continent for who’s in charge. Since Germany has reunified its becoming more and more apparent that it’s the Germans, factoring into account their limitations for armed intervention on foreign policy matters.

My concern however is that Eastern Europe, or Prussia as it used to be known tends to be an area of friction where eat meets west. We’ve seen it with the Ukraine. (Nothing new, the tensions between europeAn powers and Russia there.)

What we seem to have now is hangers on within the EU trying to outdo themselves about how to take things forward. German domination of Europe is a forgone conclusion. It seems to be pushing the unification of Germany model.

It would appear that customs unions are all the rage for that.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ObXdayY0gO0
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UnclePete
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#43
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
Likewise. Always found that in the U.K. seem to always get on with the Germans. Once you get past the Teutonic reserve, we share the same humour, and I think there’s always been a high degree of respect.

However, think the mid 19th century, there’s been a power struggle on the continent for who’s in charge. Since Germany has reunified its becoming more and more apparent that it’s the Germans, factoring into account their limitations for armed intervention on foreign policy matters.

My concern however is that Eastern Europe, or Prussia as it used to be known tends to be an area of friction where eat meets west. We’ve seen it with the Ukraine. (Nothing new, the tensions between europeAn powers and Russia there.)

What we seem to have now is hangers on within the EU trying to outdo themselves about how to take things forward. German domination of Europe is a forgone conclusion. It seems to be pushing the unification of Germany model.

It would appear that customs unions are all the rage for that.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ObXdayY0gO0
The Germans desperately want to be seen as good Europeans because of their past, and the guilt complex still prevalent with many. Someone said to me once they tend to reduce everything to a question of principle, looking for the absolute which I have noticed myself, as they can be somewhat inflexible at times and apt to get bogged down with minutae of detail. Having said that though I have found them ok to work with, and would rather a decent German or come to that any other nationality be a neighbour mine than a bad English person anyday.
I have often thought us and the Germans opposing each other in that ghastly WW1 was as much due to being too much the same: I know the causes of that were very complex but to use a simple analogy when you get two strong willed people with much their own agenda together sooner or later they will clash. As we did. We were as much concerned of the Germans occupying and controlling the Channel ports in particular Antwerp as we were aiding 'plucky little Belgium', conveniently forgetting their carry on in The Congo. And the British always aimed for a balance of power in Europe so it was not a threat to them.
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MatureStudent37
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(Original post by UnclePete)
The Germans desperately want to be seen as good Europeans because of their past, and the guilt complex still prevalent with many. Someone said to me once they tend to reduce everything to a question of principle, looking for the absolute which I have noticed myself, as they can be somewhat inflexible at times and apt to get bogged down with minutae of detail. Having said that though I have found them ok to work with, and would rather a decent German or come to that any other nationality be a neighbour mine than a bad English person anyday.
I have often thought us and the Germans opposing each other in that ghastly WW1 was as much due to being too much the same: I know the causes of that were very complex but to use a simple analogy when you get two strong willed people with much their own agenda together sooner or later they will clash. As we did. We were as much concerned of the Germans occupying and controlling the Channel ports in particular Antwerp as we were aiding 'plucky little Belgium', conveniently forgetting their carry on in The Congo. And the British always aimed for a balance of power in Europe so it was not a threat to them.
I’m aware we’re detailing the thread a little bit. Max Hastings catastrophe is a good read.

In other news the WHO have pretty much said that U.K. policy is the way forward and carry on with AstraZeneca
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UnclePete
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
I’m aware we’re detailing the thread a little bit. Max Hastings catastrophe is a good read.

In other news the WHO have pretty much said that U.K. policy is the way forward and carry on with AstraZeneca
Thought they would come round to it in the end!
Everybody I know who has had the AZ or come to that the Pfizer one, so far has not felt any side affects, in fact my cousin and his wife said they noticed more from the flue jab. Knowing the MHRA and FDA as I do, I know they would be pretty searching before giving the ok. Too much at stake to get it wrong.
I'm due for mine soon.
Will have to read that book, have seen reviews of it.
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MatureStudent37
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(Original post by UnclePete)
Thought they would come round to it in the end!
Everybody I know who has had the AZ or come to that the Pfizer one, so far has not felt any side affects, in fact my cousin and his wife said they noticed more from the flue jab. Knowing the MHRA and FDA as I do, I know they would be pretty searching before giving the ok. Too much at stake to get it wrong.
I'm due for mine soon.
Will have to read that book, have seen reviews of it.
I’ve heard of a few. Nothing major though. Most people I know have had a bit of a tingling sensation or a bit of fatigue. Generally nothing worse than a flu shot.

One guys had it a bit worse, but manageable.

I believe it’s a case of if you’ve had it, the side effects are worse.

Feedback however seems to be positive. Nobody I know involved in healthcare is particularly worried. They’re just pleased that it’s doing the job.

The biggest concern is people seem to have is the potential lack of uptake for the vaccine, and a concern that once vaccinated people will throw caution to the wind .
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UnclePete
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(Original post by MatureStudent37)
I’ve heard of a few. Nothing major though. Most people I know have had a bit of a tingling sensation or a bit of fatigue. Generally nothing worse than a flu shot.

One guys had it a bit worse, but manageable.

I believe it’s a case of if you’ve had it, the side effects are worse.

Feedback however seems to be positive. Nobody I know involved in healthcare is particularly worried. They’re just pleased that it’s doing the job.

The biggest concern is people seem to have is the potential lack of uptake for the vaccine, and a concern that once vaccinated people will throw caution to the wind .
Your last paragraph is right on the mark.
I heard this is a concern many in the medical establishment have, as driving into work this afternoon on the radio they were saying how many spare slots have arisen with some folk not bothering to either turn up or indeed have the vaccine.
Others think it gives them immeadiate immunity as soon as they walk out after having the jab, which of course as we know it takes up to ten or more days to work completely through.
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MatureStudent37
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(Original post by UnclePete)
Your last paragraph is right on the mark.
I heard this is a concern many in the medical establishment have, as driving into work this afternoon on the radio they were saying how many spare slots have arisen with some folk not bothering to either turn up or indeed have the vaccine.
Others think it gives them immeadiate immunity as soon as they walk out after having the jab, which of course as we know it takes up to ten or more days to work completely through.
I’m unsure about people not turning up for the vaccine. You have to get booked in so you can refuse your booking if you’re not going to get the vaccine. I don’t know how much of people
Not turning up to get it is. My ride didn’t turn up. I was ill. I forgot. I couldn’t arrange transport. Or I’m so used to not understanding the costs associated with not turning up, I just couldn’t be bothered. There’s even the case of they could’ve died. (We are looking at a demographic that even without Covid die a lot more

It tends to be the younger generations who seem to be the most reluctant. There’s the Tin foil hat conspiraloons. You’re not changing their mindset. These are the negatives to care in the community. Then you’ve got women who are a little bit concerned about the potential of vaccination and the ability to have children, but indications are they’ll get on board over time. And then there’s the ‘I’m generally concerned.’ They’ll come on board when more people get vaccinated.

My biggest concern has never been getting it. It’s been spreading it. I’m the weakest link in our bubble as I’m still at work. Fortunately the in laws have had the jab, and we’ve just found out my wife is now eligible as she classed as our sons caret so she’s just waiting for a date.

It appears that although I’m more at risk than my wife, but I’m more expendable apparently
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