Should Johnson & Hancock face criminal charges for mishandling the pandemic?

Watch
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#1
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#1
Should they face charges/jail terms for gross negligence, emotional abuse, treason, not to mention imposing rules which are a breach of basic human rights e.g, stopping care home residents from coming home to see their loved ones?

Everyone seems to have forgotten about all the failings by government ministers just because they've managed to get a vaccine rolled out...
0
reply
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#2
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#2
and no, 'what would've any one else in power done differently?' or 'what would've starmer done?' are not ways to justify more tory lies and utter incompetence
0
reply
fallen_acorns
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#3
Report 2 weeks ago
#3
I mean, if they have broken the law they should face charges.. I'm open to that if you can show where they have broken the law.

If not though, then no, political failings shouldn't lead to criminal proceedings. It should just lead to them loosing their electability and subsequently all of their power/jobs.

Sadly, as I mentioned in the lockdown thread, I can't see this happening, and I expect some of them to come out of it pretty unscathed, and some - rishi + the vaccine minister to come out massively better than when they went in.
0
reply
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#4
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#4
(Original post by fallen_acorns)
I mean, if they have broken the law they should face charges.. I'm open to that if you can show where they have broken the law.

If not though, then no, political failings shouldn't lead to criminal proceedings. It should just lead to them loosing their electability and subsequently all of their power/jobs.

Sadly, as I mentioned in the lockdown thread, I can't see this happening, and I expect some of them to come out of it pretty unscathed, and some - rishi + the vaccine minister to come out massively better than when they went in.
apart from voting against the free school meals, Sunak and Zahawi have actually been quite upfront and did their jobs quite well.

On the other hand, Hancock and Johnson have not. Regardless of whether the vaccine roll out is a success. it cannot hide the failings by these two.

Treason, gross negligence and a basic deprivation of human rights (e.g, not allowing carehome resident to come home and see their lived ones/ not allowing loved ones inside care homes) are all criminal acts. I can put up with the lies and shifting of goalposts (what government hasn't done that) but the moment in which your failings contribute to the highest number of deaths in the world from covid, a destroyed economy, damages to livelihoods, businesses and mental health then consequences must be taken. No one is denying that the virus exists but when the secondary effects are worse than the virus itself, then you have problems.

Now the problem is, no one has the guts to call them out - the media are bankrolled by the government and government ministers wouldnt dare call out their pals. No one ever answers questions or think one positive can cover-up several failings. Unfortunately we are not like france/places like egypt/Libya where the people are vocal and take to the streets against government oppression. That's the only way it would work - unfortunately, people who do their will be labelled as 'troublemakers', 'conspiracy theorists' etc etc.
1
reply
hotpud
Badges: 8
Rep:
?
#5
Report 2 weeks ago
#5
Surely, to convict them of these things, you would have to prove they did it with intent. Can incompetence be charged criminally in a job that anyone in the country can apply for and get?
0
reply
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#6
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#6
(Original post by hotpud)
Surely, to convict them of these things, you would have to prove they did it with intent. Can incompetence be charged criminally in a job that anyone in the country can apply for and get?
if someone is speeding down the road and they hit someone, who later dies (without the intention to kill someone), they'd still get convicted. surely it's the consequence that results from your actions, rather than your intention that plays a part too?

Incompetence cant be charged criminally but treason and depriving someone of basic human rights can
2
reply
hotpud
Badges: 8
Rep:
?
#7
Report 2 weeks ago
#7
(Original post by tan030)
if someone is speeding down the road and they hit someone, who later dies (without the intention to kill someone), they'd still get convicted. surely it's the consequence that results from your actions, rather than your intention that plays a part too?

Incompetence cant be charged criminally but treason and depriving someone of basic human rights can
Some good points. But speeding is well defined. We know what the law says, what is unacceptable and what the consequences are.

Back in March it was all a massive unknown and all manner of politicians and supposed experts were putting forward contrary ideas and solutions. You could argue on a variety of grounds that any set of outcomes could be seen as incompetent.
0
reply
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#8
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#8
(Original post by hotpud)
Some good points. But speeding is well defined. We know what the law says, what is unacceptable and what the consequences are.

Back in March it was all a massive unknown and all manner of politicians and supposed experts were putting forward contrary ideas and solutions. You could argue on a variety of grounds that any set of outcomes could be seen as incompetent.
we also know what the laws say about treason, gross negligence and depriving someone of their basic human rights! How dare they stop families from seeing their loved ones who live in a carehome and stop residents from coming home! The UK is a democracy, not a dictatorship!

You get more rights as an illegal immigrant who contributes nothing to society or convicted sex offender compared to an honest, hardworking tax payer who contributes to the UK.

let me ask you a question. Where do you think this 'Kent variant' actually came from - given how close it is to the borders where illegals flock in left right and centre
Last edited by tan030; 2 weeks ago
0
reply
tan030
Badges: 17
Rep:
?
#9
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#9
(Original post by hotpud)
Some good points. But speeding is well defined. We know what the law says, what is unacceptable and what the consequences are.

Back in March it was all a massive unknown and all manner of politicians and supposed experts were putting forward contrary ideas and solutions. You could argue on a variety of grounds that any set of outcomes could be seen as incompetent.
well we're 10 months into the pandemic and we have zero exit strategy and the worst number of deaths compared to any other country in the world. It's okay to get a few things wrong in the initial stages, but repeated failure after failure 10 months into the pandemic is not. What excuse do we have? Nz and australia were strict up front, dealt with things properly and are now pretty much back to normal, albeit with stricter border controls.
0
reply
harrysbar
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#10
Report 2 weeks ago
#10
The one I'd like to see locked up is Grant Shapps for telling me I can't book a holiday
0
reply
Rakas21
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#11
Report 2 weeks ago
#11
Only British law matters and while your welcome to object to government policy in court, nobody has succeeded.

As to whether death should lead to charges the obvious answer is no otherwise no government would ever engage in military action for fear of personal liability.

If you disagree with their actions you vote for an alternative.
0
reply
Azagthoa
Badges: 10
Rep:
?
#12
Report 2 weeks ago
#12
I think they should be prosecuted. They should have locked down and closed borders far earlier (in Jan-Feb 2020), implemented a far harsher lockdown and should not have lifted lockdown at any point. This is the cause of 100,000+ deaths. Rishi is not guilt free either, campaigning for opening up and the eat out to help out scheme is responsible for corona spreading again and the second wave + far more deadly variant.
0
reply
fallen_acorns
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#13
Report 2 weeks ago
#13
(Original post by tan030)
apart from voting against the free school meals, Sunak and Zahawi have actually been quite upfront and did their jobs quite well.

On the other hand, Hancock and Johnson have not. Regardless of whether the vaccine roll out is a success. it cannot hide the failings by these two.

Treason, gross negligence and a basic deprivation of human rights (e.g, not allowing carehome resident to come home and see their lived ones/ not allowing loved ones inside care homes) are all criminal acts. I can put up with the lies and shifting of goalposts (what government hasn't done that) but the moment in which your failings contribute to the highest number of deaths in the world from covid, a destroyed economy, damages to livelihoods, businesses and mental health then consequences must be taken. No one is denying that the virus exists but when the secondary effects are worse than the virus itself, then you have problems.

Now the problem is, no one has the guts to call them out - the media are bankrolled by the government and government ministers wouldnt dare call out their pals. No one ever answers questions or think one positive can cover-up several failings. Unfortunately we are not like france/places like egypt/Libya where the people are vocal and take to the streets against government oppression. That's the only way it would work - unfortunately, people who do their will be labelled as 'troublemakers', 'conspiracy theorists' etc etc.
What specific law relating to treason has been broken?
0
reply
Drewski
Badges: 19
Rep:
?
#14
Report 2 weeks ago
#14
Not liking them is not actionable in court. You need evidence of a crime.
0
reply
hotpud
Badges: 8
Rep:
?
#15
Report 2 weeks ago
#15
(Original post by tan030)
well we're 10 months into the pandemic and we have zero exit strategy and the worst number of deaths compared to any other country in the world. It's okay to get a few things wrong in the initial stages, but repeated failure after failure 10 months into the pandemic is not. What excuse do we have? Nz and australia were strict up front, dealt with things properly and are now pretty much back to normal, albeit with stricter border controls.
Oh - I completely agree. But in their throng on incompetence, they also seem to have pulled off one of the best purchasing deals for vaccines in the world.

I'm not defending the government, but it is easy to point the finger in hindsight. And perhaps we have to be thankful for the fact that we have not had to endure lockdowns to the same level as places like France or Spain. It has always been a balancing act between economy, health and liberty. There is no right answer sadly.
0
reply
MatureStudent37
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#16
Report 2 weeks ago
#16
(Original post by tan030)
Should they face charges/jail terms for gross negligence, emotional abuse, treason, not to mention imposing rules which are a breach of basic human rights e.g, stopping care home residents from coming home to see their loved ones?

Everyone seems to have forgotten about all the failings by government ministers just because they've managed to get a vaccine rolled out...
Not really.

I’m going to take my lead from Sir John Bell at Oxford when a BBC journalist was trying to get him to criticise the government.

‘Mistakes have been made, but mistakes were going to be made as nobody has had to go through what we’re going through before.

Comparisons with countries approaches is irrelevant. Each country has its own unique geography and demo graphics. To compare the U.K. to New Zealand is pointless.

The The government support in the pandemic is however is amazing. We’ve gone from almost zero testing to the most effective test regime in the world, had the support of the government in not only supporting the development of vaccines and medical treatments to the disease that are world class, but we’ve managed to produce a vaccine that is deployable throughout the world at minimal cost. No other country as achieved what the U.K. has achieved.’

Obviously, disgruntled people will try and make political capital out of what’s happened. We have an Oxford lecturer hoping that the UKs vaccine didn’t work as she did t want to U.K. being one of the good guys.

we have the remain campaign upset that the ‘we won’t be able to cope outside of the EU if a major pandemic ever breaks out’ looking for justification as to why they were pushing out pump.

we have the SNP desperate to take what is being briefed at the national level rolling it out first to give the impression that Westminster is following Holyrood.

we have a Labour Party advocating a ‘kill a granny’ policy while trying to benefit to its financial backers .

out of interst though. Should Boris and Hancock be charged with failing to deal with the members of the public who failed to follow the rules. I for example have members of my family who are equally as critical as you are, and Labour supporters who have flowed every rule out out there. Is Boris responsible for their feckless behaviour? Or should we all start taking a bit of personal responsibility for our actions.

I’ll wait a year or two until the dust has settled and the real numbers come in.
0
reply
MatureStudent37
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#17
Report 2 weeks ago
#17
(Original post by tan030)
apart from voting against the free school meals, Sunak and Zahawi have actually been quite upfront and did their jobs quite well.

On the other hand, Hancock and Johnson have not. Regardless of whether the vaccine roll out is a success. it cannot hide the failings by these two.

Treason, gross negligence and a basic deprivation of human rights (e.g, not allowing carehome resident to come home and see their lived ones/ not allowing loved ones inside care homes) are all criminal acts. I can put up with the lies and shifting of goalposts (what government hasn't done that) but the moment in which your failings contribute to the highest number of deaths in the world from covid, a destroyed economy, damages to livelihoods, businesses and mental health then consequences must be taken. No one is denying that the virus exists but when the secondary effects are worse than the virus itself, then you have problems.

Now the problem is, no one has the guts to call them out - the media are bankrolled by the government and government ministers wouldnt dare call out their pals. No one ever answers questions or think one positive can cover-up several failings. Unfortunately we are not like france/places like egypt/Libya where the people are vocal and take to the streets against government oppression. That's the only way it would work - unfortunately, people who do their will be labelled as 'troublemakers', 'conspiracy theorists' etc etc.
And yet all we’ve had non stop from the BBC is constant criticism. Although to be fair, as the Brexit Armageddon never materialised for them I suppose they have to pad the news out with something.

Have you seen that Johnson’s Opinion racing has gone higher than Starmers again?
Last edited by MatureStudent37; 2 weeks ago
0
reply
Imane888
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#18
Report 1 week ago
#18
Imo yes. I want Hancock gone.
0
reply
MatureStudent37
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#19
Report 1 week ago
#19
(Original post by Imane888)
Imo yes. I want Hancock gone.
What for?
0
reply
Imane888
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#20
Report 1 week ago
#20
(Original post by MatureStudent37)
What for?
Mishandling the pandemic, not listening to warnings from other countries, government incompetence, PPE and enforcement disaster etc.
0
reply
X

Quick Reply

Attached files
Write a reply...
Reply
new posts
Back
to top
Latest
My Feed

See more of what you like on
The Student Room

You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

Personalise

Following the government's announcement, do you think you will be awarded a fair grade this year?

Yes (419)
51.92%
No (388)
48.08%

Watched Threads

View All