Why do people dislike the left?

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Euroliberal
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#81
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#81
(Original post by Mikos)
You’re ignoring the fact that Ireland (both of them) is very religious and a different situation entirely to what we’ll find in England. That is a religious objection, not a traditionalist one.
Religious objection or traditionalist objection. It's still an objection to SSM. The RoI literally approved SSM in a 2015 referendum, so what does that first point have to do with anything?
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username4524630
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#82
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#82
(Original post by Final Fantasy)
Instead of trying to change things on a global scale as an idealistic student, on matters they know nothing about nor have control over, start with the problems they actually have control over and work from there before taking on the rest of the world. If nothing else, it builds up essential skills and experience.
Most left wing student activists I know start through volunteering at shelters, food banks and other activities. They get more involved as they continue. More often than not, it’s the Conservative students who spent more time worrying about worldwide issues. My uni’s Conservative association actually has a ball every year while the Labour society spent most of the year organising in one way or another.
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Gaddafi
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#83
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#83
(Original post by finlay291202)
Haha? You say "labour gov" as if Blair's government was left-wing????????????
Which party was he a member of?????????????

254 Labour MP's voted for the invasion of Iraq, it enjoyed good leftwing approval. Granted some outsiders such as Corbyn were against it though.
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Wanttobreakfree
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#84
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#84
(Original post by Gaddafi)
Yes, I think finlay291202 forgets which party brought in the bill to legalize same sex marriage. It simply isn't the politically divisive issue that he makes it out to be.
Also forget which party recently last year believed Conversion Therapy was an appropriate thing to debate on whether or not it should be classed as: 'torture.' It's the same one by the way. Conservatives don't have to make sense have you seen Conservative leaders around the world? They lie without impunity and are considered cool for doing so. Whilst it's probably true that perhaps Conservatives voters themselves support LGBTQ+ it doesn't negate the fact they support a party that's recently removed Trans children with parents and consensual expert opinion to have HRT. Either way they're supporting a party that's contempt for these people and want to force reality into being simple binary thing.
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Vapordave
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#85
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#85
(Original post by Mikos)
As an LGBT person myself the situation has changed drastically since 2013 and is a very poor comparison for a debate 8 years later.
Only for LGB tbh
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Joe Frazier
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#86
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#86
Some people are scared of change.
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laurawatt
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#87
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#87
(Original post by finlay291202)
When the bill was introduced in 2013, half of the tory MPs voted against it, and there are tories like JRM who still don't agree with it. So 'the vast majority' is somewhat of an exaggeration, if not a lie.

Granted Piers may not have actually been offended by it, after all he is a professional ****stirrer, but there were people who were saying ****e like "Worlds gone mad!!!" simply because a dietary alternative that they didn't even have to buy or eat was on offer.

Also whenever LGBT+ people ask people to use their pronouns, or a boy wears a dress or whatever, there is a tidal wave of right wing lunatics giving it the "Teens used to be fighting in wars back then" ****e, as if fighting in a world war is a desirable situation.

Most of the right-wing are traditionalist lunatics who are, for some reason, petrified of any form of social progression.
JRM is a Catholic though, so his views on gay marriage is to do with his interpretation of his religion, not necessarily his political stance
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Iconoclast01
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#88
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#88
(Original post by Stark°3000)
Woah that's a bit extreme there are so many issues with that I don't think I could support it.
Yes. That's the point that is often missed in the debate about free markets, totally deregulating a market is pretty mental, but very few people ever bring up the issues of a completely deregulated market when it is brought up.
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Euroliberal
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#89
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#89
(Original post by Gaddafi)
Which party was he a member of?????????????

254 Labour MP's voted for the invasion of Iraq, it enjoyed good leftwing approval. Granted some outsiders such as Corbyn were against it though.
Once again Blair was not a leftist. Neither were most of the MPs in that PLP. The actual leftists, as you say, like Corbyn, Tony Benn, McDonnell etc. voted against it.
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Mesopotamian.
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#90
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(Original post by Gaddafi)
Igy. I probably have left leaning views on some things and right leaning views on another things.
Exactly the same here. I find SJWs in general incredibly irritating though but because “leftist” can be associated with those types of people, I avoid using the term. Likewise saying you have some “right wing” views might get you plonked into the Conservative camp which I have no desire to be a part of. Hence I have my views and leave it at that.
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Euroliberal
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#91
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#91
(Original post by laurawatt)
JRM is a Catholic though, so his views on gay marriage is to do with his interpretation of his religion, not necessarily his political stance
Religion should not influence politics.
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username4524630
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#92
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(Original post by Gaddafi)
Invasion of Afghanistan - Labour Gov.
Invasion of Iraq - Labour gov.
Bombing of Libya - Con Gov.

Both parties have annihilated countries when in power. Let's not pretend that the left cares.
Tony Blair didn’t describe him as a socialist or part of the left. He actually described himself as part of Margaret Thatcher’s legacy. Even Corbyn refused to support Blair as soon as he got elected and went as far as to oppose him the entire time. The left at the time wasn’t even in Labour as they got ‘kicked out’ for being too extreme.
Last edited by username4524630; 1 month ago
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Mikos
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#93
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#93
(Original post by finlay291202)
Religious objection or traditionalist objection. It's still an objection to SSM. The RoI literally approved SSM in a 2015 referendum, so what does that first point have to do with anything?
The point is that someone’s religious beliefs can exist alongside otherwise incongruent political beliefs.
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Gaddafi
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#94
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#94
(Original post by finlay291202)
Once again Blair was not a leftist. Neither were most of the MPs in that PLP. The actual leftists, as you say, like Corbyn, Tony Benn, McDonnell etc. voted against it.
The 254 MP's were not right of centre. They were left of centre and therefore by definition "leftist."

Here's a link of the support that the bombing of Libya got in 2011. Again it enjoyed widespread approval from the left. Only 12 Labour MP's voted against it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12816279
Last edited by Gaddafi; 1 month ago
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Wanttobreakfree
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#95
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(Original post by laurawatt)
JRM is a Catholic though, so his views on gay marriage is to do with his interpretation of his religion, not necessarily his political stance
I mean this country does have a system where the state celebrates the supposed divine birthright of our monarch under the lens of God. It all plays into it y'know. There was a time Germany was a great democracy and then it suddenly became one of the worst countries to live in during the rise of The Nazis. Also Jacobs Rees Moggs and Boris Johnson has met up with Alt-Right Steve Bannon.
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Euroliberal
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#96
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#96
(Original post by Mikos)
The point is that someone’s religious beliefs can exist alongside otherwise incongruent political beliefs.
(Original post by finlay291202)
Religion should not influence politics.
--
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Euroliberal
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#97
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#97
(Original post by Gaddafi)
The 254 MP's were not right of centre. They were left of centre and therefore by definition "leftist."

Here's a link of the support that the bombing of Libya got in 2011. Again it enjoyed widespread approval from the left.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12816279
No they aren't 'leftist'. That's not what leftist means. To be a leftist you have to actually be left-wing. Blair was a centrist, as were most of Labour's MPs during his premiership. They were essentially a more moderate and socially progressive version of the Conservatives.

'Left of centre' is not equal to 'left-wing'
Last edited by Euroliberal; 1 month ago
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Mikos
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#98
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#98
(Original post by finlay291202)
--
Religion is incredibly important to people and has a massive influence on their lives. It affects the way they conduct themselves on a day to day basis, how they deal with their greatest problems etc.
Religion is so important that politics cannot ignore it.
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Gaddafi
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#99
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(Original post by finlay291202)
No they aren't 'leftist'. That's not what leftist means. To be a leftist you have to actually be left-wing. Blair was a centrist, as were most of Labour's MPs during his premiership. They were essentially a more moderate and socially progressive version of the Conservatives.
In 2011, only 12 Labour MP's voted against the war in Libya. I assume you're going to pass off Ed Miliband as not left wing as well now?
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Wanttobreakfree
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#100
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(Original post by Mesopotamian.)
Exactly the same here. I find SJWs in general incredibly irritating though but because “leftist” can be associated with those types of people, I avoid using the term. Likewise saying you have some “right wing” views might get you plonked into the Conservative camp which I have no desire to be a part of. Hence I have my views and leave it at that.
See I've read and heard this term used a lot even against other Conservatives; still to this very day I've never seen anyone give a coherent definition of what it actually means. I always saw it as a dehumanising slur that in the long run I potential saw if say Trump in America won another term would've been used to justify sending leftists and liberals to camps. America dodged a bullet there, but The GOP has gone full on Neo-Nazi and considering both Boris Johnson as well as Jacobs Rees Mogg have talked to Steve Bannon I don't think were not that far along to adopting similar fascist leaning sentiments. Cause make no mistake it's exactly what those sentiments are.
Last edited by Wanttobreakfree; 1 month ago
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