"Kill the Bill" protest becomes a riot

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TCA2b
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#81
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#81
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
I disagree.

A- It's their job to deal with this crap

B- The police have been complicit in pandering to the woke agenda. They are now paying for this.

Hopefully this will help turn individual officers further to the right.
Should certainly cause them to raise eyebrows about the hacks who say antifa is "just an idea" or who refer to "mostly peaceful protests" after we saw billions in property damage, as well as lives lost and injured, over the course of the summer across the pond.
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Ascend
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#82
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#82
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
Whose principle? And what principle?

Why should I respect principles that I don't like or believe in?

I have absolutely no loyalty to your principles of the lefts generally. I have very strong principles when it comes to my own beliefs, of which appealing to liberals isn't one of them.
You have already admitted to the betrayal of the free speech principle based on your tribal allegiance and because "the other side does it too". Otherwise, what is your reasoning for this:

"I support cracking down on left wing protests and using kid gloves for right wing ones"

Let's examine how far down the rabbit hole you go with this in light of your grievance with the Conservatives' "lack of democracy". Democracy being another principle that I have a feeling you're not quite attached to.
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imlikeahermit
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#83
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#83
(Original post by TCA2b)
Should certainly cause them to raise eyebrows about the hacks who say antifa is "just an idea" or who refer to "mostly peaceful protests" after we saw billions in property damage, as well as lives lost and injured, over the course of the summer across the pond.
From what I recall some of the same hacks were members on here. Infact, Andy Ngo himself actually reposted some of the Bristol stuff on his Twitter yesterday, so according to some of the left wing missionaries on here, Bristol never happened!!
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SHallowvale
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#84
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#84
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
Reasonable to who? You? No, of course not. To others maybe. Politics to some degree is inevitably about excluding people and ideas. Politics that appeals to everyone is politics that appeals to no one.
As I said to that Antifa troll guy even if everyone was "reasonable" (they're not) why should we be if it doesn't work to our personal advantage?
History is full of weak groups crying for the strong to be reasonable only to turn the tables once they're in power.

How wonderful for you. But it's irrelevant.
I think Ascend has summarised why your beliefs aren't reasonable. Even within your own world view they are inconsistent.

Then why say that the modern left "is always going to call Tories fascist etc"? If this isn't relevant then why bring it up.
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SHallowvale
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#85
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#85
(Original post by imlikeahermit)
From what I recall some of the same hacks were members on here. Infact, Andy Ngo himself actually reposted some of the Bristol stuff on his Twitter yesterday, so according to some of the left wing missionaries on here, Bristol never happened!!
Bristol didn't happen because Andy Ngo reported it, it happened because reliable sources of information reported it. Andy Ngo is not one of them.

It's cute cute how much you fawn over them, but sadly your fawning only demonstrates how little you care for reliable and accurate information.
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imlikeahermit
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#86
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#86
Just to add here, 21 police officers were injured yesterday just doing their job. Absolutely abhorrent.
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imlikeahermit
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#87
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#87
(Original post by SHallowvale)
Bristol didn't happen because Andy Ngo reported it, it happened because reliable sources of information reported it. Andy Ngo is not one of them.

It's cute cute how much you fawn over them, but sadly your fawning only demonstrates how little you care for reliable and accurate information.
I care, you deny the truth. There’s a difference.
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Starship Trooper
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#88
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#88
(Original post by Ascend)
You have already admitted to the betrayal of the free speech principle based on your tribal allegiance and because "the other side does it too". Otherwise, what is your reasoning for this:

"I support cracking down on left wing protests and using kid gloves for right wing ones"

Let's examine how far down the rabbit hole you go with this in light of your grievance with the Conservatives' "lack of democracy". Democracy being another principle that I have a feeling you're not quite attached to.
I support free speech because I believe conservatives will almost always benefit from it, In theory I could be against it though I doubt it.

I don't know where you got this idea that I'm pro Democracy (at least in its current form) from...

On your point about me complaining about the conservatives partys lack of democracy that's why I said "Ironically" as in its ironic that the way to make the conservative party more authoritarian would be to make it more democratic. In short it's a means to an end.

When it comes to the Tory party, democracy and to some extent free speech I'm pretty consequentialist.

My principles are to Christianity, social Conservativism and against the demonisation of white people which I am unwilling to compromise on.
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SHallowvale
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#89
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#89
(Original post by imlikeahermit)
I care, you deny the truth. There’s a difference.
If you worship Andy Ngo as much as you do then you most definitely do not care about the truth.
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imlikeahermit
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#90
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#90
(Original post by SHallowvale)
If you worship Andy Ngo as much as you do then you most definitely do not care about the truth.
And for example, if you deny the pictures and videos coming out of areas which are undeniable, because you don’t like the source, you don’t care about the truth. I should add, it’s also your opinion he isn’t a good source. I don’t really care for that.
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IanDangerously
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#91
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#91
(Original post by DiddyDec)
What is a "proper" protest in your opinion?

It also limits the amount of noise that a protest is allowed to generate so while they may be off to one side they must also not be too noisy in case someone gets "alarmed" or "distressed" by it.

You would think this was written by the NUS when trying to enforce "Jazz hands".
A proper protest would be an arranged event designed to attract media coverage to an issue and allow any passers by who are interested to find out more about whatever they’re protesting.

I can’t see the police bothering to enforce the noise rules on most protests because between all the transport, the buskers, the street dance crews, the megaphone preachers and the thousands of people yammering, it’s never loud enough to cause alarm or distress. Everything is loud!

Plus it takes far fewer officers to passively patrol a crowd than to intervene and start dispersing it. Maybe if there’s a few hundred complaints and there’s no football in town that day they might enforce this but otherwise if nothing is kicking off in the crowd I don’t see them rushing to shut it down.

It’s a ridiculous law but I don’t see it causing anywhere near the level of issues people think it will
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SHallowvale
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#92
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#92
(Original post by imlikeahermit)
And for example, if you deny the pictures and videos coming out of areas which are undeniable, because you don’t like the source, you don’t care about the truth.
Could you give an example of where I've done this? Have I denied the Bristol riots without knowing it, or something?
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DiddyDec
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#93
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#93
(Original post by imlikeahermit)
you don’t care about the truth.
The irony is this, you hate the truth if it doesn't fit your narrative, you won't even answer simple questions because it undermines your fragile position.
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Starship Trooper
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#94
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#94
(Original post by SHallowvale)
I think Ascend has summarised why your beliefs aren't reasonable.

Even within your own world view they are inconsistent.

Then why say that the modern left "is always going to call Tories fascist etc"? If this isn't relevant then why bring it up.
See my post #88

How are my beliefs inconsistent in my worldview? I would love for you to point them out.

That isn't irrelevant. What is irrelevant is You not doing that.
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SHallowvale
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#95
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(Original post by DiddyDec)
The irony is this, you hate the truth if it doesn't fit your narrative, you won't even answer simple questions because it undermines your fragile position.
It's not even that. They'll just believe that something is true provided that it either adheres to their existing world view or makes them feel good about themself. I saw the same thing happen in another thread quite recently.
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imlikeahermit
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#96
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#96
(Original post by SHallowvale)
Could you give an example of where I've done this? Have I denied the Bristol riots without knowing it, or something?
I’m talking about previous threads, which shouldn’t be dug up into this thread. However, the fact that you opinion is often guided by your biased views rather than the facts infront of you is relevant, as has been proven in previous threads with you denying pictures and videos because the source wasn’t up to your supreme standards.

Hardly surprising that you and your best pal in this thread can’t remove yourselves from what has happened here, which is violent thuggery. But remember, it’s the police’s fault, they shouldn’t have been there. :rolleyes: All we need now in here is the boat and dsilva and we’ll have the full ‘injustice league.’
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imlikeahermit
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#97
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#97
(Original post by DiddyDec)
The irony is this, you hate the truth if it doesn't fit your narrative, you won't even answer simple questions because it undermines your fragile position.
Hardly. You’re the one suggesting that it’s the police officers faults they were injured because it was their choice they were there.


It reminds me of Simon Hughes against Thatcher. You didn’t mean it to come out that way, but it did.
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SHallowvale
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#98
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#98
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
See my post #88

How are my beliefs inconsistent in my worldview? I would love for you to point them out.

That isn't irrelevant. What is irrelevant is You not doing that.
You support free speech yet you also support this bill, which goes against the principle of free speech.

If you want to make sweeping claims about "the modern left" then a single counter example is relevant.
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DiddyDec
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#99
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#99
(Original post by IanDangerously)
A proper protest would be an arranged event designed to attract media coverage to an issue and allow any passers by who are interested to find out more about whatever they’re protesting.

I can’t see the police bothering to enforce the noise rules on most protests because between all the transport, the buskers, the street dance crews, the megaphone preachers and the thousands of people yammering, it’s never loud enough to cause alarm or distress. Everything is loud!

Plus it takes far fewer officers to passively patrol a crowd than to intervene and start dispersing it. Maybe if there’s a few hundred complaints and there’s no football in town that day they might enforce this but otherwise if nothing is kicking off in the crowd I don’t see them rushing to shut it down.

It’s a ridiculous law but I don’t see it causing anywhere near the level of issues people think it will
The police shouldn't have to power to enforce noise generation or other ill defined entirely subjective things in the first place. It is as you say ridiculous so we shouldn't be passing ridiculous laws.

It gives the Government the ability to legally close down protests they dislike on ridiculous grounds.
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DiddyDec
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#100
(Original post by imlikeahermit)
Hardly. You’re the one suggesting that it’s the police officers faults they were injured because it was their choice they were there.
So will you be answering the questions I put to you on page 2? Of course you won't because it undermines your position.
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