fallen_acorns
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#1
Report Thread starter 1 week ago
#1
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56585538

I can see this being the start of some controversy...

"Chairman Tony Sewell, an education consultant and ex-charity boss who led the review, said while there was anecdotal evidence of racism, there was no proof that there was "institutional racism" in Britain.

"No-one denies and no-one is saying racism doesn't exist", he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

"We found anecdotal evidence of this. However, evidence of actual institutional racism? No, that wasn't there, we didn't find that."
Dr Sewell added that the term "institutional racism" is "sometimes wrongly applied" as a "sort of a catch-all phrase for micro-aggressions or acts of racial abuse"."


(He's black by the way.. not that it should matter, but it does to many progressive campaigners. That means you can call him an uncle tom, instead of/and a racist)

---

A quick look to me shows a fair few flaws in the report, at least to my eyes.. but that's for a later date. For now I'm just a bit shocked that the conservatives actually put out a very anti-woke report that, in my aspects, flies in the face of the direction of progressive opinion. E.g. BLM. It's pretty balanced in my eyes. There are acceptances that racism is still a problem, but also huge acknowledgements of how far we have come, especially in education. Balanced doesn't mean correct though, and I'm sure there are many issues with it.

For balance, Prof Kehinde Andrews - known to anyone who watches breakfast TV as the first name to call when you want an extremely racialised and progressive viewpoint on TV, Called it Nonsense. and a PR move to pretend racism doesn't exist.
1
reply
Ascend
Badges: 13
Rep:
?
#2
Report 1 week ago
#2
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56585538

The main findings were:

  • Children from ethnic communities did as well or better than white pupils in compulsory education, with black Caribbean pupils the only group to perform less well
  • This success in education has "transformed British society over the last 50 years into one offering far greater opportunities for all"
  • The pay gap between all ethnic minorities and the white majority population had shrunk to 2.3% overall and was barely significant for employees under 30
  • Diversity has increased in professions such as law and medicine
  • But some communities continue to be "haunted" by historic racism, which is creating "deep mistrust" and could be a barrier to success
0
reply
caravaggio2
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#3
Report 1 week ago
#3
Nice to see a bit of good news after us spending the last 12 months sailing on a sea of bleedin misery. 👍😁
3
reply
JOSH4598
Badges: 15
Rep:
?
#4
Report 1 week ago
#4
(Original post by caravaggio2)
Nice to see a bit of good news after us spending the last 12 months sailing on a sea of bleedin misery. 👍😁
I agree - if ever there was something to shut down the BLM demands it's a report led by a black man saying institutional racism does not exist in the UK!
3
reply
fallen_acorns
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#5
Report Thread starter 1 week ago
#5
(Original post by JOSH4598)
I agree - if ever there was something to shut down the BLM demands it's a report led by a black man saying institutional racism does not exist in the UK!
wishful thinking... There are many other black voices who are anti BLM, and they haven't exactly shut it down. How can they, they are quickly branded an uncle tom, told they are race traitors, have internalised racism, are just seeking favour from white people etc.

There are many good excuses that the race-activists will bring out to discredit this person, as always happens.
0
reply
DSilva
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#6
Report 1 week ago
#6
The government says the government are doing a grest job. How surprising.
6
reply
Occitanie
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#7
Report 1 week ago
#7
(Original post by DSilva)
The government says the government are doing a grest job. How surprising.
Wasn't it independent?
4
reply
JOSH4598
Badges: 15
Rep:
?
#8
Report 1 week ago
#8
(Original post by fallen_acorns)
wishful thinking... There are many other black voices who are anti BLM, and they haven't exactly shut it down. How can they, they are quickly branded an uncle tom, told they are race traitors, have internalised racism, are just seeking favour from white people etc.

There are many good excuses that the race-activists will bring out to discredit this person, as always happens.
Yes it is rather sad that when something fits the 'agenda' its written across banners and shoved into the headlines, and when something goes against that agenda its described as racist or sexist lies. People seem to chose which facts they believe...
1
reply
DSilva
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#9
Report 1 week ago
#9
(Original post by Occitanie)
Wasn't it independent?
No. It was a government appointed commission led by someone who's on record for years stating they don't believe institutional racism exists.

So a government that doesn't believe institutional racism exists appoints a panel of people who don't believe institutional racism exists to produce a report saying institutional racism doesn't exist.
2
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#10
Report 1 week ago
#10
(Original post by JOSH4598)
I agree - if ever there was something to shut down the BLM demands it's a report led by a black man saying institutional racism does not exist in the UK!
Appeal to Authority Fallacy, just because a black man said that doesn’t make it true, these are promising stats but sadly they are just stats, the majority of real racism can’t be quantified. It’s ironic that the same day this report drops a school is under siege for banning Afros, imagine a school banning your natural hair which is exclusive to your race lmao. Everyone is so excited to act like racism is a thing of the past in this country which is weird. We’ve made progress but we are not there yet. But i guess when u don’t experience things firsthand it’s easy to look at numbers and ‘shut down BLM’
1
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#11
Report 1 week ago
#11
(Original post by DSilva)
No. It was a government appointed commission led by someone who's on record for years stating they don't believe institutional racism exists.

So a government that doesn't believe institutional racism exists appoints a panel of people who don't believe institutional racism exists to produce a report saying institutional racism doesn't exist.
I knew that this was probably the case for this research so I didn’t even bother reading it in-depth.
• Government wants everyone to think institutional racism is gone
• Government cherry-picks token black person who doesn’t believe in racism
• Research then cherry-picks quantifiable stats that paint the country in a positive light

Wasn’t it that young black man who was beaten to death by the police in Wales the other week and we still haven’t gotten the CCTV footage for it and his family weren’t allowed to see his body because of how it was manhandled? How do u quantify that? this country is exhausting not just for the racism that’s still present, but the way ethnic minorities are just constantly gaslighted. Like these are literally the same day...............

Name:  2A169FF2-A98A-4EA7-8448-73F54B476D3F.jpg.jpeg
Views: 10
Size:  87.5 KB

Name:  59F5C59D-2856-43C1-B6FD-BD919B2D1422.jpg.jpeg
Views: 8
Size:  54.2 KB
1
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#12
Report 1 week ago
#12
Mistakenly posted twice but same sentiments
Last edited by N. Auditoré; 1 week ago
0
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#13
Report 1 week ago
#13
(Original post by fallen_acorns)
wishful thinking... There are many other black voices who are anti BLM, and they haven't exactly shut it down. How can they, they are quickly branded an uncle tom, told they are race traitors, have internalised racism, are just seeking favour from white people etc.

There are many good excuses that the race-activists will bring out to discredit this person, as always happens.
well it’s not exactly difficult to discredit this person, calling the UK a ‘model majority white country’ is rather weird when some schools still ban ethnic hairstyles, people still face racism in their everyday lives and etc. They get discredited because when you’ve experienced racism firsthand and someone who should understand your own experiences tries to gaslight you and say you’re wrong it doesn’t exactly set a good look for them 🤡 what do you actually gain by working hard to discredit the experiences of so many? It really just does seem like he’s probably just some conservative craving favour from other ones
1
reply
fallen_acorns
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#14
Report Thread starter 1 week ago
#14
(Original post by N. Auditoré)
well it’s not exactly difficult to discredit this person, calling the UK a ‘model majority white country’ is rather weird when some schools still ban ethnic hairstyles, people still face racism in their everyday lives and etc. They get discredited because when you’ve experienced racism firsthand and someone who should understand your own experiences tries to gaslight you and say you’re wrong it doesn’t exactly set a good look for them 🤡 what do you actually gain by working hard to discredit the experiences of so many? It really just does seem like he’s probably just some conservative craving favour from other ones
What other white countries would you rather he label the 'model'. If your picking from a group, and you say this is the model X/Y, its usually the best, that the rest should learn from. So if he is wrong, then where else?

The only real arguement I can see is for Canada. Australia, nah.. America.. nah.. Racial surveys constantly put us as the least racist in Europe when it comes to attitudes. South Africa? nah.. etc.

He does actually mention that racism still exists, especially day to day racism and online racism. But his point is that people confuse this for institutionalised racism.

For me, I think the report shows one thing we should all be proud of. Except one group, we live in a nation where minorities all have the chance to do as well as white pupils at school - and in fact do better. That is a pretty great thing right there for equality.
Last edited by fallen_acorns; 1 week ago
4
reply
-Imperator-
Badges: 14
Rep:
?
#15
Report 1 week ago
#15
"Children from ethnic communities did as well or better than white pupils in compulsory education, with black Caribbean pupils the only group to perform less well".
You don't need to commission a report to find this out lol, the stats are freely available online.
0
reply
Rakas21
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#16
Report 1 week ago
#16
(Original post by N. Auditoré)
well it’s not exactly difficult to discredit this person, calling the UK a ‘model majority white country’ is rather weird when some schools still ban ethnic hairstyles, people still face racism in their everyday lives and etc. They get discredited because when you’ve experienced racism firsthand and someone who should understand your own experiences tries to gaslight you and say you’re wrong it doesn’t exactly set a good look for them 🤡 what do you actually gain by working hard to discredit the experiences of so many? It really just does seem like he’s probably just some conservative craving favour from other ones
I think your somewhat conflating the intent of the report.

Nobody is really suggesting that racism does not exist, what this report asserts is that this racism is not built into the system at an institutional level. That is to say that the report suggests that actually schools and employers have non-racist processes, it does not mean that somebody as an individual has not called you a (insert profanity).

This report was not designed to ask whether racism exists, it is whether racism exists institutionally.
3
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#17
Report 1 week ago
#17
(Original post by fallen_acorns)
What other white countries would you rather he label the 'model'. If your picking from a group, and you say this is the model X/Y, its usually the best, that the rest should learn from. So if he is wrong, then where else?

The only real arguement I can see is for Canada. Australia, nah.. America.. nah.. Racial surveys constantly put us as the least racist in Europe when it comes to attitudes. South Africa? nah.. etc.

He does actually mention that racism still exists, especially day to day racism and online racism. But his point is that people confuse this for institutionalised racism.

For me, I think the report shows one thing we should all be proud of. Except one group, we live in a nation where minorities all have the chance to do as well as white pupils at school - and in fact do better. That is a pretty great thing right there for equality.
I would rather he label none of them as model, relative superiority ≠ superiority. While the UK is admittedly better in a few aspects than other countries that doesn’t actually make is good as a whole, a common misconception often made. Besides, like u said i prefer Canada. This country is far from a model anything. Who is answering those racial surveys because I’m sure it’s probably white ppl (because we are in a majorly white country obviously) who are not the target demographic for racial abuse. Again, this is why trying to quantify racism is not effective often. Research methods have various drawbacks and advantages.

Also, institutional racism has many fields and colours that as i said, would probably not be covered. Trying to cover all of it is impossible hence why i said he cherry-picks. I see no mention of the fact that black women are like 4x more likely to die during childbirth, or how black people are more likely to wait longer for kidney transplants etc. Institutional racism is just that, institutional. It is interwoven under many surfaces. As Imperator pointed out, most of these stats were already available online and don’t exactly prove much.

As for those racial surveys as i said, or better yet in the words of Dave “the least racist is still racist”, no?

Also, hate crime inquiries by race increeased by 62% over lockdown so i would say we’re really not doing great at all or in a position to be celebrating being a model anything, as i said, just people trying their hardest to dismiss

https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sk...kdown-12102949
0
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#18
Report 1 week ago
#18
Really and truly plenty of the UK’s institutions have racism, the media, the medical field, the royal family, i will say though, the education system is definitely getting so much better. a bit more work to be done but getting there.
0
reply
N. Auditoré
Badges: 22
Rep:
?
#19
Report 1 week ago
#19
(Original post by Rakas21)
I think your somewhat conflating the intent of the report.

Nobody is really suggesting that racism does not exist, what this report asserts is that this racism is not built into the system at an institutional level. That is to say that the report suggests that actually schools and employers have non-racist processes, it does not mean that somebody as an individual has not called you a (insert profanity).

This report was not designed to ask whether racism exists, it is whether racism exists institutionally.
School and Employers are not the only institutions, no? The Police? The Medical Field? Do y’all actually know how wide the term ‘institutional racism’ covers ¿
0
reply
Rakas21
Badges: 21
Rep:
?
#20
Report 1 week ago
#20
(Original post by N. Auditoré)
School and Employers are not the only institutions, no? The Police? The Medical Field? Do y’all actually know how wide the term ‘institutional racism’ covers ¿
While i have not read it to know if it includes the medical field there are multiple reports which have shown little to no evidence of racism in the current UK police at an institutional level. The UK is not the USA (granted there used to be). I can't imagine the health service can be accused of racism though given its probably got the highest proportion of immigrant labour.

The police in the UK are arguably the biggest sufferers as an institution because they get investigated every other year and people just ignore it when they are perpetually found innocent. Hell, the police in Rochdale allowed BAME folk to rape women such was their fear of being racist in their approach.
1
reply
X

Quick Reply

Attached files
Write a reply...
Reply
new posts
Back
to top
Latest
My Feed

See more of what you like on
The Student Room

You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

Personalise

What would make a great online university open day?

Virtual campus tour (66)
19.13%
Virtual accommodation tour (51)
14.78%
Find out about sports clubs, societies and facilities (17)
4.93%
Video content about the local area (3)
0.87%
Webinars with lecturers (11)
3.19%
Taster lectures or seminars (72)
20.87%
Speak to current students studying my course (80)
23.19%
Speak to current students about the uni in general (13)
3.77%
Fun online activities or experiences (12)
3.48%
Connecting with careers services or employers (8)
2.32%
Info about student wellbeing and support services (6)
1.74%
Something else (let us know in the thread!) (6)
1.74%

Watched Threads

View All