I think Keir cares about the working class.

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CathScottish
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I think Keir Starmer cares about the working class.
The Labour Party cares about the working class, and tries to improve their public services they use.
In politics the far right tend to hate the working class and the far right tends to see the working class as parasites on the rich,.
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Starship Trooper
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I think SIR Keir Starmer hates the white working class.
The Labour Party hates the white working class, and tries to spend all their money on woke garbage.
In politics liberals tend to hate the white working class and liberals tends to see the WWC as "deplorables" , "gammons" or ",racists". Meanwhile they champion the same "progressive" views as virtually every major corporation whilst having the nerve to pretend to be the underdog and lecture people about privilege.

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Last edited by Starship Trooper; 4 weeks ago
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Just my opinion
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Most of the middle class upper echelons and younger members that have been through uni loath the blue collar working class with their demands for action on immigration and pro Brexit voting. They treat them like embarrassing older relatives they only go to see once a year to get their Christmas present, only in their case it's every four years to get their vote.
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
I think Keir Starmer cares about the working class.
The Labour Party cares about the working class, and tries to improve their public services they use.
In politics the far right tend to hate the working class and the far right tends to see the working class as parasites on the rich,.
The "far right" (which I'm guessing you use to say "people who voted UKIP in 2015") is a working-class movement. There's a difference between the neocons within the Tory party (who don't care about the working class) and populists like Farage, who draw their support from the working class.

(Original post by Starship Trooper)
I think SIR Keir Starmer hates the white working class.
The Labour Party hates the white working class, and tries to spend all their money on woke garbage.
In politics liberals tend to hate the white working class and liberals tends to see the WWC as "deplorables" , "gammons" or ",racists". Meanwhile they champion the same "progressive" views as virtually every major corporation whilst having the nerve to pretend to be the underdog and lecture people about privilege.

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PRSOM.

If you're on the same side as Vogue magazine and basically every major company you aren't a revolutionary.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by Louis IX)
The "far right" (which I'm guessing you use to say "people who voted UKIP in 2015") is a working-class movement. There's a difference between the neocons within the Tory party (who don't care about the working class) and populists like Farage, who draw their support from the working class.
I actually think class politics is basically dead, eg you can have some plumber who owns his own house etc and is common as muck and you can have somebody with a middle class background with a degree in fine arts living in poverty.

There are some old school commies eg Galloway who do still genuinely care about class politics but they're a dying breed.

Whilst I'm obviously no commie I do agree with the Marxist idea of lumpenproles or underclass- eg the criminals, illegals and social parasites. Marx correctly called them out as "exploiting society for their own ends" and being tools of the ruling establishment. We can see this clearly with the trash that make up BLM and Antifa.
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CathScottish
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Starship Trooper - You have been brainwashed by far right media. Keir Starmer has fought for the ordinary working class people his entire life. He supports strong public services and equality and social justice.
I can assure you the Labour Party do not hate the working class be that white or any other race.
The Labour Party brought in the mini wage, tax credits for working families, sure start, and increased spending on public services used by the working class.
You have been watching too much far right wing media. I am warning you. You have been brainwashed. You have been utterly conned and brainwashed by far right media. You probably watch far right media every day.
The Labour Party was formed for the working class. Keir cares about the working class. Be that white or any other race,.
You are not a rebel for supporting the far right elites like billionaires Trump and his cronies.
It is not heroic or brave to stand up for racism, and bigotry.



You right wing extremists want to claim all working class people are racist. I know the working class and most of us are not racist.
I can assure you right wing extremists hate the working class, They see the poor as parasites on the rich.
They want to have culture wars against the poor, against the working class, against the ethnic minorities and against women.
You think you are standing up to the elites. You are just suckers who have been conned by divisive bigoted propaganda.
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Louis IX
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(Original post by Starship Trooper)
I actually think class politics is basically dead, eg you can have some plumber who owns his own house etc and is common as muck and you can have somebody with a middle class background with a degree in fine arts living in poverty.

There are some old school commies eg Galloway who do still genuinely care about class politics but they're a dying breed.

Whilst I'm obviously no commie I do agree with the Marxist idea of lumpenproles or underclass- eg the criminals, illegals and social parasites. Marx correctly called them out as "exploiting society for their own ends" and being tools of the ruling establishment. We can see this clearly with the trash that make up BLM and Antifa.
I get what you mean. When I talk about "class" I use it to mean "how much you earn", not "how you speak". That sort of class distinction is pretty much dead.

Yeah. There's a reason lots of Antifa's members have been done for sex offenses.
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper - You have been brainwashed by far right media. Keir Starmer has fought for the ordinary working class people his entire life. He supports strong public services and equality and social justice.
I can assure you the Labour Party do not hate the working class be that white or any other race.
The Labour Party brought in the mini wage, tax credits for working families, sure start, and increased spending on public services used by the working class.
You have been watching too much far right wing media. I am warning you. You have been brainwashed. You have been utterly conned and brainwashed by far right media. You probably watch far right media every day.
The Labour Party was formed for the working class. Keir cares about the working class. Be that white or any other race,.
You are not a rebel for supporting the far right elites like billionaires Trump and his cronies.
It is not heroic or brave to stand up for racism, and bigotry.



You right wing extremists want to claim all working class people are racist. I know the working class and most of us are not racist.
I can assure you right wing extremists hate the working class, They see the poor as parasites on the rich.
They want to have culture wars against the poor, against the working class, against the ethnic minorities and against women.
You think you are standing up to the elites. You are just suckers who have been conned by divisive bigoted propaganda.
:rofl:

All this implies that you haven't been brainwashed by the Guardian and leftists on Twitter.
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CathScottish
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I read views form all sides. And you are the one who has been brainwashed. When you use an obsession with Antifa. You obviously spend all day watching far right tv stations and websites.,
You are fighting for the bad guys, when you back far right extremists.
Sex abuse is evil. There have been sex offenders on the far right.
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
I read views form all sides. And you are the one who has been brainwashed. When you use an obsession with Antifa. You obviously spend all day watching far right tv stations and websites.,
You are fighting for the bad guys, when you back far right extremists.
Sex abuse is evil. There have been sex offenders on the far right.
Just because a group calls itself "Antifa" doesn't mean all its enemies are fascists. If the Nazi Party called itself the "Anti-Puppy Kicking Party", would that mean all its enemies wanted to kick puppies?
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Starship Trooper
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Cath Scottish- You have been brainwashed by liberal media. Keir Starmer has fought for the rights of criminals his entire life. He supports woke public services and equality and social justice. Which means open borders and punishing white people, promoting "critical race theory" and supporting far left causes like BLM.
I can assure you the Tory Party do not hate the working class be that white or any other race.
The Labour Party brought in the War on Terror, the huge expansion of the state, damaged civil liberties, huge amounts of immigration - some of whom have gone on to commit terrorism and done many other harmful things.
You have been watching too much liberal media. I am warning you. You have been brainwashed. You have been utterly conned and brainwashed by liberal media. You probably watch liberal media every day.

The Labour Party was formed for the working class. Now it is a coalition of immigrants, wasters, criminals, students, single parents and the well to do bien pensant privileged classes. Which have values almost completely at odds with the typical working class person.

Keir cares only about the working class voting for him . Be that white or any other race, as long as they support his agenda.

I am a rebel for supporting Trump and his cronies.

It is not heroic or brave to stand up for "equality and diversity" or liberal garbage when those are the same values taught to you in school and as Louis IX said are the same as virtually every major company on the planet.

This alone doesn't necessarily make your ideas wrong per se but it does mean that you have to acknowledge that your ideas are the dominant ones in this society and your views are the establishment ones.

Liberals like to pretend that the country is still run by racist old white men in dinner jackets but this hasn't been the case for decades.

I challenge you to find me one major bank or corporation that does not support BLM, Gay pride or mass immigration.

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You liberal extremists want to claim all white people are racist.
You think you are standing up to the elites. You are just suckers who have been conned by divisive bigoted propaganda.
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username4986690
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(Original post by CathScottish)
You right wing extremists want to claim all working class people are racist. I know the working class and most of us are not racist.
I can assure you right wing extremists hate the working class, They see the poor as parasites on the rich.
They want to have culture wars against the poor, against the working class, against the ethnic minorities and against women.
You think you are standing up to the elites. You are just suckers who have been conned by divisive bigoted propaganda.
Wanting to control immigration doesn't make someone racist, it makes them sensible.

The massive drop in immigration in the last year has seen previously low paying job such as restaurant work or HGV drivers getting a massive pay rise because immigrants aren't driving down the wages. This is something that the working class have been saying for decades and the Labour party has totally ignored them, in fact the left in general has chalked this sentiment up to "racism" or "bigoted" for the last 10 years.

This is why we saw the rise of UKIP and Brexit, the white working class were fed up of not being listened to. The Tories said they would be tough on immigration then did nothing and Labour said they were a bunch of bigots for even broaching the subject.
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CathScottish
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Starship Trooper You are saying that any organisation that kneels to BLM should be destroyed. That is a far far right tyrannical attitude to take. What about freedom of minority groups to give their point of view?
You are an extremist. I am liberal and want the best of socialism and capitalism. I want all races to be equal, I do not want anyone to suffer racism, sexism, bullying, or homophobia.
You are being brainwashed by far right propaganda. You spout out stuff you have been told on American far right groups., Wake up,
The left love working class people regardless of race. There is no evidence at all that Keir Starmer has a problem with white people. He is white. When has he ever said anything against white people? Supporting racial equality does not mean you hate white people. Supporting social justice does not mean you hate white people. Supporting the poor does not mean you hate white people.
Just as I am against anti-Semitism. That does not mean I hate Christians or Muslims.
You need a reality check. You are utterly suckered by far right propaganda,
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CathScottish
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Louis IX I am against NAZIs. The NAZIs killed 6 million Jews. We need to remember that.



DiddyDec It is racist to hate immigrants. Lots of working class people came over from Eastern Europe to improve their lives. I happy for that. Eastern European immigrants are people also. The Labour Party brought in the mini wage. And that affected working class people. Hating immigrants does not mean you love the working class,
More evidence needs to be done on wage rises. A mini wage increase would have more impact, than just persecuting immigrants.
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by Louis IX)
:rofl:

All this implies that you haven't been brainwashed by the Guardian and leftists on Twitter.
If it sounds like a guardian reader, and looks like a guardian reader, and walks like a guardian reader, it’s most likely; a guardian reader.
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(Original post by Just my opinion)
Most of the middle class upper echelons and younger members that have been through uni loath the blue collar working class with their demands for action on immigration and pro Brexit voting. They treat them like embarrassing older relatives they only go to see once a year to get their Christmas present, only in their case it's every four years to get their vote.
I mean, I’ll be totally honest that’s how I see them. Their bad decision making is not my problem.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper You are saying that any organisation that kneels to BLM should be destroyed....
I haven't said that.

I've said that institutional power and the bulk of corporations have virtually the same beliefs as you. Therefore the idea that your views are in any way radical or transgressive is for the birds. You are not standing up for working class people you're standing up for the liberal establishment.

You're right, being in favour of more immigration and social justice doesn't necessarily mean you hate white people it's just often the case that you do.

Just like being against immigration doesn't necessarily mean you are prejudiced against certain people even though that's often the case too.

Also it's very condescending to accuse people of being brainwashed, if anything that just goes to show how indoctrinated you are. I was brought up in a left wing family and sent to a left wing uni in liberal UK and I used to be a socialist- was I brainwashed then?

And what about you? Were you brought up with very strict conservative parents in a traditional country like Poland but decided you wanted to be a liberal after being a conservative? I highly doubt it.
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username4986690
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Louis IX I am against NAZIs. The NAZIs killed 6 million Jews. We need to remember that.



DiddyDec It is racist to hate immigrants. Lots of working class people came over from Eastern Europe to improve their lives. I happy for that. Eastern European immigrants are people also. The Labour Party brought in the mini wage. And that affected working class people. Hating immigrants does not mean you love the working class,
More evidence needs to be done on wage rises. A mini wage increase would have more impact, than just persecuting immigrants.
Where did I say anything about hating immigrants?

Do you accept that cheap foreign labor drives down wages?

Why do you think wages have risen while immigration as lowered?
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CathScottish
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Starship Trooper - I do not define my views by whether they are transgressive or not. I make my moral values according to what is right. Hitler would be transgressive nowadays. Hitler was evil. You surely do not define your views by what is rebellious. You have to choose the morally just cause.
I am against racism. I am against bullying. I am against homophobia. I am against sexism. I am against poverty. I am against inequality. I am for peace and justice, I hold my values whether the elite or the powerful agree or disagree with them.
There are groups in power who support racism, bullying, inequality, war, homophobia, sexism, and the persecution of minority groups.

But I can assure you standing up for racism is not heroic, rebellious or morally just.
Great leaders and thinkers do not just do things simply because they are transgressive. That would be the actions of a childish ignorant troll. Great leaders and thinkers think out the morally just side.
Do you think Martin Luther King would now have supported racism on the basis that is was transgressive to so?
Do you think Nelson Mandela would have supported apartheid on the basis it is now transgressive to do so?
Do you think Jesus would have campaigned for hatred, intolerance, and war if it was transgressive to do so?
Do you think that Mahatma Gandhi would now be campaigning for the British Empire to rule over India, on the basis it was now transgressive to do so.


YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWSHED BY THE FAR RIGHT.
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper - I do not define my views by whether they are transgressive or not. I make my moral values according to what is right. Hitler would be transgressive nowadays. Hitler was evil. You surely do not define your views by what is rebellious. You have to choose the morally just cause.
I am against racism. I am against bullying. I am against homophobia. I am against sexism. I am against poverty. I am against inequality. I am for peace and justice, I hold my values whether the elite or the powerful agree or disagree with them.
There are groups in power who support racism, bullying, inequality, war, homophobia, sexism, and the persecution of minority groups.

But I can assure you standing up for racism is not heroic, rebellious or morally just.
Great leaders and thinkers do not just do things simply because they are transgressive. That would be the actions of a childish ignorant troll. Great leaders and thinkers think out the morally just side.
Do you think Martin Luther King would now have supported racism on the basis that is was transgressive to so?
Do you think Nelson Mandela would have supported apartheid on the basis it is now transgressive to do so?
Do you think Jesus would have campaigned for hatred, intolerance, and war if it was transgressive to do so?
Do you think that Mahatma Gandhi would now be campaigning for the British Empire to rule over India, on the basis it was now transgressive to do so.


YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWSHED BY THE FAR RIGHT.
Debate the point not the person.

Also caps lock is not cruise control for cool.
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