I think Keir cares about the working class.

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Starship Trooper
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My point was that you and other liberals like to portray yourselves as brace freedom fighters against a tyrannical status quo. But you are the status quo.

I obviously do not have my views because they're transgressive. Well not entirely, I am s bit of a contrarian and I do enjoy winding people up esp if they deserve it.

I don't believe in left wing narratives about "racism" , "sexism" or "homophobia" which exist just as ways for liberals to shut down dissent. They're basically blasphemy laws.

As for our Lord and Saviour:

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YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWASHED BY LIBERALS!
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Louis IX
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(Original post by DiddyDec)
Wanting to control immigration doesn't make someone racist, it makes them sensible.

The massive drop in immigration in the last year has seen previously low paying job such as restaurant work or HGV drivers getting a massive pay rise because immigrants aren't driving down the wages. This is something that the working class have been saying for decades and the Labour party has totally ignored them, in fact the left in general has chalked this sentiment up to "racism" or "bigoted" for the last 10 years.

This is why we saw the rise of UKIP and Brexit, the white working class were fed up of not being listened to. The Tories said they would be tough on immigration then did nothing and Labour said they were a bunch of bigots for even broaching the subject.
Yeah.

It's obvious that the majority of multinational businesses would rather employ Jan from Gdansk who'll work for £5 an hour, than employ John from Gravesend who'll work for £10 an hour. When John pointed this out to the liberal elite he was called a "racist" and told that Jan made the UK so much better and all these foreigners have lovely food and make great au pairs, dahling. When John voted UKIP in 2015 and voted Brexit in 2016, the liberal elite had no idea why this happened and proceeded to blame "right wing newspapers", "the Koch Brothers" or whatever boogeyman they could find rather than deal with the fact that John had a mortgage to pay and a family to feed.
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
You think you are standing up to the elites. You are just suckers who have been conned by divisive bigoted propaganda.
Exactly. Who do these people think is pushing CRT on the people? People like Jack Dorsey, the owner of Twitter, who gave Ibram Kendi $10 million. If a "revolutionary movement" is being lavishly funded by the people who control society, it isn't a revolution. It's a bunch of spoilt brats larping as a revolution and making sure that the white working class and the black working class hate each other more than they hate the spoilt brats.

(Original post by CathScottish)
Louis IX I am against NAZIs. The NAZIs killed 6 million Jews. We need to remember that.



DiddyDec It is racist to hate immigrants. Lots of working class people came over from Eastern Europe to improve their lives. I happy for that. Eastern European immigrants are people also. The Labour Party brought in the mini wage. And that affected working class people. Hating immigrants does not mean you love the working class,
More evidence needs to be done on wage rises. A mini wage increase would have more impact, than just persecuting immigrants.
And the commies killed 100 million people. We need to remember that.

Eastern Europeans are people too. They are not serfs we can bring over here when we want. Eastern Europe would be in a far better place if the West didn't take its young people and get them to pick fruit here instead of help build up their own countries.
(Original post by CathScottish)
Do you think Jesus would have campaigned for hatred, intolerance, and war if it was transgressive to do so?
If Jesus lived in Britain, you and the rest of you wokists would set up a campaign to get Him crucified for "hate speech".
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by Louis IX)
And the commies killed 100 million people. We need to remember that.


If Jesus lived in Britain, you and the rest of you wokists would set up a campaign to get Him crucified for "hate speech".
Prsom. Based and So True!

"White Nationalist attacks innocent money lenders in anti- Semitic diatribe". In other news : independent fact checkers show that Herod didn't order the death of babies.

- The guardian 2000 years ago.

(Also saw this and PMSL, hope you enjoy)

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CathScottish
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Starship Trooper. I would rather be brainwashed by liberals than the far right,

Louis IX - We could easily solve the wage problem by increasing the mini wage We do not need to persecute immigrants to do so,
Fighting racism is about uniting white and black people. It is people like you who divide black and white people. You seriously think there is an evil campaign by liberals to make white and black people hate each other. You need a reality check. Do you seriously believe the stuff you make up?
Plus - Why do you think me hating NAZIs makes me a communist? You have totally lost it. Totally. I criticise the NAZIs and you start calling me a communist. You have lost it. You have shown your true colours for everyone

Jesus never did hate speech. What on Earth are you talking about? Nobody has been told to be crucified by the left?. Jesus was a extreme left winger. Do you think he would have hated immigrants,? Do you think he would have hated black people?
Do you think he would have hated the poor? Do you think he would have discriminated against the sick and the ill? Grow up.
(Original post by Louis IX)
Yeah.

It's obvious that the majority of multinational businesses would rather employ Jan from Gdansk who'll work for £5 an hour, than employ John from Gravesend who'll work for £10 an hour. When John pointed this out to the liberal elite he was called a "racist" and told that Jan made the UK so much better and all these foreigners have lovely food and make great au pairs, dahling. When John voted UKIP in 2015 and voted Brexit in 2016, the liberal elite had no idea why this happened and proceeded to blame "right wing newspapers", "the Koch Brothers" or whatever boogeyman they could find rather than deal with the fact that John had a mortgage to pay and a family to feed.

Exactly. Who do these people think is pushing CRT on the people? People like Jack Dorsey, the owner of Twitter, who gave Ibram Kendi $10 million. If a "revolutionary movement" is being lavishly funded by the people who control society, it isn't a revolution. It's a bunch of spoilt brats larping as a revolution and making sure that the white working class and the black working class hate each other more than they hate the spoilt brats.


And the commies killed 100 million people. We need to remember that.

Eastern Europeans are people too. They are not serfs we can bring over here when we want. Eastern Europe would be in a far better place if the West didn't take its young people and get them to pick fruit here instead of help build up their own countries.

If Jesus lived in Britain, you and the rest of you wokists would set up a campaign to get Him crucified for "hate speech".
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper. I would rather be brainwashed by liberals than the far right,

Louis IX - We could easily solve the wage problem by increasing the mini wage We do not need to persecute immigrants to do so,
Fighting racism is about uniting white and black people. It is people like you who divide black and white people. You seriously think there is an evil campaign by liberals to make white and black people hate each other. You need a reality check. Do you seriously believe the stuff you make up?
Plus - Why do you think me hating NAZIs makes me a communist? You have totally lost it. Totally. I criticise the NAZIs and you start calling me a communist. You have lost it. You have shown your true colours for everyone

Jesus never did hate speech. What on Earth are you talking about? Nobody has been told to be crucified by the left?. Jesus was a extreme left winger. Do you think he would have hated immigrants,? Do you think he would have hated black people?
Do you think he would have hated the poor? Do you think he would have discriminated against the sick and the ill? Grow up.
> we could easily solve the wage problem by increasing the [minimum] wage
Or, here's a thought; we could cut out the middleman and pay British people to work in the UK, instead of employing serfs from aboard to do the jobs we think are for the "little people".

> It is people like you who divide black and white people.
Love, I'm not the one who destroyed the black community in the US by promoting abortion and single motherhood. I'm not the one who thinks Lil Nas X is a better role model for young black people than Cardinal Robert Sarah. I'm not the one who lets young black men carve each other up so I can do lines of cocaine.

> You seriously think there is an evil campaign by liberals to make white and black people hate each other.
There is. Jeff Bezos have worked out that if us "peasants" are fighting among each other we won't go after him. Him and his fellow billionaires (people like Mark Zuckerberg, George Soros, etc) have worked out that if you divide the people into groups (blacks and whites, Christians and atheists, Tories and socialists) then they're easier to rule. Critical race theory is a way to do that.

> Why do you think me hating NAZIs [sic] makes me a communist?
You pointed out that we should remember the victims of National Socialism. I pointed out that we should remember the victims of Communism. Do you have a problem with acknowledging that communism has killed 100 million people?

> Jesus never did hate speech.
Jesus said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.". Many people believe that teaching is "hate speech". If Jesus came down from Heaven, stood on a soapbox in your town square, and preached that only Christians could be saved, you'd call Him a "bigot" and an "anti-Semite".

> Jesus was an extreme left winger
"And Jesus said to his disciples; 'Go, and teach all nations that they must wear $60 sweatshirts with 'Tax the Rich' written on them and go to Pride parades. Behold, I am with you all days, unless those days involve abortion debates, in which case you can ignore anything I said.'" (Wokians 13:12).
Grow up, and stop implying that Our Lord - the King of Heaven - would be a revolutionary.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Fighting racism is about uniting white and black people. It is people like you who divide black and white people.

You seriously think there is an evil campaign by liberals to make white and black people hate each other.



Jesus never did hate speech. What on Earth are you talking about? Nobody has been told to be crucified by the left?. Jesus was a extreme left winger. Do you think he would have hated immigrants,? Do you think he would have hated black people?
Do you think he would have hated the poor? Do you think he would have discriminated against the sick and the ill? Grow up.
I do not hate immigrants or black people. That is just what you try and portray it as. I just think, for a variety of reasons which we can explore, that we should drastically limit the amount of immigration we have and that we don't owe anything to black people and shouldn't change our society to better suit them.

There isn't a campaign by liberals to make blacks and whites hate each other. There is a campaign by liberals to demonise white people - see terms like "white fragility" and "white privilege" etc being taught in the public and private sector.

Jesus said lots of things that could be considered hateful. Eg about "sinners" going to hell for ever. And not to mention worshiping his father who was partial to a bit of genocide too. So in short yes Jesus did practice hate speech.

Another thing about Jesus - yes he did hang around sinners. But he wasn't telling them they should be "proud" of their sins. Quite the opposite. And whilst Jesus did help the poor - he didn't say - "and though shall vote in a socialist government to take care of everything for you " either, but that you should help the poor. I have absolutely no problem with telling sinners not to sin or with people voluntarily giving to charity.
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Louis IX I do not support serfdom. And I support legal immigration. So people can come here and make a better life for themselves. I see no problem in that. It is nothing to do with jobs for the little people. That is what you think. You have shown yourself up.
No liberal wants black people to kill each other. Why are you trying to claim liberals want that? That is a straw man argument.
Then you pout out some nonsense conspiracy theory that liberals want black and white people to fight each other. Then you claim it is all some conspiracy of liberal billionaires wanting that. You really have lost it. Donald Trump is the one who spread racial divisions. Wake up and see that.
I have no problem with accepting communist tyrants killed 100 million. You are the one who seems to think that I am a communist for hating Hitler.
Jesus was Jewish. Hardly anyone on the left would claim Jesus was anti-Semitic. You are just making straw man arguments.
Jesus was so left wing, even I would find some of his views tough to agree with, and I am left wing. He was left wing on crime, tolerance, peace, economics, racism, work, the rich. Jesus said 'it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus would not recognise your version of his teachings.
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Starship Trooper It is not anti-white to point out that racism and slavery are evil.
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper It is not anti-white to point out that racism and slavery are evil.
I agree with you regarding slavery. I think "racism" isn't always a bad thing and neither do most people including liberals. Eg positive discrimination is racist as it favours one group over another because of their race. Eg it's seen as beneficial for the greater good. I don't think racism is a problem anymore and in fact we should probably be more racist frankly. I think race relations were better in the eighties.

Do you really think Jesus would have been pro choice and supportive of things like gay marriage? What about people who weren't Christian? I don't think he'd be very tolerant of other religions or athiests personally.
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Louis IX I do not support serfdom. And I support legal immigration. So people can come here and make a better life for themselves. I see no problem in that. It is nothing to do with jobs for the little people. That is what you think. You have shown yourself up.
No liberal wants black people to kill each other. Why are you trying to claim liberals want that? That is a straw man argument.
Then you pout out some nonsense conspiracy theory that liberals want black and white people to fight each other. Then you claim it is all some conspiracy of liberal billionaires wanting that. You really have lost it. Donald Trump is the one who spread racial divisions. Wake up and see that.
I have no problem with accepting communist tyrants killed 100 million. You are the one who seems to think that I am a communist for hating Hitler.
Jesus was Jewish. Hardly anyone on the left would claim Jesus was anti-Semitic. You are just making straw man arguments.
Jesus was so left wing, even I would find some of his views tough to agree with, and I am left wing. He was left wing on crime, tolerance, peace, economics, racism, work, the rich. Jesus said 'it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus would not recognise your version of his teachings.
> I do not support serfdom
Why do you support mass immigration and policies that use foreigners as cheap labour, and essentially treat them like serfs?

> No liberal wants black people to kill each other
Then why do many liberals take drugs that are sold by gangs, which contribute to the deaths of thousands of young black men?

> some conspiracy of liberal billionaires wanting that
George Soros is a billionaire, as well as a liberal. Has he stopped existing?

> Donald Trump is the one who spread racial divisions
Really? Name me one racist remark Trump made during his presidency.

> I have no problem with accepting communist tyrants killed 100 million
Then why do you get annoyed every time I bring it up?

> Jesus was Jewish.
No. Jesus went against the Pharisees' teachings, which form the basis of Rabbinic Judaism today. He would have nothing in common religiously with modern-day Jews.

> Jesus was left-wing and taught leftist ideas
It sounds like you agree with Him on a lot of things. Do you follow the religion He founded, or do you just cherry-pick His teachings to suit your arguments?

> Jesus would not recognise your version of His teachings
And why is that, oh wise one? Has the Pope died and made you his successor, or are you just a guy on the internet pretending to infallibly know what Jesus really meant?
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Starship Trooper - Jesus never said anything about gay marriage. What right have you got to make up an opinion for him?
There is no way we should be more racist. Racism is like bullying. It can cause serious mental damage to victims. It is easy for a white person to ask for more racism.
How would you like it if someone beat you up for being white, or shouted racist abuse a you for being white, or discriminated against you in your career. You are a weak minded individual.
You have been utterly brainwashed by the far right. You are deeply dangerous in your values. And positive discrimination is not racist, it is just making up for racism and racial discrimination. Just like rules helping women into parliament are not sexist.
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Louis IX The legal immigrants are not being paid cheap wages by their standards. They would not come here if it was not to improve their lives. It is not serfdom. You have no idea what serfdom is.

Many right wing and left wing people take drugs. To claim only liberals take drugs is utter utter nonsense. Look how much of the Tory cabinet have admitted to taking drugs. Grow up with your arguments. You need to up your arguments.

Soros is some hate figure for far right extremists. I wonder why?

Trump insulted Mexican immigrants saying they were criminals and rapists,.
Trump called for all Muslims to be banned from entering the USA.
In 2017 Trump said there were some very fine people” among the white supremacists in Charlottesville.
Trumo claimed Obama was born out of the USA.

I get annoyed when you bring up communists killing 100 million people because you are claiming I am a communist. I am not.,

Jesus was more left wing than me. He was a virtual communist in some of his values.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Starship Trooper - Jesus never said anything about gay marriage. What right have you got to make up an opinion for him?

There is no way we should be more racist. Racism is like bullying. It can cause serious mental damage to victims.

It is easy for a white person to ask for more racism.
It says in the Bible that homosexuality is an abomination. You'd have thought Jesus would have corrected the record if he disagreed.

It's like bullying - eg it's sometimes justified haha.

Well it's not actually, I could get into all sorts of trouble for saying that. It's easy to talk about how anti racist you are.


How would you like it if someone beat you up for being white, or shouted racist abuse a you for being white,
I don't support doing either of those things to others.

or discriminated against you in your career.

You are a weak minded individual.
Well I wouldn't like it but I'd get over it. Employers should be able to hire whoever they want. I wouldn't want to work somewhere where the only reason I was there was that they had to employ me.

That is very wrong of you to say that to me, don't you know that could cause me serious mental distress? :rolleyes:


And positive discrimination is not racist, it is just making up for racism and racial discrimination. Just like rules helping women into parliament are not sexist.

Wait hang on, you said "how would I like it if I was discriminated against" but are now arguing for discrimination. And yes even if it's designed to combat historical racism, giving one group of people preferential treatment because of their race is still racism.

And yes, the same is true of giving women a job instead of men purely because of their sex.

You can say you're doing it for the "greater good" but you're still doing it.

So we've learned from the above that you actually do support bullying and discrimination in the right circumstances which is basically the same as my position (you're just the left wing version)
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Rakas21
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OP, I’m not quite sure which point you wish to discuss as the thread topic.

Your statement regarding Labour makes a somewhat speculative statement which while correct in intent is not really developed in reality. Starmer let us not forget spent three years attempting to betray the vote of the working classes, he may care about the working class but he is part of the London Labour set who believe the working class should do as they are told by their betters, lest they be allowed to display their barbarian bigotry.

Your statement about the far right is not well defined (who do you consider far right) and suggests you don’t really understand the right perhaps. We believe in self responsibility, justice, merit, patriotism, decorum and loyalty, not kneeling at the feet of the rich.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Jesus was more left wing than me. He was a virtual communist in some of his values.
I actually agree. But awesome modern day Chinese or Russian communists not cringe western Marxists

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Starship Trooper
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CathScottish

Also, do you support open borders? Eg allowing anyone in to stay in the UK, so potentially millions of third world people move into the UK?

If not why?
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imlikeahermit
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Louis IX I do not support serfdom. And I support legal immigration. So people can come here and make a better life for themselves. I see no problem in that. It is nothing to do with jobs for the little people. That is what you think. You have shown yourself up.
No liberal wants black people to kill each other. Why are you trying to claim liberals want that? That is a straw man argument.
Then you pout out some nonsense conspiracy theory that liberals want black and white people to fight each other. Then you claim it is all some conspiracy of liberal billionaires wanting that. You really have lost it. Donald Trump is the one who spread racial divisions. Wake up and see that.
I have no problem with accepting communist tyrants killed 100 million. You are the one who seems to think that I am a communist for hating Hitler.
Jesus was Jewish. Hardly anyone on the left would claim Jesus was anti-Semitic. You are just making straw man arguments.
Jesus was so left wing, even I would find some of his views tough to agree with, and I am left wing. He was left wing on crime, tolerance, peace, economics, racism, work, the rich. Jesus said 'it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus would not recognise your version of his teachings.
If you support unlimited legal immigration can I just confirm as to how many rooms in your house you’re making available to these people? Or should my taxes pay for that as well?
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Louis IX
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(Original post by CathScottish)
Louis IX The legal immigrants are not being paid cheap wages by their standards. They would not come here if it was not to improve their lives. It is not serfdom. You have no idea what serfdom is.

Many right wing and left wing people take drugs. To claim only liberals take drugs is utter utter nonsense. Look how much of the Tory cabinet have admitted to taking drugs. Grow up with your arguments. You need to up your arguments.

Soros is some hate figure for far right extremists. I wonder why?

Trump insulted Mexican immigrants saying they were criminals and rapists,.
Trump called for all Muslims to be banned from entering the USA.
In 2017 Trump said there were some very fine people” among the white supremacists in Charlottesville.
Trumo claimed Obama was born out of the USA.

I get annoyed when you bring up communists killing 100 million people because you are claiming I am a communist. I am not.,

Jesus was more left wing than me. He was a virtual communist in some of his values.
Many immigrants get paid £5 an hour and live where they work. Many more are held as literal slaves by gypsies (but God forbid you criticise them or you're waycist).

Yes, the Tory cabinet have all taken dugs. This doesn't mean that many liberals don't take drugs and fund gang crime.

Because he funds liberal organisations in places like Hungary and tries to force liberalism on them against their will. Soros is a billionaire, so I'm not sure why you're sticking up for him.

He was talking about MS-13. Muslims are not a race. The "very fine people" remark was taken out of context and Trump called the white supremacists there "very bad people":
They didn’t put themselves -- and you had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides.
What he was saying was that there were good people who wanted Lee's statue to say up and there were good people that wanted it to go down, but there were bad people (white supremacists, Antifa) on both sides.
Birtherism was surprisingly popular at the time and Trump, to the best of my knowledge, no longer still believes in it.

By that logic, I should get annoyed when you mention Nazis killing 6 million Jews (but forget about the Poles, gypsies, disabled people etc killed by him for some reason) because you use it to imply that me and Starship Trooper are Nazis.

I'm not sure Jesus ever promoted seizing the means of production. Can you show me where in the Bible he did that?
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!Capercaillie
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The major phenomena we've seen in UK politics in recent is the conservative establishment expand the state, chip away at civil liberties, and increase the tax burden to it's highest post-war level. Meanwhile they have, with the support of the MSM, convinced many that responsibility for this lies with fiction left wing or liberal bogeymen. As the "debate" in this thread demonstrates, so many people with galaxy brains have fallen for it. Enjoy your high taxes.
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Starship Trooper
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(Original post by !Capercaillie)
The major phenomena we've seen in UK politics in recent is the conservative establishment expand the state, chip away at civil liberties, and increase the tax burden to it's highest post-war level. Meanwhile they have, with the support of the MSM, convinced many that responsibility for this lies with fiction left wing or liberal bogeymen. As the "debate" in this thread demonstrates, so many people with galaxy brains have fallen for it. Enjoy your high taxes.
Where have I or any other right wingers on this thread denied Tory responsibility for that? So nice strawman bro.

This thread is about the walking fecal matter that is Starmer and his labour party. If you want to make a thread to trash the record of the conservative party I'd be more than happy to join in on that: They are on the whole a corrupt bunch of incompetent morons and traitors.

I have never voted conservative and until there is a decent Tory candidate in my area I never will.
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