Oleksandr Usyk - the GOAT

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Driving_Mad
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For those that saw my post before the ******s got my thread deleted, I predicted Usyk would beat Joshua. I was extremely confident Usyk would shock the world, and I was correct.

He won by UD. I didn’t watch the fight, but from what I’ve heard he won easily. If you listened to me and put money on Usyk winning, no problem.

Usyk was Undisputed at Cruserweight, and now the unified World Heavyweight Champion. He is number 1 P4P.

This performance will be talked about for decades.

Unfortunately I couldn’t watch this historic fight , it pains me, especially seeing people posting about it on social media and the thousands of replies on the RBR…

Now I have to reply to people messaging me about the fight, telling me I predicted correctly…I must remain calm - the focus is conveyed in the eyes

Bittersweet moment in all, I really wanted to watch this, Usyk is a beauty to watch, not feeling too good, but I’m glad Usyk didn’t get robbed.

Another one to add to the long list of things I’ve missed…

Who managed to watch it ? What were your thoughts on the fight ?

All this means is that Usyk will rematch Joshua in January - Joshua Fury will never happen. Usyk is the man - he’s a legend.

How does Eddie Hearn look? I’m sure he’s on the verge of tears. I respect and like both fighters, but once Usyk beats Joshua in the rematch, he retires.
Last edited by Driving_Mad; 4 weeks ago
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Little pecker
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Special performance

The guys a complete mad man, he stood toe to toe.

The media live a narrative and seeing it destroyed is so sweet
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CaptainDuckie
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Just watched the match highlights on YT...

I’m sorry but... as a southpaw fighter, there’s no surprise. AJ looked like a real amateur in the first few rounds tbh; usyks head movement is absolutely beautiful. His counter punches are miraculous; his combinations are calculated; his footwork is swift.

Joshua did make some clean punches and had usyk saved by the bell in round 6. I don’t know why but I feel like Joshua feared him, he kept backing up and not following through because Usyk is simply too unpredictable. It is clear that Usyk has higher boxing IQ, he simply made AJ pay.

I wouldn’t say it was an easy fight for Usyk but he definitely outboxed AJ.
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goggleyed
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AJ's been getting progressively sh it for a while, I knew he was going to lose... again.
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Crazy Jamie
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(Original post by Little pecker)
The guys a complete mad man, he stood toe to toe.
You may not have meant literally, but whilst he looked very comfortable (which I imagine you did mean) he didn't literally stand toe to toe. His movement was exceptional and part of a strategy that Joshua just could not deal with. The fact that he was always moving caused Joshua real problems. It was by no means a Haye-Valuev situation, but for the most part Usyk was (rightly) very keen not to stand toe to toe and trade shots.

Usyk was always the far superior boxer who had a much better chance at winning than the bookies gave him credit for (2/1 were ludicrously good odds for a punt on Usyk on that fight). The problem I thought he may have is that if Joshua was notably heavier, Usyk could dance around him all he wanted, but Joshua could wear him down, Usyk wouldn't hurt him, and eventually through a mistake or exhaustion Joshua would catch him with a shot and knock him out. That's how "big guy who is a good boxer" vs "little guy who is a great boxer" fights are supposed to go.

But there were three problems. First, the difference in weight wasn't actually that big. Usyk came in a little heavier and Joshua a little lighter than I expected. Joshua was the same weight as Ruiz II, and he absolutely was never going to win this fight with the same approach as that one. Second, Usyk was better conditioned for his weight than I expected. He barely slowed down through the entire 12 rounds, and had a bit more resilience when he took punches too. Three, Joshua's strategy was just all wrong. He was still heavier and bigger, but didn't clinch to wear Usyk down, and so rarely went for his shots. I suspect the shots he got caught with in the first couple of rounds hurt more than he was expecting, and after that he was far too negative. The reality is he was going to have to be gritty, get in Usyk's face, and take a risk with some shots to win this. And he just never did it. Usyk was just outstanding and a very worth winner. A rematch could well be very interesting if Joshua does change his strategy, but he was well beaten here.
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Driving_Mad
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(Original post by Little pecker)
Special performance

The guys a complete mad man, he stood toe to toe.

The media live a narrative and seeing it destroyed is so sweet
Firstly I didn’t watch the fight, I must reiterate, but I have seen clips and my original prediction of how the fight would go seems to have been correct, so although a bittersweet moment for myself - to miss another historical event, I must remain calm.

I have so much respect for Usyk, this is why I backed him before the fight, I told everyone to put money on him, a lot of the casuals thought I was mad…

It’s more Eddie Hearn, he convinced the casuals Joshua is a world class boxer, which he isn’t..

As for Usyk, he beat Huck in Germany, Briedis in Latvia, Gassiev in Russia, Bellew in the UK, Witherspoon in the US, Chisora in the UK, now Joshua in the UK. He has won all his belts away from home with odds stacked against him.

He is P4P number 1 and first stake hall of famer.

He’s clear of David Haye and Evander Holyfield.

(Original post by CaptainDuckie)
Just watched the match highlights on YT...

I’m sorry but... as a southpaw fighter, there’s no surprise. AJ looked like a real amateur in the first few rounds tbh; usyks head movement is absolutely beautiful. His counter punches are miraculous; his combinations are calculated; his footwork is swift.

Joshua did make some clean punches and had usyk saved by the bell in round 6. I don’t know why but I feel like Joshua feared him, he kept backing up and not following through because Usyk is simply too unpredictable. It is clear that Usyk has higher boxing IQ, he simply made AJ pay.

I wouldn’t say it was an easy fight for Usyk but he definitely outboxed AJ.
I didn’t watch the fight, but I heard Joshua tried to outbox Oleksandr. This was definitely not going to work, I don’t know why Rob Mckracken employed this game plan.

I respect Rob, he’s from Birmingham, a good man, but it’s time for him to go if Joshua fight again.

Joshua was lucky he wasn’t knocked out at the end of round 12, if Usyk wanted to he would have stopped AJ

(Original post by goggleyed)
AJ's been getting progressively sh it for a while, I knew he was going to lose... again.
Ever since the Ruiz defeat he has lost his killer instinct. I watched him against Pulev, who he had hurt, but he let Pulev survive for a few rounds.

Old Joshua pre Ruiz who fought Whyte, Povetkin etc wouldn’t have done that

(Original post by Crazy Jamie)
You may not have meant literally, but whilst he looked very comfortable (which I imagine you did mean) he didn't literally stand toe to toe. His movement was exceptional and part of a strategy that Joshua just could not deal with. The fact that he was always moving caused Joshua real problems. It was by no means a Haye-Valuev situation, but for the most part Usyk was (rightly) very keen not to stand toe to toe and trade shots.

Usyk was always the far superior boxer who had a much better chance at winning than the bookies gave him credit for (2/1 were ludicrously good odds for a punt on Usyk on that fight). The problem I thought he may have is that if Joshua was notably heavier, Usyk could dance around him all he wanted, but Joshua could wear him down, Usyk wouldn't hurt him, and eventually through a mistake or exhaustion Joshua would catch him with a shot and knock him out. That's how "big guy who is a good boxer" vs "little guy who is a great boxer" fights are supposed to go.

But there were three problems. First, the difference in weight wasn't actually that big. Usyk came in a little heavier and Joshua a little lighter than I expected. Joshua was the same weight as Ruiz II, and he absolutely was never going to win this fight with the same approach as that one. Second, Usyk was better conditioned for his weight than I expected. He barely slowed down through the entire 12 rounds, and had a bit more resilience when he took punches too. Three, Joshua's strategy was just all wrong. He was still heavier and bigger, but didn't clinch to wear Usyk down, and so rarely went for his shots. I suspect the shots he got caught with in the first couple of rounds hurt more than he was expecting, and after that he was far too negative. The reality is he was going to have to be gritty, get in Usyk's face, and take a risk with some shots to win this. And he just never did it. Usyk was just outstanding and a very worth winner. A rematch could well be very interesting if Joshua does change his strategy, but he was well beaten here.
Hearn said Joshua will take the rematch in 6 months, he will not be able to change enough in this time period to beat Usyk.

Joshua’s feet are too slow and he is a Kindergarten student in terms of IQ compared to Usyk.

His best chance of winning is bulking up a little to about 245lbs and steam rolling Usyk in the first few rounds.

If they fight again, Usyk will stop Joshua late on, mark my words.

If Joshua and Usyk fight again, once Fury beats Wilder, he should fight Dillon’s Whyte.

Joshua loses to Usyk again, And then he will retire I think. He’s made a lot of money, done a great job for the sport, and will be remembered, but just not an elite generational heavyweight.

I agree about the odds, when I looked Usyk was 3/1 to win. ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS - I couldn’t believe the odds, if I were allowed to bet I would have put £100 on that immediately. Way too wide odds.
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CaptainDuckie
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TBH, Joshua might have Usyk in a rematch.
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Driving_Mad
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(Original post by CaptainDuckie)
TBH, Joshua might have Usyk in a rematch.
No, there is nothing he can do within 6 months to change the result.

The rematch occurs in February / March, his only chance is steamrolling Usyk in the first 4 rounds, which is unlikely, and he’d more than likely get stopped in round 6-7.

Even if he changes trainer, it isn’t long enough for the adjustments to help him.

If he rematches Usyk, and he loses, he’ll retire, a sad end to a great career…

Hopefully Tyson Fury actually fights a contender after beating Wilder and fights Dillian Whyte…

Ruiz defeat was different as Ruiz wasn’t very good and Joshua got reckless…Ruiz can’t bounce on a bouncycastle 10 times without getting tired…plus he didn’t train for the rematch

If Eddie Hearn cares about his fighter, he advises him not to take the rematch and fight someone else to regain confidence or retire…Idk maybe Usyk ages exponentially by the time of his next fight and his reflexes go helping Joshua…that’s his only hope
Last edited by Driving_Mad; 3 weeks ago
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Crazy Jamie
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(Original post by Driving_Mad)
No, there is nothing he can do within 6 months to change the result.

The rematch occurs in February / March, his only chance is steamrolling Usyk in the first 4 rounds, which is unlikely, and he’d more than likely get stopped in round 6-7.
I don't think I agree. Would Usyk be the favourite in a rematch? He should be. But Joshua can certainly make the changes he needs to in six months to give himself a better chance. He did effectively try to outbox Usyk at distance in this fight, which was a bad strategy from the start. If he comes in heavier, gets in Usyk's face, and makes the fight ugly he can completely change the dynamic of the fight. He doesn't need to steamroller Usyk, in fact with Usyk fresh in the first four rounds it's highly likely that he can do that. He needs to get close, keep clinching, and wear Usyk down using his size. He would then hope that that does enough to slow Usyk down by the middle rounds, at which point he's easier to hit and Usyk's shots shouldn't be as hard. That's when he can search for the knockdown/knockout punch or let his hands go. He should still be fresher (relatively speaking by that point) because using his size will take more of Usyk's energy than his.

It's still a dangerous approach, because Usyk can still hit him, and hit him hard. But whichever way he spins it Joshua has to take more risks in a rematch. Whilst I see the point about fighting someone else, I'm not sure how viable that is. He takes one or two more fights and then he's likely to have to circle back round to Fury or Usyk. Might as well go for Usyk again now. I do agree that retirement feels likely if he loses the rematch though.
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Driving_Mad
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(Original post by Crazy Jamie)
I don't think I agree. Would Usyk be the favourite in a rematch? He should be. But Joshua can certainly make the changes he needs to in six months to give himself a better chance. He did effectively try to outbox Usyk at distance in this fight, which was a bad strategy from the start. If he comes in heavier, gets in Usyk's face, and makes the fight ugly he can completely change the dynamic of the fight. He doesn't need to steamroller Usyk, in fact with Usyk fresh in the first four rounds it's highly likely that he can do that. He needs to get close, keep clinching, and wear Usyk down using his size. He would then hope that that does enough to slow Usyk down by the middle rounds, at which point he's easier to hit and Usyk's shots shouldn't be as hard. That's when he can search for the knockdown/knockout punch or let his hands go. He should still be fresher (relatively speaking by that point) because using his size will take more of Usyk's energy than his.

It's still a dangerous approach, because Usyk can still hit him, and hit him hard. But whichever way he spins it Joshua has to take more risks in a rematch. Whilst I see the point about fighting someone else, I'm not sure how viable that is. He takes one or two more fights and then he's likely to have to circle back round to Fury or Usyk. Might as well go for Usyk again now. I do agree that retirement feels likely if he loses the rematch though.
What can Joshua change between now and the fight ? I agree he employed the wrong strategy, but he has slow feet and doesn’t move his head - you can’t fix those things overnight.

100% agree on him using roughhouse tactics early on, I was surprised he didn’t hold onto Usyk more and throw more punches when grappling, like Chisora did.

That’s why Chisora was more effective than Joshua.

I think Joshua backed away after the first few rounds because he felt Usyk’s power, I didn’t watch the full fight but Usyk is so accurate and throws crisp shots, that probably caused Joshua to back away more during the fight.

I’d really look forward to the rematch if it’s agreed though.
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