How the UK labour party can win

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JOSH4598
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#21
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#21
(Original post by Chadmiral Nelson)
The old left understood this well, Marx himself wrote against the mass importation of cheap foreign labour, so I find it baffling that so many in the Labour party today, even on the economic hard left are actually in favour of unfettered, open borders, when it is so highly detrimental to their core working class base. Their support for immigration seems to be solely ideological, it's as if keeping up the mere appearance of not being xenophobic or 'racist' is more important to them than not actively screwing over your own poor and working class populace.
I think it's clear to say that the Labour party has undergone a huge ideological shift. The modern party masquerades behind the 'party of the working class' while pushing for an inherently 'progressive' and (arguably) woke agenda. Most of their ideas have little to do with enhancing employment opportunities, welfare provisions or life outcomes and is more centred around identity politics. As you say, mass immigration would irreparably harm the working class yet the party are hell bent on allowing every man and his dog into the country. This probably explains their woeful performance in recent elections which they refuse to acknowledge.
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hotpud
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#22
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#22
(Original post by Rakas21)
What is it you can’t stand about the Tories?
To be fair, I quite liked Cameron and I think May would have been ok if she hadn't been caught in the unwinnable situation she ended up in over Brexit. Boris is his own man. He stands for nothing other than himself and will say anything in order to achieve his personal goals. I think Starmer was correct in identifying him as a trivial man and a showman.

But behind him stand what are essentially self-serving public school educated people who have no interested in running a country of society for everyone. They are simply in favour of ensuring they have it good. Everyone else? Well, there is no such thing as society is there?
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Starship Trooper
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#23
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#23
(Original post by -Imperator-)
On (1), if the Liberal Democrats ever were to join a "Progressive Alliance", their vote share would collapse. People seem to forget that the Lib Dems attract many right-wing voters who see them as safer opposition than Labour due to their economic outlook. The only gains they made in 2019 were in former Conservative seats, representing 'Remain' constituencies. If they were seen to be fighting for a Labour cause, they would lose a lot of support.
I disagree.

I think so long as the Tories have a majority or appear to these sorts won't mind too much - as we can see in the Amersham by election.
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L i b
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#24
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#24
(Original post by Quady)
Why would the SNP or Plaid be interested in a pact then?

Mainly the SNP as that's where 50 seats live. Unless Labour were to offer support for a section 30 on an independence vote surely they'd not entertain it.
That is a fair assessment, I think.

I think this is at the heart of the problem. If Labour really has to go cap-in-hand to an assortment of weirdos and is clearly in danger of compromising on what should be some of its most important policies (the integrity of the United Kingdom, ffs) then what is your middle-ground voter going to make of that? They're going to run a mile. Because there's (presumably) a reason people vote Labour rather than the Greens, Plaid, SNP or whatever.
Last edited by L i b; 1 week ago
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-Imperator-
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#25
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#25
(Original post by Starship Trooper)
I disagree.

I think so long as the Tories have a majority or appear to these sorts won't mind too much - as we can see in the Amersham by election.
Exactly, voters were happy to return a lib dem because they knew it would in no way undermine Johnson's majority. However, a broad anti-Tory coalition would be a serious threat, and I'm sure the constituents of Amersham would not vote lib dem in such circumstances.
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Rakas21
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#26
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#26
Three Labour MP’s are considering defecting to the Tories. They expect to lose if they don’t.
Last edited by Rakas21; 1 week ago
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Starship Trooper
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#27
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#27
(Original post by Rakas21)
Three Labour MP’s are considering defecting to the Tories. They expect to lose if they don’t.
Great exactly what the Tory party needs, - more left wing self serving MPs ...:rolleyes:
Last edited by Starship Trooper; 1 week ago
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