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Biomedical science at Westminster University to work in the NHS

Hello
I want to ask a Westminster biomed sci graduate who currnetly works in the NHS
Is Westminster a good uni for the course and what steps can I take to get into NHS?
Someone please answer!😁😁

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It worked for me! What stage are you at?
Reply 2
Original post by HealthcareSci
It worked for me! What stage are you at?

I just got an offer for Westminster university:smile:
I just wanted detailed advice on how I can become an NHS scientist and I wanted someone to explain what HCPC and STP training is.
(edited 2 years ago)
The STP is the scientist training programme to become a clinical scientist. This is not the same as a biomedical scientist. The HCPC is the Healthcare Professions Council with whom certain healthcare professionals (such as biomedical scientists) need to be registered in order to work in that profession in the UK.

If you want to become a biomedical scientist in the NHS, you should look for an IBMS accredited degree, ideally with integrated placements in an approved NHS pathology lab, which will allow you to register with the HCPC on graduation and apply directly to Band 5 BMS roles in the NHS. The only courses that provide both these things are the Healthcare Sciences (Life Sciences) courses available through the NHS Practitioner Training Programme (PTP). More information on the unis offering these courses can be found here:
https://nshcs.hee.nhs.uk/programmes/ptp/

If you want to become a clinical scientist then you just need to do a relevant science degree for the specialism you want to apply to (usually a bioscience degree of some sort, but for some like medical physics I believe you need a different degree - physics in that example). You then apply to the STP as a graduate - it's very competitive I gather though.
Original post by yas-2003
I just got an offer for Westminster university:smile:
I just wanted detailed advice on how I can become an NHS scientist and I wanted someone to explain what HCPC and STP training is.

As artful_lounger says - you need to look at whether you want to be a biomedical scientist or a clinical scientist as they are different roles. The Health and Care Professions Council (HCPC) is the regulatory body that holds the register for both of those professions (and others). Basically to do get the job you need to be on their list. You can be both a biomedical scientist and clinical scientist but there aren't many of us that do that one.

If you want to be a biomedical scientist then you need an IBMS accredited Biomedical Science degree and Westminster is a good one for it. If you want to be a clinical scientist you need to know roughly which of the 50 specialisms you'd want to apply for and choose a degree that's related. If you are interested in the life sciences (haematology, biochemistry, microbiology etc.) then a biomedical science degree is fine for those. And the STP doesn't take into account which university you went to, it's only the subject and that you need a 2:1 minimum.
Reply 5
Original post by HealthcareSci
As artful_lounger says - you need to look at whether you want to be a biomedical scientist or a clinical scientist as they are different roles. The Health and Care Professions Council (HCPC) is the regulatory body that holds the register for both of those professions (and others). Basically to do get the job you need to be on their list. You can be both a biomedical scientist and clinical scientist but there aren't many of us that do that one.

If you want to be a biomedical scientist then you need an IBMS accredited Biomedical Science degree and Westminster is a good one for it. If you want to be a clinical scientist you need to know roughly which of the 50 specialisms you'd want to apply for and choose a degree that's related. If you are interested in the life sciences (haematology, biochemistry, microbiology etc.) then a biomedical science degree is fine for those. And the STP doesn't take into account which university you went to, it's only the subject and that you need a 2:1 minimum.

I want to study biomedical science but I didnt know there was a difference between clinical scientist and biomedical scientist.
I think I would be more interested in becoming a clinical scientist, how can I become one? Do I have to do a portfolio?
Also, what do you think is a better job, clinical or biomedical scientist?
Thanks
It's not a question of one being better - they are both important jobs. I do both so can see the pros and cons of them.

You need the IBMS training portfolio for biomedical scientist registration. There are multiple routes (five that I know of) to clinical scientist registration. But the most common at the moment is the Scientist Training Programme.

That is the three year post graduate training programme. It's very competitive, but so is getting a training role for biomedical science.

What interests you in a career? What is the most important thing in a job for you?

Ultimately if you do a biomed degree at Westminster then you aren't blocking either route in life sciences. A placement year is great but they are very competitive too- you can't guarantee having one.
Reply 7
Original post by HealthcareSci
It's not a question of one being better - they are both important jobs. I do both so can see the pros and cons of them.

You need the IBMS training portfolio for biomedical scientist registration. There are multiple routes (five that I know of) to clinical scientist registration. But the most common at the moment is the Scientist Training Programme.

That is the three year post graduate training programme. It's very competitive, but so is getting a training role for biomedical science.

What interests you in a career? What is the most important thing in a job for you?

Ultimately if you do a biomed degree at Westminster then you aren't blocking either route in life sciences. A placement year is great but they are very competitive too- you can't guarantee having one.

So after I graduate do I begin my IBMS training portfolio and then do the STP?
Can you please tell me how you got to where you are right now?
Also If I want to do STP to become a clinical scientist, do I need an accredited bms course because I got an offer from QMUL but it isn't accredited
(edited 2 years ago)
Original post by yas-2003
So after I graduate do I begin my IBMS training portfolio and then do the STP?
Can you please tell me how you got to where you are right now?
Also If I want to do STP to become a clinical scientist, do I need an accredited bms course because I got an offer from QMUL but it isn't accredited


I did a training scheme that no longer exists. As a basic - I joined the NHS at 18 and completed my degree and portfolio simultaneously. I registered as a biomedical scientist 11 years ago and transferred into a clinical role 2 years ago. I've just submitted for STP equivalence (where I will basically do the final STP paperwork and exam rather than the full three year training programme). After that I'll be registered as both a clinical scientist and a biomedical scientist.

The STP will accept any university - it is about the course, not the institution.

You need to separate the IBMS training portfolio and STP in your mind as they are different career paths. You do not need to do both. You also won't begin an IBMS training portflio straight out of university as it's very competitive.

If you want to do the STP I would make sure you think about how you can build your application in your final year, and also what you'll do if you don't get onto the scheme as it's only open once a year. The STP is also an incredibly intensive course, so make sure you understand what a clinical scientist is (go and speak to some in specialisms that interest you) and make sure it's what you want.
Reply 9
is the STP like a postgraduate? do I have to pay for it and if so how much is the full training?
What have you read yourself on this so far?
Reply 11
Original post by HealthcareSci
What have you read yourself on this so far?

I just know that it is a program for graduates to become qualified clinical scientists and that its 3 years long.
But I cant seem to find how much the program costs and I dont know what I need to even join the program in the first place.
Original post by yas-2003
I just know that it is a program for graduates to become qualified clinical scientists and that its 3 years long.
But I cant seem to find how much the program costs and I dont know what I need to even join the program in the first place.


Start here: the NHS careers website answers all those questions for you. And the National School website (linked in that webpage) has a lot more.

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/career-planning/study-and-training/graduate-training-opportunities/nhs-scientist-training-programme
Reply 13
Original post by HealthcareSci
Start here: the NHS careers website answers all those questions for you. And the National School website (linked in that webpage) has a lot more.

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/career-planning/study-and-training/graduate-training-opportunities/nhs-scientist-training-programme

if I go to Queen Mary and do a non accredited course, do you think I can do STP and then get my IBMS certificate?
also what jobs are out there if I got a non accredited biomedical science degree?
Original post by yas-2003
if I go to Queen Mary and do a non accredited course, do you think I can do STP and then get my IBMS certificate?
also what jobs are out there if I got a non accredited biomedical science degree?

Remember the STP and IBMS certificate are from different career paths. You wouldn't do both. You should look into biomedical science and clinical science roles to see which you prefer.

You can apply for the STP with a degree from QMUL, you cannot do the IBMS certificate with a degree from QMUL. You'd need to do extra university modules.

Personally I think you are looking at this the wrong way. Look for the career that you want to do and then choose the degree that leads to it. Don't run the risk of spending up to £50,000.00 on a degree that doesn't get you where you want to be.
(edited 2 years ago)
Reply 15
Hi @HealthcareSci, do you mind me asking which speciality you have applied for equivalence in? I've been interested in pursuing this in the next year but I am finding it difficult to find any reviews or experiences on the application process in areas other than genetics/medical physics.
Original post by NMC0412
Hi @HealthcareSci, do you mind me asking which speciality you have applied for equivalence in? I've been interested in pursuing this in the next year but I am finding it difficult to find any reviews or experiences on the application process in areas other than genetics/medical physics.


Hey, of course! I'm a virologist and so applying for microbiology. Which specialism are you aiming for?
Reply 17
Thanks! I am aiming for biochemistry. CS registration is something I want to pursue but training options are limited were I am and I’m not really in a position to move for the STP at the moment so I thought this would be a good option. I guess I feel confident enough with some aspects of the equivalence except for whether my clinical experience will be enough. I have had 2 years working in I guess a healthcare assistant sort of role in a clinical trial facility working with CF and COPD patients and have taken the time to attend a number of multi speciality clinics and MDTs in the hospital to observe which maybe equates to around a few weeks of experience in this area. There is just a line in the guidance which says something like ‘STP requires 90weeks of clinical attachment and anything significantly less than this will not be equivalent’, although I’m pretty sure they mention that time worked in a hospital laboratory will count towards some clinical experience in which I have numerous years. I may be overthinking it but I was just wondering if what your thoughts were on this aspect?
So if you're a biochemist and not currently registered as a biomedical scientist or in a trainee post then your only real option is the Academy for Healthcare Science equivalence route. (https://www.ahcs.ac.uk/equivalence/equivalence-guidance/). Can you relate your CF and COPD patient experience to biochemistry at all? Some non-related is fine but the bulk should be specialism specific and it sounds like that experience is mostly respiratory.

Was your hospital laboratory experience in biochemistry? If it was fairly recent it should be fine. But if you're not currently in those roles then it is harder.

I'd check out the above website and look at the standards of proficiency. Your portfolio needs to demonstrate every single standard as that's what the STP would provide. If you're not 100% then email the AHCS. They are very helpful and can provide specific guidance before you fork out £350.
Reply 19
Original post by HealthcareSci
So if you're a biochemist and not currently registered as a biomedical scientist or in a trainee post then your only real option is the Academy for Healthcare Science equivalence route. (https://www.ahcs.ac.uk/equivalence/equivalence-guidance/). Can you relate your CF and COPD patient experience to biochemistry at all? Some non-related is fine but the bulk should be specialism specific and it sounds like that experience is mostly respiratory.

Was your hospital laboratory experience in biochemistry? If it was fairly recent it should be fine. But if you're not currently in those roles then it is harder.

I'd check out the above website and look at the standards of proficiency. Your portfolio needs to demonstrate every single standard as that's what the STP would provide. If you're not 100% then email the AHCS. They are very helpful and can provide specific guidance before you fork out £350.

@HealthcareSci Thanks for your reply, I hadn’t contacted the AHCS but it’s good to know that they’re willing to help with applications. Yeah I have been trying to structure my plan of action on the standards as best to my interpretation anyways and also mirror some of my clinical contacts across the specialisms within biochemistry as I’ve seen STP trainees do. But I know that I haven’t spent the same time in each so that’s what I was worried about.
But I am currently working as a registered BMS and have completed a specialist portfolio as well as an ibms approved biomedical masters with a clinical research component in which I selected my specialist modules based on mirroring some aspects of the STP curriculum so I’m hoping my formal education in that aspect is up to standard. Have you applied for equivalence through the IBMS route then?
Thanks again for your reply - as these routes are still quite novel in some specialities it’s good to hear what others think.

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