How is this fair ??

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Ibs223
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#1
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#1
How is it fair that someone who does an difficult degree such as optometry, pharmacy, physician associate ect, that spend all there time and day saving lives, has a max salary cap of 50-60k but then people who do things like computer science it finance who have much less responsibility and arguably easier degrees, end up getting salaries of 100k plus
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BalooBear
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#2
Why do you care about earning an extra 40k? You can live a life with probably more fulfillment and less craving for expensive and unnecessary goods earning less. Don't be fooled by comparisons to others
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artful_lounger
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(Original post by Ibs223)
How is it fair that someone who does an difficult degree such as optometry, pharmacy, physician associate ect, that spend all there time and day saving lives, has a max salary cap of 50-60k but then people who do things like computer science it finance who have much less responsibility and arguably easier degrees, end up getting salaries of 100k plus
Well to start with, it may be unfair because you've cherry picked inaccurate salary amounts and made assumptions without any basis about the courses.

A CS degree is not necessarily easier than a pharmacy degree; it may be easier for some people, but harder for others. There is really no objective way to determine the "difficulty" of a degree programme, and in principle all degrees require the same amount of work from students - the only thing to note is that healthcare professions courses often have compulsory placements in their degrees, is all. However, to be employable on graduation, students on non-healthcare degrees do need to be seeking relevant work experience on their own, so the ones who actually get into graduate level roles will likely have worked a similar amount in their course as well.

That aside, it's also worth noting that the vast majority of CS and finance grades are not going to be earning £100k+. Salary (mean) averages get very skewed by a small handful of students going to top unis with good connections getting extraodinarily well paying starting roles at e.g. FAANG, bulge bracket banks, hedge funds, etc. However if you looked at the distribution of salaries among graduates in those fields I'm quite confident you will find a much larger range, with the majority (mode average) earning considerable less. For CS in particular this was certainly the case at least relatively recently as about 5 years ago or so the government commissioned two inquiries into why CS grads in the UK had such poor graduate outcomes...

It's also worth noting a) the amount required to live comfortably in most areas of the UK is within or near that £50-60k range, and b) studies have shown that above ~£50-60k (in todays money accounting for inflation; was around £40k at the time the studies were done) self reported life satisfaction and happiness does not increase with income, suggesting that while a certain level of income is necessary to achieve personal wellbeing, beyond that there are other factors which are more important. So it also doesn't even necessarily matter that healthcare professionals aren't all earning £100k a piece, and the question should really be, why are these investment bankers and tech guys earning that much and is it necessary?

Also I imagine for a lot of healthcare workers salary is not the primary reason they went into their chosen profession, and I imagine a lot of them would be happy with their salary if there were other quality of life improvements in the nature of the work they do.
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ecolier
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#4
(Original post by Ibs223)
How is it fair that someone who does an difficult degree such as optometry, pharmacy, physician associate ect, that spend all there time and day saving lives, has a max salary cap of 50-60k but then people who do things like computer science it finance who have much less responsibility and arguably easier degrees, end up getting salaries of 100k plus
Supply and demand. Not all computer science / finance grad earns £100k plus.

Also, are you just going to ignore your other thread at https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/sho....php?t=7137002 ?
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Surnia
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Public versus private sector.
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gcseeeman
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(Original post by artful_lounger)
It's also worth noting a) the amount required to live comfortably in most areas of the UK is within or near that £50-60k range, and b) studies have shown that above ~£50-60k (in todays money accounting for inflation; was around £40k at the time the studies were done) self reported life satisfaction and happiness does not increase with income, suggesting that while a certain level of income is necessary to achieve personal wellbeing, beyond that there are other factors which are more important. So it also doesn't even necessarily matter that healthcare professionals aren't all earning £100k a piece, and the question should really be, why are these investment bankers and tech guys earning that much and is it necessary?
When was this study? House prices have gone up considerably faster than inflation, which makes it much harder to "live comfortably" in places like London.
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Ibs223
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(Original post by gcseeeman)
When was this study? House prices have gone up considerably faster than inflation, which makes it much harder to "live comfortably" in places like London.
Hence why he said most places and not London
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artful_lounger
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(Original post by gcseeeman)
When was this study? House prices have gone up considerably faster than inflation, which makes it much harder to "live comfortably" in places like London.
Yeah per the above, London is the single most expensive place in the UK to live. Pretty much anywhere except London, and a couple other very expensive cities (e.g. Cambridge and Bristol) it's very easy to live comfortably on much less.

Also worth noting a huge proportion of London workers do not live in London for the very reason that it's insanely expensive to rent in, and even more expensive to buy in. Living in London long term, unless you want to live in outer London or one of the "rougher" boroughs, is not realistic these days really...
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gcseeeman
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(Original post by artful_lounger)
Yeah per the above, London is the single most expensive place in the UK to live. Pretty much anywhere except London, and a couple other very expensive cities (e.g. Cambridge and Bristol) it's very easy to live comfortably on much less.

Also worth noting a huge proportion of London workers do not live in London for the very reason that it's insanely expensive to rent in, and even more expensive to buy in. Living in London long term, unless you want to live in outer London or one of the "rougher" boroughs, is not realistic these days really...
It's very disingenuous to mention hedge funds and FAANG, and 100k salaries being unnecessary, and then exclude London, and even Bristol. Where do you think the vast majority of people in such jobs are working? Of course such salaries are "necessary" there unless people are happy to accept life-long renting and slow descent into serfdom with an owner class that nobody can hope to break into.

You also ignored the question about when this study was and give no more detail. Regardless, the simple face remains that, no matter what salary range you give or which areas you exclude, everything is getting harder because average salaries are going less and less far in something so fundamental as housing. Most people complaining about a <100k limit in some fields probably aren't planning to live in places like Grimsby...

It's quite hard to disagree with the OP that things are unfair for [edit]young people, but he should realise it's not all sunshine for those of us with 100k+ TC at FAANG either.
Last edited by gcseeeman; 1 month ago
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Ibs223
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(Original post by artful_lounger)
Yeah per the above, London is the single most expensive place in the UK to live. Pretty much anywhere except London, and a couple other very expensive cities (e.g. Cambridge and Bristol) it's very easy to live comfortably on much less.

Also worth noting a huge proportion of London workers do not live in London for the very reason that it's insanely expensive to rent in, and even more expensive to buy in. Living in London long term, unless you want to live in outer London or one of the "rougher" boroughs, is not realistic these days really...
What do you consider to be London. For me the outer boroughs such as lewisham, Richmond ect would be apart of London, but when people say “it’s impossible to live in London” they seem to be implying central London area. What is London to you?
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Ibs223
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#11
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(Original post by gcseeeman)
It's very disingenuous to mention hedge funds and FAANG, and 100k salaries being unnecessary, and then exclude London, and even Bristol. Where do you think the vast majority of people in such jobs are working? Of course such salaries are "necessary" there unless people are happy to accept life-long renting and slow descent into serfdom with an owner class that nobody can hope to break into.

You also ignored the question about when this study was and give no more detail. Regardless, the simple face remains that, no matter what salary range you give or which areas you exclude, everything is getting harder because average salaries are going less and less far in something so fundamental as housing. Most people complaining about a <100k limit in some fields probably aren't planning to live in places like Grimsby...

It's quite hard to disagree with the OP that things are unfair for you people, but he should realise it's not all sunshine for those of us with 100k+ TC at FAANG either.
Having a 100k+ salary isn’t sunshine? The average is around 30k.
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StriderHort
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No one has stopped you entering these careers = fair.
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Quady
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(Original post by Ibs223)
Having a 100k+ salary isn’t sunshine? The average is around 30k.
They said total compensation rather than salary in fairness.

Also they extensively talked about London. The average salary in London is closer to £45k. £30k is a UK average.
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Slx.24
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(Original post by artful_lounger)
Yeah per the above, London is the single most expensive place in the UK to live. Pretty much anywhere except London, and a couple other very expensive cities (e.g. Cambridge and Bristol) it's very easy to live comfortably on much less.

Also worth noting a huge proportion of London workers do not live in London for the very reason that it's insanely expensive to rent in, and even more expensive to buy in. Living in London long term, unless you want to live in outer London or one of the "rougher" boroughs, is not realistic these days really...
*chuckles* Im in danger

Or well, my bank is anyways
Last edited by Slx.24; 1 month ago
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Ibs223
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(Original post by Quady)
They said total compensation rather than salary in fairness.

Also they extensively talked about London. The average salary in London is closer to £45k. £30k is a UK average.
I’m pretty sure the median is much less
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Mesopotamian.
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Every time I see threads like this, I laugh in dentistry.

hungrysalamander join me
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skylark2
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If you want a high salary job in IT or finance, apply for one - they are not professions which you have to have degrees in to work in. You might need a conversion course first, but since they are such easy subjects that shouldn't be a problem.

I had to laugh at there being no responsibility in IT. What do you think happens if a hospital's computer systems go down? Who do you think is responsible for that not happening, and for getting them back up as fast as possible if it does happen?
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Ibs223
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(Original post by skylark2)
If you want a high salary job in IT or finance, apply for one - they are not professions which you have to have degrees in to work in. You might need a conversion course first, but since they are such easy subjects that shouldn't be a problem.

I had to laugh at there being no responsibility in IT. What do you think happens if a hospital's computer systems go down? Who do you think is responsible for that not happening, and for getting them back up as fast as possible if it does happen?
Most high paying it professionals won’t be at hospitals will they. The ones that do work at hospitals will carry more responsibility but get paid much less. Someone working at Facebook, coding to improve a app, isn’t really high responsibility is it compared to a healthcare professional

Also you mention that if I want a high paying job in it, I should just apply to one because “you don’t need a degree in that field” but then say I would need a conversion course which is a degree. Also I never said they where easy subjects.
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Quady
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(Original post by Ibs223)
I’m pretty sure the median is much less
Yeah, £38k
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk...ings/cbp-8456/
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Quady
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#20
(Original post by Ibs223)
Most high paying it professionals won’t be at hospitals will they. The ones that do work at hospitals will carry more responsibility but get paid much less. Someone working at Facebook, coding to improve a app, isn’t really high responsibility is it compared to a healthcare professional

Also you mention that if I want a high paying job in it, I should just apply to one because “you don’t need a degree in that field” but then say I would need a conversion course which is a degree. Also I never said they where easy subjects.
They said you might need a conversion course. I didn't need one to work in IT.

And no, the majority won't be in hospitals, but many (such as I) support/manage front line services, be they in the public sector (such as I) or the private sector, perhaps FANGS like AWS or somewhere else like National Grid.

Naturally a lot of folk are in roles which aren't citizen impacting, but then again not all healthcare professionals are in life or death roles either.
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