He’s conservative!!

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Crazed cat lady
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#41
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#41
(Original post by mnot)
You know the conservative party are typically the most supported party in the UK, and disproportionately so amongst males.

Despite Twitter depicting every Tory voter as a bigot, it’s really a very wide platform. Basically anyone who supports limited government/free market/low taxation or even frankly people who invest in property or commodities are likely to vote conservative.

It’s genuinely very judgmental to pinhole someone purely on the basis of being “conservative”, is every UK lefty a reincarnation of Castro or mao...
Why would anyone who believes in limited government/free market/low taxation vote for The Conservative Party that has delivered the highest tax burden since the 1950s, the greatest expansion of the state in the lifetime of the majority of people, and has clamped down on basic civic liberties?

I'd be happy to date someone with differing political views (within reason), but claiming to believe in certain principles then voting for a political party which does not practice such principles implies lack of political awareness or complete insincerity. Neither of which are desirable traits.
Last edited by Crazed cat lady; 5 days ago
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londonmyst
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#42
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#42
(Original post by Crazed cat lady)
Why would anyone who believes in limited government/free market/low taxation vote for The Conservative Party that has delivered the highest tax burden since the 1950s, the greatest expansion of the state in the lifetime of the majority of people, and has clamped down on basic civic liberties?
Tactical voting along the lines of the 'best of a very bad lot' strategy.
With plenty of uk voters disliking all the available/realistic options but opting to vote for the local candidates and political parties that they dislike the least.
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Anonymous #6
#43
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#43
That sounds a little dramatic and judgemental. This huge generalisation of conservative political views is getting ridiculous now... I think it must be trendy.

Just speak to him? Find out if he has extreme political views? Extreme political views in any direction (left or right) is a no go for me.
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Muttley79
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#44
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#44
(Original post by Anonymous)
I personally could never date a tory because they are supporting a government who:

Only care about the wealthy and follow the "make the rich richer and the poor poorer mentality".
Don't follow the rules that they themselves make.
Don't take responsibility for their actions.
Clearly don't care about anyone but themselves.
Lie, lie and lie.

I could honestly go on tbh but the government is so corrupt and anyone who disagrees is blind.
And labour send their own childen to private schools and earn megabucks
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londonmyst
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#45
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#45
(Original post by Muttley79)
And labour send their own childen to private schools and earn megabucks
Some do.
There are also plenty of Labour Party membership card carrying inverse snobs & class war militants who would never even consider sending their child to a private school
Nor a grammar school.
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Muttley79
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#46
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#46
(Original post by londonmyst)
Some do.
There are also plenty of Labour Party membership card carrying inverse snobs & class war militants who would never even consider sending their child to a private school
Nor a grammar school.
I don't trust any politicians really ... all those I've known of any 'badge' have said one thing and done another!
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mnot
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#47
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#47
(Original post by Crazed cat lady)
Why would anyone who believes in limited government/free market/low taxation vote for The Conservative Party that has delivered the highest tax burden since the 1950s, the greatest expansion of the state in the lifetime of the majority of people, and has clamped down on basic civic liberties?

I'd be happy to date someone with differing political views (within reason), but claiming to believe in certain principles then voting for a political party which does not practice such principles implies lack of political awareness or complete insincerity. Neither of which are desirable traits.
Well in 2019 the alternative was Corbyn, which frankly was a very grim picture for most pragmatists. You do also have to account the current circumstances created by the pandemic are also highly unusual and at the same time as the Tories have created the highest post-war effective taxation, highest social measures in memory the opposition has been calling for harder, longer lockdowns (some even calling for a covid-zero policy last summer), have recently publicly backed the last labour leader to win an election who had income tax at 50p on the pound & the lots of opposition MPs calling for UBI etc.

No I dont think this government has been very economically liberal, that said its also relative to what is on the table from the opposition at the time of voting (I also dont think this government will be the one the Conservatives put to the people in 2024, their just hasn't been a great time for conservative MPs to consider a leadership contest whilst managing the volatility of covid). This isnt a very typical conservative government and not what was sold but the last 24 months are not really typical policy wise from any UK party including both Con & lab.
Last edited by mnot; 5 days ago
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londonmyst
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#48
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#48
(Original post by mnot)
Well in 2019 the alternative was Corbyn, which frankly was a very grim picture for most pragmatists. You do also have to account the current circumstances created by the pandemic are also highly unusual and at the same time as the Tories have created the highest post-war effective taxation, highest social measures in memory the opposition has been calling for harder, longer lockdowns (some even calling for a covid-zero policy last summer), have recently publicly backed the last labour leader to win an election who had income tax at 50p on the pound & the lots of opposition MPs calling for UBI etc.

No I dont think this government has been very economically liberal, that said its also relative to what is on the table from the opposition at the time of voting (I also dont think this government will be the one the Conservatives put to the people in 2024, their just hasn't been a great time for conservative MPs to consider a leadership contest whilst managing the volatility of covid). This isnt a very typical conservative government and not what was sold but the last 24 months are not really typical policy wise from any UK party including both Con & lab.
PRSOM
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LittleSkink
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#49
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#49
wow! so you have taken a label (with a pile of assumptions) and decided the outcome . . .

Any reason you have not talked to them openly, explored difference (and similarity) and actually got to know each other a bit?

FWIW my partner is totally different to me (diversity is good yeah?) and we have been together a long time, couldn't image dating someone like me - it would be painful
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ROTL94 2
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#50
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#50
TBF I'd have much the same response if anyone I was interested in thought New Labour were anything but a horrendous party.
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Crazy Jamie
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#51
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#51
(Original post by Anonymous)
This huge generalisation of conservative political views is getting ridiculous now... I think it must be trendy.
Not just conservative political views. Conservative and right wing commentators have been using "left", "leftist" and other terms as sweeping generalisations of opposing views for many years now. More recently commentators on both the right and left of the political spectrum have been using "centrist" as a term which apparently warrants immediate condemnation. It's not a conservative issue. It's partly a symptom of identity politics and partly a consequence of social media. Social media does some things well, but nuance is not one of those things.
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londonmyst
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#52
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#52
(Original post by Crazy Jamie)
Not just conservative political views. Conservative and right wing commentators have been using "left", "leftist" and other terms as sweeping generalisations of opposing views for many years now. More recently commentators on both the right and left of the political spectrum have been using "centrist" as a term which apparently warrants immediate condemnation. It's not a conservative issue. It's partly a symptom of identity politics and partly a consequence of social media. Social media does some things well, but nuance is not one of those things.
PRSOM
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BurstingBubbles
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#53
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#53
When I started dating my partner nearly 7 years ago, I was a Tory voter (was how I was brought up and I knew nothing better :puke: ) however she stuck by me and didn't go on at me or anything about it. As I got older and less influenced by my parent, I moved much more towards the left and have voted Labour in the last couple of votes

Basically, who people vote for doesn't mean they always will. It's not necessary a red flag (although it could be). Good luck with it all
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Crazed cat lady
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#54
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#54
(Original post by mnot)
Well in 2019 the alternative was Corbyn, which frankly was a very grim picture for most pragmatists. You do also have to account the current circumstances created by the pandemic are also highly unusual and at the same time as the Tories have created the highest post-war effective taxation, highest social measures in memory the opposition has been calling for harder, longer lockdowns (some even calling for a covid-zero policy last summer), have recently publicly backed the last labour leader to win an election who had income tax at 50p on the pound & the lots of opposition MPs calling for UBI etc.

No I dont think this government has been very economically liberal, that said its also relative to what is on the table from the opposition at the time of voting (I also dont think this government will be the one the Conservatives put to the people in 2024, their just hasn't been a great time for conservative MPs to consider a leadership contest whilst managing the volatility of covid). This isnt a very typical conservative government and not what was sold but the last 24 months are not really typical policy wise from any UK party including both Con & lab.
This is all just making excuses for conservative voters decisions to back a high tax big government party. What is particularly strange is your claim that this was not what they were sold. The Conservative Party were led by a man who made lots of wild promises and squandered money as mayor of London. The manifesto contained multiple uncosted spending pledges. Conservative voters were sold big government and they endorsed it at the ballot box. Conservative voters need to take responsibility rather than making excuses.

An inability to take personal responsibility and not be accountable for your decisions is a big red flag for many of us when it comes to relationships. Conservatives would do well to remember this why they ponder why they get rejected. That, and many aren’t happy to see the conservative government plundering our pay.
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mondays child
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#55
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#55
We have a government of the Conservative Party, not a Conservative government. So it depends whether he supports Conservative values, or the immoral traitorous incompetent group of people that make up this government. Anyone who still believes that Mr Johnson is fit for any public office is with someone who pays no attention or even reads the news. Harold Shipman caused less harm than Mr Johnson.
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mnot
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#56
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#56
(Original post by Crazed cat lady)
This is all just making excuses for conservative voters decisions to back a high tax big government party. What is particularly strange is your claim that this was not what they were sold. The Conservative Party were led by a man who made lots of wild promises and squandered money as mayor of London. The manifesto contained multiple uncosted spending pledges. Conservative voters were sold big government and they endorsed it at the ballot box. Conservative voters need to take responsibility rather than making excuses.

An inability to take personal responsibility and not be accountable for your decisions is a big red flag for many of us when it comes to relationships. Conservatives would do well to remember this why they ponder why they get rejected. That, and many aren’t happy to see the conservative government plundering our pay.
The alternative was Corbyn... using the same logic every labour party member & everyone who is a member of trade union should also take the same responsibility for their choices of installing in a opposition leader who is a marxist radical and has IRA & Hamas connections, such that the Tories were always going to win... Its labour voters who need to take personal responsibility.

Hopefully people can recognise this is hyperbole...
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Anonymous #1
#57
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#57
(Original post by ROTL94 2)
TBF I'd have much the same response if anyone I was interested in thought New Labour were anything but a horrendous party.
What’s the new Labour Party like? Educate me please . This person brought it up also
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username5889736
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#58
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#58
(Original post by Anonymous)
It was going so well with this guy I’m chatting to. Like him quite a bit. Then he said he’s a conservative!!

I’m so put off. Is it possible to have something casual with such differing beliefs? Could you stand it? I don’t know what to do.
red flag right there, don't go near a tory
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Justvisited
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#59
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#59
(Original post by Lie with me)
red flag right there, don't go near a tory
Such a funny pun, was that Freudian?
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Crazy Jamie
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#60
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#60
(Original post by Anonymous)
What’s the new Labour Party like? Educate me please . This person brought it up also
New Labour. Not the new Labour Party. New Labour was Tony Blair's government after he came to power in 1997. Those who are critical of Blair are almost certainly going to reach for the Iraq war as their first, and often only example and why they dislike him. And not without good reason. I think even those who on the whole think he was a good Prime Minister will acknowledge that Iraq was a massive error and something that he is quite rightly criticised for. At the same time, it is often forgotten that the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan received broad cross party support at the time, and Tony Blair went on to win a third term in 2005 when it was already well known that the claims preceding the war were not true. He also did a range of positive things domestically. His reputation has suffered in the last six or seven years for two reasons really. The first is the Chilcott report in 2016, which was damning of the decision to go to war with Iraq. It didn't say anything that I think most people already knew, but it very much formalised that criticism and brought it beyond reproach. The second is that Blair's political philosophy, which was pretty centrist, fell out of fashion, with the government in this country lurching to the right and the opposition lurching to the left. Personally I actually didn't vote for Blair at the time and didn't hold him in very high regard towards the end of his time in office certainly, but my opinion of him has actually improved as time has gone on, albeit I entirely acknowledge the Iraq/Afghanistan issue. I think on the whole he was a good PM who made one very notable and historical mistake. However, lots of people disagree with that assessment. As with just about everything political, it's up to you to form your own view.

As for this new Labour Party, being the one lead by Starmer, it's not been in place very long in the grand scheme of things and it's job has been made legitimately difficult by the pandemic. It's always difficult to be in opposition at a time of crisis, when the public tend to be much more forgiving of the government. Starmer also has the disadvantage of being inexperienced politically (he hasn't been an MP very long), and whilst he is a good advocate in a professional sense, he's not a particularly inspiring one in a political sense. So he was also going to take some time to bed in and was also going to take some time to get up to speed on political strategy. In recent months I think he's shown signs of doing a bit better and getting a handle on things, and he now has a shadow cabinet in place that has plenty of experience and seems ready to build some momentum ahead of the next election. But that's a gradual process too, and I have no idea what Labour will look like in practice as that election gets closer. I also don't know how strong he's going to look compared to the Conservative government, not least because we don't know who will be leading it. If it's Boris Johnson I think Labour will stand a very good chance of winning back some of the ground it lost in 2019. Probably not a majority (a coalition is more likely, for a variety of reasons), but it could certainly see the Conservatives leaving office. But if it's not Boris Johnson (and I think it's pretty likely it won't be) it will depend on who the PM is and what their government looks like. And no one has any way of really predicting that, or the issues that will come up along the way. So there's a lot of uncertainty as to what both major parties are going to look like over the next few years and heading into the next general election. Objectively, and putting party politics aside as much as possible, I don't think you can reasonably be overly critical of Starmer at this stage, albeit I can well understand people not being overly inspired by him and not really knowing what he stands for. At this point his appeal is more that he's someone with integrity, which right now is all that you really need opposite Johnson (hence the ten point lead in the polls, which is a really big lead) but he'll need more than that in the years to come as the current outrage dies down. Personally I think he's going to gradually move more towards a Blair philosophy, but he's going to take his time doing it. We shall see, though, and as with everything else this is just my view. Inform yourself and then form your own.
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