He’s conservative!!

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the bear
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#61
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#61
you should throw him in the river to show that you are on the right side of history
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YaliaV123
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#62
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#62
None of the political parties are great.
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Bronfenbrennerzy
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#63
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#63
He supports the tories?? Get rid.
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Joleee
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#64
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#64
i have lots of friends of different political persuasions including Marxists and conservatives; i love it. keeps life interesting to have a variety of friends. me and my romantic partner would have to be politically aligned tho because of my ambition to work in law. if we weren't in agreement on what i do for a living it just wouldn't work.

but yes i image you could make it work if politics isn't that important to you or him.
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nooneeee
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#65
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#65
(Original post by Anonymous)
I think this is quite harsh alongside others comments here, after all I make this thread because I don’t like my reaction and am unsure about it. I am still gonna see the guy. We barely know each other and weren’t getting along great so was looking at what to do. But thanks for saying he’d be better off without me , when I’m just worried he’ll be homophobic, lacking empathy for working class people, like every other Conservative I personally know (not hundreds)
There are also plenty of Labour supportors and tory-haters who are homophobic and lacking in empathy for marginalised groups, just in vastly different ways. I say this as a non-straight, non-white female. But let's not go down that rabbit hole...The problem is you are assuming category X people = immoral, wheras category Y people = moral. For some, this will be 'just facts' and therefore an okay view to have, when X = conservative and Y = non conservative, but not so much when X = gay people, and Y = non gay people. Why? I think assuming one category as bad and the other good will always be narrow minded. The reason why many don't subscribe to astrology is because they say we cannot categorise humans into boxes- doesn't the same apply here? Don't dismiss him because he is allegedly part of a category you dislike. Dismiss him if he is a person you dislike.
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mnot
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#66
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#66
(Original post by Anonymous)
I think this is quite harsh alongside others comments here, after all I make this thread because I don’t like my reaction and am unsure about it. I am still gonna see the guy. We barely know each other and weren’t getting along great so was looking at what to do. But thanks for saying he’d be better off without me , when I’m just worried he’ll be homophobic, lacking empathy for working class people, like every other Conservative I personally know (not hundreds)
Sounds right nasty people them tory voters, im sure it wasn’t a Conservative government when the legalisation of same-sex marriage went through. And they all hate the working class, its very odd then that the Tory support & votes are highest amongst working class voters (and the largest recent mandate happened largely by winning working class seats & losing middle class metropolitan ones), regardless they must all be self-hating bigots
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Anonymous #7
#67
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#67
When ever politicians of all parties 'splash the cash' or bankrupt our country the only thing anyone regardless of party politics needs to ask when they come up with paying x y z to whatever cause they see fit - ' who is going to pay for this?' The politicians slip away in a guilded cage and lifestyle because they can.

Which ever Govt or devolved Govt is in power, money paid in salaries and bonuses to politicians is wasted money. Politicians should do a good job for all of us without gongs or honours regardless (everybody else has to do their job) and maybe we should go back to Political work being offered for free? - voluntary. I am sure there are plenty of experts in subject and military in the field who would do so just that to save this once great country going down the tube. That said it is the civil service who plan and tell politicians what they can and can't do. Hence nothing changes despite what the public would want.

All politicians are driven by their ego's and the urgings of a few close deputy's who enjoy the status it brings. We are now sadly almost as corrupt as any other third world country. It's all about power.

If you borrow money as a country it is no different to any of us as an individual borrowing money. It has to be paid back. There is no money tree. If you borrow money we are beholden to the lender and their unspoken plans and motives.

The more of us who sit idle because it doesn't make sense to work the more our country prosperity as a whole is being damaged.

We cannot control the offenders who come into our country on the coat tails of genuine refugee cases because there are no staff in place to check. The legislation created is so complex we have to have an empire of HR and lawyers to decipher it.

If the population numbers explode we need more staff and resources in primary and secondary care - we don't have the money to do so.
If we don't adequately plan for ten to twenty years down the line the politicians have no cares, they retire to the house of Lords on guilded pensions and it is no longer their problem.

The UK is financially bankrupt right now and we have been for many decades. We cannot afford to put greater numbers of staff in defence, in border control, in infrastructure, education, health, transport, it all has to be farmed out to private equity firms who put the cash up and given contracts with a proviso's to repair roads and do the services the Govt should provide.

So it doesn't matter what politics you are seduced by there is no room for manoeuvre and Covid has just added the pressure. You can get really passionate about the issues affecting all of us but it comes down to - who is going to pay for this? We all deserve so much better.
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Chicken.M.
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#68
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#68
I'm not really bothered by different political views. Like I have a friend who's a hardcore feminist and I disagree with pretty much all of her views but we're still really close. She actually hates men less after meeting me as well. She was toxic af with the man-hate stuff when I first met her.

I always give people a chance.
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Anonymous #8
#69
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#69
Usually conservative party followers are pretty conservative. That said it usually doesn’t come up in normal life until the person openly favours it and makes their decisions revolving conservative views. If the person has openly said it then you should be careful.

UK already has a lot of antivaxxers and racist bigots, and obviously a lot of these apologists are here on TSR as well, so be careful before you paint a rosy picture.

I laugh when the younger generation says they are conservative. I mean after the shitshow called Brexit, can you even say you are a Tory?
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Anonymous #7
#70
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#70
If you enjoyed his company before, and thought he was a rather special lovely guy - please tell me what has changed now? Is it fear of what your friends might think? Life is too short - take time to explore his outlook properly. All politicians have a common theme, its usually exploiting citizens and amassing money /power for their own gain. Very rare to find an honest true politician with integrity, but there are some? You man is not a politician and he has merely expressed some loosely held ideals aligned to one particular party?
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kaorimiyazono
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#71
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#71
(Original post by Crazy Jamie)
You don't have to think that a party is a shining beacon of light to vote for them. Many people don't like politicians generally, but vote for the least worst option. Whilst I appreciate the points against voting conservative in 2019, the alternative was Jeremy Corbyn's labour party, which was not an attractive voting option for a great many reasons. Again, you may have adored Jeremy Corbyn, but it's important to understand why his labour party was not seen as a viable voting alternative for many. Speaking as objectively as I can (and I'm very much a floating voter), my own view is that Jeremy Corbyn's labour party was a very poor opposition. So whilst I have no love at all for Boris Johnson's conservative party, I do understand why people voted for him over Jeremy Corbyn's labour party. And regardless of your own views, you should at least be able to understand why someone would do that.

As for not voting for the current administration again, what makes you think it'll be the current administration at the next election? I don't rate Boris Johnson's chances are lasting until the next election. His cabinet is currently stuffed full of people appointed due to their loyalty and not their ability. If he's not in post at the next election the conservative party may look very different depending on who is the leader. Sunak, Truss, Gove, or even someone like Hunt could all have very different cabinet ministers and have very different looks to their administrations. At the same time, the strength of the labour party at that time of the next election is also relevant. Starmer had a bit of a slow start, but is gaining momentum now. If he keeps that going he may be a viable option regardless of the leader. But if he slows down, it may be that he is less attractive to some voters than certain conservative leaders and administrations would be.

Parties change considerably over time in personnel and identity. Thatcher's government was very different to Cameron's, which in turn is very different to Johnson's. Johnson openly expelled moderate conservatives like Ken Clarke and Dominic Grieve, who were not only more important but quite integral to the sort of government that Cameron seemed to want, at least initially. Equally, Jeremy Corbyn's labour party is very different to Starmer's, and indeed many of his most ardent supporters have been pushed into the background. Politics is a complicated arena. Different people are attracted to different things, and their options constantly change. There's always a reason why people will vote one way and not another.
Yeah I agree with you. Jeremy Corbyn's labour party was pretty bad in terms of opposing the conservative party so I do understand why people at the time voted conservative. You do make good points about parties changing over time and maybe there will be a better conservative administration by the time the next general elections have come round. I am willing to stop hating the conservative party if they improve in the future and if there are massive changes in party members, but at the moment I just don't see myself ever voting for them considering their recent and current actions and struggle to comprehend how some people are already certain that they'll vote conservative again. I need to see evidence that they'll improve for me to change my mind, but since they've only gotten worse in these past few years, I highly doubt that. It's more likely that they'll just continue getting worse because that seems to be the trend.

I do appreciate and understand your points though and they've made me see another side of the argument better so thank you.
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Anonymous #3
#72
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#72
(Original post by StriderHort)
Yeah... I hate Tories too, but other than yr v first point, none of that is stuff unique to Tories or even politicians. I get the impression it's a direct nod to 'Partygate' which isn't too helpful in terms of discussing ideology. Lots of people had dodgy covid parties, am I not to date anyone who is friends with them either?

Like if I start discounting people because they support anything about not following rules or taking responsibility etc, then I'm writing off an awful lot of arts, culture and media... pretty much anything with a hint of controversy and I'll prob run out of non-unbearable people to date very quickly.
Don't follow the rules that they themselves make- yeah this point is to do with the parties they've had while people have had to die on their own or not been able to visit sick family members or attend loved ones funerals.

Don't take responsibility for their actions- this could be in terms of the parties, but I mainly meant it as in they've screwed up so much during the pandemic (although they have done quite well with the vaccinations) and with Brexit yet are still acting like everything they've done is so amazing and for the better of the country and makes us superior to the rest of the world.

Clearly don't care about anyone but themselves- they've raised their own wages and made laws that are making the poor poorer, they haven't supported the NHS much at all, they almost didn't feed school children on free school meals during the lockdown etc.

Lie, lie and lie- most of the stuff BoJo says is either a lie, waffle or bs (Here's a link to an article outlining a few of the many times that BoJo has lied) not to mention all the lies during the pandemic. Most politicians do lie tho so yeah this one isn't exclusive to the conservatives- it's just a defining feature of the party tho because BoJo is the biggest liar and he's currently PM.

Everybody makes mistakes so it's not like I'm expecting someone to be perfect in order to date them or be friends with them obviously. But it's not about the individual things, it's about all these things combined and the fact that they're tolerating such a corrupt government. Also, arts, culture and media don't run a country so it's a different scenario.
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Justvisited
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#73
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#73
(Original post by Anonymous)
I laugh when the younger generation says they are conservative. I mean after the shitshow called Brexit, can you even say you are a Tory?
Because no Labour voters voted to leave the EU. Because no seats went blue in 2019 after being red beyond living memory.

The real wonder is how Labour managed to get away for so long with the glaring contradiction between such a large number of its voters backing Leave but having virtually no representation for this in the PLP. 12 December 2019 was the day their albatrosses finally came to roost.
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Crazy Jamie
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#74
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#74
(Original post by Anonymous)
Clearly don't care about anyone but themselves- they've raised their own wages and made laws that are making the poor poorer, they haven't supported the NHS much at all, they almost didn't feed school children on free school meals during the lockdown etc.
Careful with some of this. The whole "they keep giving themselves pay raises" is a well worn trope, and it's not really right. Recommendations as to the pay of MPs is made by an independent body, and there are good reasons why you could argue that MPs' pay should be even higher than it is. I'm not going to argue with the broad point because sleaze is something that always gets Conservative governments in the end due to their donors and benefactors wanting a return on their investment, but it's important to know what you're actually talking about, just so you know you're being informed and not contributing to the echo chamber. If anything, keeping informed can help you to better solidify your arguments, for example...
Lie, lie and lie- most of the stuff BoJo says is either a lie, waffle or bs (Here's a link to an article outlining a few of the many times that BoJo has lied) not to mention all the lies during the pandemic. Most politicians do lie tho so yeah this one isn't exclusive to the conservatives- it's just a defining feature of the party tho because BoJo is the biggest liar and he's currently PM.
... you can do a lot better than that link. Try Peter Oborne, a former Telegraph columnist who has been on a one man crusade for several years to expose Boris Johnson's dishonesty. Last year he started a new website cataloguing those lies. It's extremely detailed and you can find it here, albeit it only goes up to June 2021. Still, far more recent and comprehensive than the one you linked to. And if you really want to deep dive he's written a book on it called The Assault on Truth.

And actually, this is a tip for literally everyone; read less social media, fewer newspapers/websites, and more books. It's always better to obtain information from sources that have had more time put into them. "Fast news", even when it is well meaning, is notoriously and necessarily shallow and unreliable. You don't really gain anything from reading instant reports that have been put together at the drop of a hat. Books invariably have to be far more detailed, more reflective and better researched even where they bat for a particular side. If you spend 30 minutes less browsing social media each day and instead read 30 pages of a book, even one on recent political events, you will be so much better informed.
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kaorimiyazono
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#75
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#75
(Original post by Crazy Jamie)
Careful with some of this. The whole "they keep giving themselves pay raises" is a well worn trope, and it's not really right. Recommendations as to the pay of MPs is made by an independent body, and there are good reasons why you could argue that MPs' pay should be even higher than it is. I'm not going to argue with the broad point because sleaze is something that always gets Conservative governments in the end due to their donors and benefactors wanting a return on their investment, but it's important to know what you're actually talking about, just so you know you're being informed and not contributing to the echo chamber. If anything, keeping informed can help you to better solidify your arguments, for example...

... you can do a lot better than that link. Try Peter Oborne, a former Telegraph columnist who has been on a one man crusade for several years to expose Boris Johnson's dishonesty. Last year he started a new website cataloguing those lies. It's extremely detailed and you can find it here, albeit it only goes up to June 2021. Still, far more recent and comprehensive than the one you linked to. And if you really want to deep dive he's written a book on it called The Assault on Truth.

And actually, this is a tip for literally everyone; read less social media, fewer newspapers/websites, and more books. It's always better to obtain information from sources that have had more time put into them. "Fast news", even when it is well meaning, is notoriously and necessarily shallow and unreliable. You don't really gain anything from reading instant reports that have been put together at the drop of a hat. Books invariably have to be far more detailed, more reflective and better researched even where they bat for a particular side. If you spend 30 minutes less browsing social media each day and instead read 30 pages of a book, even one on recent political events, you will be so much better informed.
Sorry it came us an anonymous- it keeps doing that automatically for some reason.

Yeah you make some good points. I will read the stuff you suggested. Thanks.
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Anonymous #9
#76
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#76
It's crazy, I read a survey in the U.S that reported that the majority of young men are conservative and the majority of young women are liberal. It's like men and women are completely missing eachother because all people do now is talk about politics and say stuff like
"I'll never date wokey" or "I'll never date a Tory" it's ruining relationships for no good reason in my opinion. Just because someone is conservative does not mean he is a bad person
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londonmyst
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#77
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#77
(Original post by Anonymous)
It's crazy, I read a survey in the U.S that reported that the majority of young men are conservative and the majority of young women are liberal. It's like men and women are completely missing eachother because all people do now is talk about politics and say stuff like
"I'll never date wokey" or "I'll never date a Tory" it's ruining relationships for no good reason in my opinion. Just because someone is conservative does not mean he is a bad person
Politics is not the most important personality dealbreaker or lifestyle preference for most people.
Opposites often attract.
People also frequently prefer sexual partners with similar ambitions and compatible lifestyle preferences.
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Anonymous #9
#78
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#78
(Original post by londonmyst)
Politics is not the most important personality dealbreaker or lifestyle preference for most people.
Opposites often attract.
People also frequently prefer sexual partners with similar ambitions and compatible lifestyle preferences.
I agree 100%, unless someone is a facist or communist haha
But seriously, a mate of mine recently broke-up with someone he was seeing because of a differing political opinion (she was liberal he was mildly conservative) and other friends who refuse to go on another date with someone because "oh they were great but they voted for conservatives blah blah". When my family were growing up they never talked about politics when dating, but this generation is obsessed with it and I think it's ruining relationships for no good reason
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Kernel_Coder
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#79
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#79
I have "somewhat different" political/economic beliefs from my partner, but neither of us take it very seriously. The differences between us are a great source of banter. People are far more than what they believe or who they vote for. With that said, being open minded to seeing other viewpoints is something I value highly in others, and someone who thought less of me because of my beliefs is not someone worthy of my time. My beliefs are constantly evolving anyway.

Something that really opened me up to just how fluid life can be was when I started taking risks, some of which paid off tremendously. The old me was rigid, living life in an inflexible way, unwilling to consider it's truly fluid nature. I just wish I'd rid myself of those limitations earlier.

In a sense, I wouldn't want to be with a clone of myself, that would be awfully boring.
Last edited by Kernel_Coder; 1 day ago
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Rufus The Red
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#80
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#80
(Original post by Anonymous)
It's crazy, I read a survey in the U.S that reported that the majority of young men are conservative and the majority of young women are liberal. It's like men and women are completely missing eachother because all people do now is talk about politics and say stuff like
"I'll never date wokey" or "I'll never date a Tory" it's ruining relationships for no good reason in my opinion. Just because someone is conservative does not mean he is a bad person
I'm a bit sceptical of that given that there's no specification on what sort of majority (could only be 51% majority in both instances, which would be much less of a divide than majority can imply) and it doesn't mention what categories were available - if it were either liberal or conservative and there were no other options then it ignores the extent to which people align with the categories.
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