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Those people in council houses with their 40" plasma tvs... watch

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    I know someone who has got a disfigurement on her face, but she's completely capable to work, but still recieves incapacity benefit. She's lived in a council house for 26 years, and she currently pays £6 a week rent..

    And of course, she's got a really nice car and lots of gadgets.

    Bloody glad to see an end to it tbh.
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    That article is a generalisation.
    Plenty of people live below the poverty line without expensive luxuries, yet some have such things. This could be due to fruad from benefits, working cash in hand, drugs or any other number of things. Then also look at their life, they are poor, they struggle to get a job, could be addicted to drugs/alcohol so supplying them with a money is OK, what they do with it is their business. Now of course the people who stick to the law, recieve benefits and don't lie on their forms could still afford such things.

    However, the whole benefits system needs a big shake up, with the economy the way it is now, more unemployment=less tax=less stable economy. We need to get out of that loop.
    One of the other things is immigration.
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    (Original post by hobo06)
    I have never suggested they should. I am talking about parents who can't afford the leisures and luxuries, but with children in full time education who have given up some of their free time in order to earn some money to enjoy themselves a bit more. You said yourself in an earlier post that the kids, in the scenario I am giving, should "probably not" be expected to have to pay towards rent, why the contradiction now?
    I said probably, so I don't know why you think there's a contradiction. It would probably come down to how much is being earned. If it's a significant amount, and the earner is 16 or older, then I don't see why some of it shouldn't be used to make up for the free money they're getting in the form of subsidised housing.
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    (Original post by becky.fm)
    I know someone who has got a disfigurement on her face, but she's completely capable to work, but still recieves incapacity benefit. She's lived in a council house for 26 years, and she currently pays £6 a week rent..

    And of course, she's got a really nice car and lots of gadgets.

    Bloody glad to see an end to it tbh.
    I suppose it comes under at what point does someone deserve money.

    I have a friend of a friend who had his foot run over by a car and now gets incap, he does play football though not often and isnt supposed to, hes comfortable with cash though not raking it in, but still enough to go drinking with friends and have some fashionable clothes and has some expensiveish gadgets.

    He wants to work but at same time cant be bothered.
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    (Original post by becky.fm)

    Bloody glad to see an end to it tbh.
    When is it going to end?
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    yea those lucky ******** living in relative poverty with no opportunities and few aspirations, let down by the education system, brought up into disadvantaged households, pregnant at a young age, trapped in an almost unbreakable cycle of destitution.
    God, I envy them.

    Don't you realise that these people are those who were starving under thatcher? Do you not realise that their sky tv pales into obscurity compared to the relative quality of your lives? Do you have any sort of sympathy for those who have been dealt terrible hands in the lottery of existence and yet are despised by everyone else? Unemployment is not fun, try it. The same is true of prisons which people now equate with holiday camps (though funnily enough not those who've been in them).
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    (Original post by Snookercraze)
    When is it going to end?
    The proposal might lead to an end of people abusing the system like that, and not making any effort to get a job. I know there will be many exceptions though.
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    (Original post by Cognito)
    yea those lucky ******** living in relative poverty with no opportunities and few aspirations, let down by the education system, brought up into disadvantaged households, pregnant at a young age, trapped in an almost unbreakable cycle of destitution.
    God, I envy them.

    Don't you realise that these people are those who were starving under thatcher? Do you not realise that their sky tv pales into obscurity compared to the relative quality of your lives? Do you have any sort of sympathy for those who have been dealt terrible hands in the lottery of existence and yet are despised by everyone else? Unemployment is not fun, try it. The same is true of prisons which people now equate with holiday camps (though funnily enough not those who've been in them).
    You're deluded. Climb back into your coffin, Atlee.
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    It was Thatcher's ideologically driven 'right to buy' policy which has made council housing the desperately inadequate provision that it is today (along with the unwillingness of subsequent labour governments to re-establish it of course).
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    (Original post by numb3rb0y)
    I said probably, so I don't know why you think there's a contradiction. It would probably come down to how much is being earned. If it's a significant amount, and the earner is 16 or older, then I don't see why some of it shouldn't be used to make up for the free money they're getting in the form of subsidised housing.
    You said "probably not" but your posts afterwards suggest more "definitely should", that's what I see as a contradiction. I personally don't know anyone else that would think a 16 year old earning some money for themselves should have to pay towards rent. Fact is, they still are a dependant of the parents. If you don't agree with that then that's your opinion. We don't seem to be getting anywhere her so may as well just leave it there.
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    (Original post by Cognito)
    yea those lucky ******** living in relative poverty with no opportunities and few aspirations, let down by the education system, brought up into disadvantaged households, pregnant at a young age, trapped in an almost unbreakable cycle of destitution.
    God, I envy them.

    Don't you realise that these people are those who were starving under thatcher? Do you not realise that their sky tv pales into obscurity compared to the relative quality of your lives? Do you have any sort of sympathy for those who have been dealt terrible hands in the lottery of existence and yet are despised by everyone else? Unemployment is not fun, try it. The same is true of prisons which people now equate with holiday camps (though funnily enough not those who've been in them).
    Unbreakable cycle? If they had any common decency they wouldn't be having children they couldn't provide for. Sure the jobs have dried up in their area but that hardly stops them moving towards work; that's how it works.
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    (Original post by Elipsis)
    Unbreakable cycle? If they had any common decency they wouldn't be having children they couldn't provide for. Sure the jobs have dried up in their area but that hardly stops them moving towards work; that's how it works.
    I partly agree but at same time thats like saying a couple cant have kids because they cant afford it thus stopping their bloodline, or even if they finally do find work they wont be young when having the kids.

    And what about people in work who get tax credits for their kids? sure they pay tax but if they didnt get that tax credit they couldnt afford to support themselves and may have to leave work so therefore why didnt they get a better paid job?
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    (Original post by MittenKrust)
    I partly agree but at same time thats like saying a couple cant have kids because they cant afford it
    That is exactly the point.
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    (Original post by Elipsis)
    Unbreakable cycle? If they had any common decency they wouldn't be having children they couldn't provide for. Sure the jobs have dried up in their area but that hardly stops them moving towards work; that's how it works.


    These are not simple issues and so putting all of the blame on individual responsibility is incredibly short-sighted. Many of the people we are talking about have poor numeracy and literacy skills and almost no qualifications; it's very difficult for them to obtain work of any kind.
    Of course there are those who knowingly abuse the system, but the answer is not to get rid of a benefits framework that hold millions of people (just) above the threshold of poverty. Reform it, yes. But our focus should be on helping the vast majority who are that position through no fault of their own, rather than castigate the minority of benefit fraudsters.

    P.S Right wing politics is dead, not Attlee. The NHS lives on while Thatchers 'darwinian' banking system crumbles.
    No such thing as society my arse.
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    My family have been in a council house now for around 17 years. My Dad had to move here because he'd be relocated in his job - we were homeless and the council gave us a house. I've spent my entire childhood in this house and it's our home.

    I'm glad though, that the people currently occupying council houses will be unaffected by the new proposals to scrap 'housing for life'. I fully intend on buying this house when I can.
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    (Original post by jaydoh)
    How can you? The logic is simple. Extra people (1 million Poles, for example) living in what could be considered social housing which quite clearly a British-born person should live in, if they have lived here the majority of their lives, means less housing.

    Surely?
    BUT a lot of the immigrants here work very hard and when they can afford to rent a non-council house they move out and rent it. also, many immigrants who live here but have a family in their own country live in private accommodation with many other immigrants to reduce cost so they can send as much of their money back to their family as possible.

    if a british person is lazy enough to sit on their a*** all day and not get a job and live off the government (provided there is no real reason as to unemployment like disability) then i would say they were less deserving of council housing than an immigrant who is contributing to society and paying taxes even if they work menial jobs but with very long hours because they are still contributing to society
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    (Original post by Cognito)
    These are not simple issues and so putting all of the blame on individual responsibility is incredibly short-sighted. Many of the people we are talking about have poor numeracy and literacy skills and almost no qualifications; it's very difficult for them to obtain work of any kind.

    P.S Right wing politics is dead, not Attlee. The NHS lives on while Thatchers 'darwinian' banking system crumbles.
    No such thing as society my arse.
    How can you give a perfect argument for repealing minimum wage law and then pronounce that right wing politics is dead?
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    (Original post by Ilora-Danon)
    My family have been in a council house now for around 17 years. My Dad had to move here because he'd be relocated in his job - we were homeless and the council gave us a house. I've spent my entire childhood in this house and it's our home.

    I'm glad though, that the people currently occupying council houses will be unaffected by the new proposals to scrap 'housing for life'. I fully intend on buying this house when I can.
    And at this point I disagree. How can you benefit from social housing and then actively intend to deny it from others?
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    (Original post by tom//)
    you know, thats probably true

    youll probably get called 'racist' for saying that at some point though

    Hear Hear!
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    (Original post by FTC199)
    BUT a lot of the immigrants here work very hard and when they can afford to rent a non-council house they move out and rent it. also, many immigrants who live here but have a family in their own country live in private accommodation with many other immigrants to reduce cost so they can send as much of their money back to their family as possible.

    if a british person is lazy enough to sit on their a*** all day and not get a job and live off the government (provided there is no real reason as to unemployment like disability) then i would say they were less deserving of council housing than an immigrant who is contributing to society and paying taxes even if they work menial jobs but with very long hours because they are still contributing to society
    That can go either way since I personally have been one of those lazy British people but that was because I had no morale or support(plus depression but wont bring that into it) but had I been given access to a better place then I would try, also if more jobs were available so I would be more likely to work.

    I dont mind immigrants but what I notice is that employers seem to WANT immigrants as they are willing to complain less therefore work "harder" from what I have seen of Polish people for example is their work ethic is fantastic(I have seen Polish bus drivers, builders etc, all friendly) but out of work they have a habit of pushing in front of queues in supermarkets and banks(partly as banks have people trained in Polish) but ignorant of the massive queue of people who have been waiting for ages before them.

    Plus if I went for a job interview id want to be able to speak to the other staff and have a laugh or a drink after work, in my experience with places that have immigrant staff is they keep themselves to themselves and "pretend" they dont speak English when you try to talk to them creating a barrier so its uncomfortable for the British staff.
 
 
 
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