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Sex! Consent from the girl?? watch

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    I'd secretly record the liason on film . . . for legal purposes.
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    (Original post by Mattaf)
    I'm nicking that for a sitcom I'm writing... you don't get any royalties... :p:
    Aw, what?! :p:
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    (Original post by Mr Nonsense)
    Basically, this guy at a nearby school has been charged with attempted rape or something after he invited a girl back to his house, she agreed and one thing led to another and he claims that her behaviour indicated she was up for it....
    I see the law in England was reformed not that long ago, increasing culpability in a poor trade off for a low conviction rate.

    In Scotland the law is that it is not rape so long as the man in question honestly believes consent was given (even if it was not), regardless of how reasonable that assumption may be. Obviously this leads to a few unusual situations, but ultimately I think it actually works better than reformers would suggest.

    This got me thinking. When you have sex with a girl who you are not in a long term relationship with, do you ask her explicitly for her consent? do you assume it based on her leading the way? or her showing no signs of discouragement?
    Of course. You're hardly going to interrupt proceedings with a stammering 'er... excuse me, yeah, but just to make sure, you do consent to full intercourse and will mention if you care to withdraw that consent?'
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    (Original post by a_t)
    This sounds like a case we were looking at R v. Bree, in the end there is a clash of testimony between you and the guy, unless you are completely unconscious its essentially gonna be up to the jury who they believe in the circumstances
    Does English law not have a requirement for corroboration? (apologies for my ignorance, I did look all this stuff up once, but have forgotten most of it over the years) Because surely one word against another doesn't even come down to balancing evidence, but is rather a complete non-starter.

    (Original post by Mattaf)
    It's a very dodgy area... people have been known to consent to (even initiate) intercourse whilst drunk, regret it the next morning and cry rape. You've got to be so careful. Personally, I wouldn't sleep with a girl if I knew she was drunk - I'd be too worried about the consequences the next day.
    How drunk is drunk though? I mean, obviously if she's falling about all over the place and such, it'd be rather off, but if the woman in question is just a bit pissed then it's hardly alienating her reason, is it?
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    (Original post by L i b)
    How drunk is drunk though? I mean, obviously if she's falling about all over the place and such, it'd be rather off, but if the woman in question is just a bit pissed then it's hardly alienating her reason, is it?
    Well that's just it - where do you draw the line? I know for a fact that I can drink only a very small amount, not be falling about all over the place and my judgement be affected quite a lot.

    Just because the physical signs all say "Yeah, he/she is just a bit tipsy, it's all good, they must know what they're doing", it doesn't mean that this is the case. Better safe than sorry.
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    (Original post by Ewan)
    Alot of people get so drunk on a night out, that this statement isn't true.
    Yeah my friend once consented to having sex with a cow whilst being chained up. I'm not sure how that'd work, and obviously it never happened, she's scared of cows. She doesn't at all remember the conversation.

    So I can see why it can be a really grey area if you're both really drunk. Also it would never stand in court. The ideal rape victim is a very drunk girl. All the guy would need to do is have some alcohol himself and leave no injuries.
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    (Original post by tropical-twist3)
    The ideal rape victim is a very drunk girl. All the guy would need to do is have some alcohol himself and leave no injuries.
    Believe me, that kind of case doesn't even get to court. The police spend about a week on it- at most- then close the case and no more is said about it. It doesn't even go on any sort of national database.



    Personally, I expect both partners to make sure the other is comfortable with what's going on. Equal responsibility and all that.
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    Consent? It is not an issue, girls are ALWAYS up for it. Any moaning, crying or screaming is a sign of pleasure. If she runs away she is just playing hard to get and wants to be caught (preferably tied up too) and whipped.
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    I only expect to be asked explicitly for consent if I'm drunk. But it doesn't hurt to ask, really.

    Edit: wtf at people saying if she's so drunk she can't even say yes or no, it's not rape. It clearly is, since she can't possibly consent.
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    (Original post by Ewan)
    People who are intoxicated can't give legal concent though can they?
    consent** and yes they can if it's voluntary intoxication and your conscious. One justice in a high profile case of which the name escapes me made the logical sound and yet mildly insensitive comment of "intoxicated consent is still consent"
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    (Original post by HJV)
    Yes, when the pants come off, I jump up and run to my desk.

    "Please fill this form SC4b and sign here, here and here before we may proceed. I will also need a document proving your age."
    Whoa, whoa, whoa! Slow down, tiger! You've completely missed the rigorous risk assessment procedure, and the all time number one: the NHS insurance card and medical details, along with results from full STD screenings.

    You're such an irresponsible lover. :rolleyes:
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    If she doesn't object to you taking her clothes off and doesn't start to slap you as you're doing your thing then I think it's clear that on some level there is consent. There might be rare cases where there isn't a clear agreement to the 'act', but surely if a woman doesn't start to object, i.e. show 'anti-consent' then on some level she has consented?

    Rape is so vague, but you can't say you didn't want it afterwards if you didn't say no before or during. You can't really expect a guy to go through a million different checks and double-checks before anything happens. I've known occasions where girls have jumped people (maybe even myself ) in the past without getting consent so could reasonably be accused of rape on the bounds that I did not consent, but simply by participating I blatantly DID consent.
 
 
 
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