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    Is it ok to apply to both the RAF and RNAF at the same time?
    Just wondering if either service would look down on this? I presume you would have to tell both of them that the other was a backup

    Any advice?
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    If you are considering joining the Fleet Air Arm (FAA), I'd get the terminology sorted first. Nothing more embarrassing than not knowing the service you are joining (wanting to join) is called.
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    Sorry these are all just ideas on the pipeline.
    In an ideal world i would be a pilot in the RAF however if i have the opportunity of having a backup as a pilot in another force i want to know about it
    I am yet to visit the AFCO for the first time so i just want to make sure i dont shoot myself in the foot before i even speak to them. I have family who have been in both the Navy and the RAF so i'd be happy in either.
    I guess speaking to the people at the AFCO would be the first place to start?
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    how about the Army Air Corps?
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    The only fly helis don't they?
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    I would advise taking your time, if you want to join the RAF then apply for the RAF. In the event that they tell you never to darken their doors again, try the Navy but it's unlikely that you would be successful the second time round.

    Additionally, on your forms you write if you have any other applications in the pipeline, you won't want to lie and it may be frowned upon if they deem you not to be putting 100% in to everything.

    Apply for what you want and if you are unsuccessful, go for your second option, after all you will have at least three years to do so.
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    Its a possibility. im definately more drawn to RAF in particular. In an ideal world i want to be flying FJ. It could work as a backup though.
    Can you apply to join all 3 at the same time? :/
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    (Original post by Tomm_UK)
    I would advise taking your time, if you want to join the RAF then apply for the RAF. In the event that they tell you never to darken their doors again, try the Navy but it's unlikely that you would be successful the second time round.

    Additionally, on your forms you write if you have any other applications in the pipeline, you won't want to lie and it may be frowned upon if they deem you not to be putting 100% in to everything.

    Apply for what you want and if you are unsuccessful, go for your second option, after all you will have at least three years to do so.
    Unfortunately im 22 already so i dont have quite as long as id like. Hence why im thinking before i go i need to sort out whether i need a backup.

    Thats what i thought though, I did hear someone on this forum say somewhere that they applied for two at the same time, one as a backup and in the end they got an offer for both.

    Could having a backup really be frowned upon? Depends how you explain it i guess
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    So you can walk in to your AFCO tomorrow and speak to the RAF to get the ball rolling. You still have until you are 26 to start training with the Navy. If you want to fly FJ, you really need to go RAF as, although the Navy do have FJ pilots, they don't have as many and so your chances are lower.

    Of course, FJ isn't everything, however I believe the RAF offers a better deal for pilots as you do more than circle overhead a carrier group, for example!

    You can apply for both at the same time but bear the following in mind:
    It will increase your workload, i.e. the stuff you have to learn about each service, each training pipeline etc.
    It would take more of your time; assuming you work, you will end up missing more days to go away and do interviews, selection etc (though not many more)
    The AFCO staff might be scratching their heads a bit as you walk up to a different desk every time!

    In my opinion, it's all about how it looks. If I was interviewing a potential candidate knowing that they were, at the same time, applying to a different service I wouldn't be able to remove that niggle in the back of my mind which would say "I'm not sure that this person really wants this job if he's applying for other stuff already..."

    Your call though, I know you will want to square things away ASAP, I was exactly the same and in the same position as you nine months ago and I decided to wait before I applied for the FAA. Thankfully I didn't need to, but if I did need to then I know I would have put 110% into it.
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    Thats some great advice! Thanks
    I didnt know the Navy requirement was 26 so thats very comforting
    I know what you mean about that niggling feeling and personally i feel that if i did apply for both at the same time i would probably be doing myself a bit of an unjusitice as its splitting the amount of time i can put into both. I thought the guys at the AFCO might think it a bit weird aswell

    Luckily i run my own business so time off for interviews etc isnt really an issue.
    RAF and FJ's has always been the dream so i think your right, the navy is the backup there if i need it.
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    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Can you apply to join all 3 at the same time? :/
    "Hello and welcome to your RAF interview. So, what evidence do you have that you really want to join, and really want to be an RAF officer, and really like us and our ethos and everything? What's that? You haven't studied much because you're also learning FAA and AAC things, because you're not remotely interested in being an RAF officer, you just want to fly? Alright, I'll just hand over to my colleague...."

    Do remember the "officer first, pilot second" stuff. Yes, you're keen to fly, but if you're focussed at that at the expense of looking at whether you're more keen on the RAF, FAA or AAC way of life, then I can assure you you're going about it wrong. Being a pilot in one is not the same as being a pilot in another, and you'll find that you spend much much more of your time immersed in your service's life and ethos than you will in the cockpit.

    It strikes me that you've frantically gone "oh my God I want to be a pilot!!" without really looking at it. Are you remotely interested in being an RAF officer? Also, have you looked into the other streams? It's one thing saying "FJ's the dream," but the reality is we're currently sending less than a third of our pilots that way, so you have a 2/3 chance of going other ways.
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    I'll just gently counterbalance Wzz's comments, which I don't disagree with, just I think they take a very specific slant on things.

    Yes, you can apply to all three at the same time. There are only 3 'companies' that offer military flying, it's not like being a project manager or a shop manager where there are near limitless opportunities.

    If you tell them, and likely you will have to if they are just living at different desks in the AFCO then you will have to offer decent reasons. But then decent reasons are available, so use them. Just make sure you don't present yourself, as Wzz suggested, like someone who has panicked and is making blanket applications without the necessary research behind all of them.
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    (Original post by threeportdrift)
    If you tell them, and likely you will have to if they are just living at different desks in the AFCO then you will have to offer decent reasons. But then decent reasons are available, so use them. Just make sure you don't present yourself, as Wzz suggested, like someone who has panicked and is making blanket applications without the necessary research behind all of them.
    That's more what I meant. You need some good reasons, because they will ask if you'll consider a ground branch if you're unfit to fly. One one hand, you're trying to convince them you really want to be in the RAF, and on the other hand telling them you only want to be a pilot.

    There's nothing wrong with that, but it'll call into questions some issues. How will you take ground tours? How will you manage long holds? If all you want is to fly, how will you cope with the 90% of your job that doesn't involve that?
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    Thanks again for all the feedback. Im sorry if this annoyed you slightly, i imagine you get thousands of "i want to be a fighter pilot" esque threads. You all make good points and I should in all honesty of explained my situation a little better.

    By applying for each of the services it does give the impression that all i am interested in is being a pilot, which isn't entirely true. Thats definately not the impression i want to give.

    Being an RAF Officer is what i want to do first and foremost. Its taken me a little longer than most to realise this but being in the RAF as a pilot is "the dream" (cliche much). I know until im actually in the RAF i wont know this for a fact. Ive been involved in business for the last 5 years and its taken me this long to realise the only aspects of it i enjoy is the travelling, meeting people and managing a team. My experience of ATC when i was young was probably the happiest of my life. Anyway, you all dont want to hear that :P

    Yes fighter jets are the dream, as im sure is the norm for the majority of pilots however i would be ecstatic to be given the opportunity to pilot anything.

    If i was unfit to fly (and therefore unfit to fly in any military service) then there are certain ground branches that i would be interested in, however that would be a bit of a compromise.

    The main reason for my concern (and this post) was my age. At 22 i understand that i dont have all that long left to apply and i presumed the age requirement for all 3 services was 23. Its just nice to know that, if for some reason i didn't get into the RAF; and because of my age couldnt apply again, i could still work on improving myself and then have other options.
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    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Being an RAF Officer is what i want to do first and foremost. Its taken me a little longer than most to realise this but being in the RAF as a pilot is "the dream" (cliche much). I know until im actually in the RAF i wont know this for a fact.
    Well, you have to have something on your list to start with, so that's perfectly reasonable; as is exclusively wanting to be a pilot. However, if you're sure; or if you even think; that you want to be an RAF officer, you should probably be researching back-up options in ground branches that would still let you do that rather than having the FAA and AAC as reserves.

    Being in either of them is nothing at all like being in the RAF, so if you think you like the RAF, you'd find the other 2 rather different.

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Yes fighter jets are the dream, as im sure is the norm for the majority of pilots however i would be ecstatic to be given the opportunity to pilot anything.
    Good; I've met a lot of people with very unhealthy attitudes towards where they get sent, and it's not nice! They tend to be the guys on the course no-one likes as they're aware that they might be competing with their coursemates for limited slots...

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    If i was unfit to fly (and therefore unfit to fly in any military service) then there are certain ground branches that i would be interested in, however that would be a bit of a compromise.
    It would, but at the end of the day a lot of us don't fly all that much; sometimes just once or twice a week! And the rest of the time, it's much like being any other officer in the RAF. Believe me, the service ethos, the lifestyle, the people form 95% of your job and the flying fills the last 5%.

    Believe me, if I was told tomorrow that I couldn't fly in the RAF anymore, and could either pick an RAF ground branch or join the FAA, the only thing that would attract me to the FAA would be retaining my flying pay!

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Its just nice to know that, if for some reason i didn't get into the RAF; and because of my age couldnt apply again, i could still work on improving myself and then have other options.
    I would recommend applying fairly soon then. And put some ground branches down. If you desperately want to be a pilot above all else, then you have that as an option, but bear in mind life as an FAA RW pilot is so far removed from being in the RAF that it deserves a lot of research and studying before you assume it's a natural second choice.

    If the RAF reject you for pilot, where you go next depends why. If it's a medical issue, the FAA and AAC are slightly slacker on some issues but not all. If your aptitude is rock bottom, the AAC have a fairly low limit but if you're below that you'll struggle. If you fail OASC outright, then it gets more complicated.

    Your fundamental decision is whether you want to be in the RAF or just want to fly, and you seem to have decided you want to be in the RAF. You could start IOT as a scribbly, get 4 months in, and go "sod it, I've had enough, I'm going to try and be an FAA pilot." VW, apply to the Navy, and see how it goes. It wouldn't be terribly easy to go back the other way if it didn't work out, but it's there as an option.
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    (Original post by Wzz)
    Well, you have to have something on your list to start with, so that's perfectly reasonable; as is exclusively wanting to be a pilot. However, if you're sure; or if you even think; that you want to be an RAF officer, you should probably be researching back-up options in ground branches that would still let you do that rather than having the FAA and AAC as reserves.

    Being in either of them is nothing at all like being in the RAF, so if you think you like the RAF, you'd find the other 2 rather different.
    Thanks, i actually made the assumption that being a pilot in either the FAA or AAC would be a pretty similar role to that of the RAF. Obviously im wrong. In an ideal world i want to be flying whether that be once a day/week/month etc doesnt really matter, however if I have eyesight problems unknown to me, or other reasons i cannot fly (as a pilot or WSO) then i would definately want to be working towards a ground branch.


    (Original post by Wzz)
    Good; I've met a lot of people with very unhealthy attitudes towards where they get sent, and it's not nice! They tend to be the guys on the course no-one likes as they're aware that they might be competing with their coursemates for limited slots...
    Im presuming the majority put their preference during streaming as FJ? Doesnt it all just come down to natural ability? I can imagine how intense it probably gets. As i say, i'd genuinely be ecstatic to fly anything.


    (Original post by Wzz)
    It would, but at the end of the day a lot of us don't fly all that much; sometimes just once or twice a week! And the rest of the time, it's much like being any other officer in the RAF. Believe me, the service ethos, the lifestyle, the people form 95% of your job and the flying fills the last 5%.

    Believe me, if I was told tomorrow that I couldn't fly in the RAF anymore, and could either pick an RAF ground branch or join the FAA, the only thing that would attract me to the FAA would be retaining my flying pay!
    Thats quite surprising to hear actually. I thought as a pilot youd do practically anything to make sure you could keep flying, even if it meant joining another service. I suppose your love first and foremost must be for the RAF

    (Original post by Wzz)
    I would recommend applying fairly soon then. And put some ground branches down. If you desperately want to be a pilot above all else, then you have that as an option, but bear in mind life as an FAA RW pilot is so far removed from being in the RAF that it deserves a lot of research and studying before you assume it's a natural second choice.

    If the RAF reject you for pilot, where you go next depends why. If it's a medical issue, the FAA and AAC are slightly slacker on some issues but not all. If your aptitude is rock bottom, the AAC have a fairly low limit but if you're below that you'll struggle. If you fail OASC outright, then it gets more complicated.
    Im absolutely dreading the eyetest already and i havent even visited AFCO yet. I've never had any problems with my eyes at all but you just dont know. Thats in fates hands i guess. Where do the FAA and AAC's medical issues differ?

    Im fairly confident my aptitude wont be rock bottom (well, fingers crossed). Maths has always been one of my stronger points but im sure it comes down to more than just that.

    (Original post by Wzz)
    Your fundamental decision is whether you want to be in the RAF or just want to fly, and you seem to have decided you want to be in the RAF. You could start IOT as a scribbly, get 4 months in, and go "sod it, I've had enough, I'm going to try and be an FAA pilot." VW, apply to the Navy, and see how it goes. It wouldn't be terribly easy to go back the other way if it didn't work out, but it's there as an option.
    The RAF is where i want to be. Whats a scribbly? I can imagine it would be more difficult to go to OASC and not put down any ground roles, not get through, then go to the FAA, not get through with them aswell so return to the RAF. That does seem very dubious, im sure it would ring a lot of alarm bells.

    Im definately going to do some more research into ground branches aswell as how pilots in the FAA and AAC differ. Will get applying very soon. Just need a haircut

    All i can do is put everything into becoming a pilot, and if, for medical or other reasons that doesnt come good ive still got plenty of other great options.
    Thanks for all the advice.
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    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Thanks, i actually made the assumption that being a pilot in either the FAA or AAC would be a pretty similar role to that of the RAF. Obviously im wrong.
    The individual roles are very different too, although there's some crossover (obviously) in various RW roles and between the RAF and FAA Harrier communities. I mean, as an FAA pilot you have a large chance of ending up either in the CHF dropping off Marines, which is broadly similar to doing an RAF SH job, but ending up as the pilot on a frigate's only Lynx, or as a Sea King pinger, is very very different both operationally and in terms of lifestyle than any RAF job.

    That's what I wanted to get across to people who think the FAA's an immediate second choice. Yes, it's still a military flying job, but the whole setup and the life is very very different. Some love that, some don't mind, and I wouldn't say it was a bad thing (although it's not my idea of fun), but people should realise that it's not just an RAF that lets you grow a beard.

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Im presuming the majority put their preference during streaming as FJ? Doesnt it all just come down to natural ability?
    Yes and no. Everyone's picking their preferences having done EFT, so everyone's aware of their abilities, so some people decide relatively early that they're more likely or better suited to going one way or the other. Most people with the ability probably do want jets though.

    First deciding factor on where you go is service need; so even if you're not good enough for jets on paper, they might take you as a training risk if they happen to be desperate at that moment. Ability is second, personal preference third!

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Thats quite surprising to hear actually. I thought as a pilot youd do practically anything to make sure you could keep flying, even if it meant joining another service.
    As I say, my life's been that of an RAF officer, and I like the service, the stations, and the lifestyle. I'd rather stick with that than make a jump to something completely different and unknown that I'm assuming would be similar, just because it's still military. I hope you understand what I mean.

    Once I crack 2000 hours, I'd be infinitely more likely to move to an airline job than I would be to join another service.

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    Where do the FAA and AAC's medical issues differ?
    All sorts of things, including eyesight. Do a search.

    (Original post by carsomyr)
    The RAF is where i want to be. Whats a scribbly? I can imagine it would be more difficult to go to OASC and not put down any ground roles, not get through, then go to the FAA, not get through with them aswell so return to the RAF. That does seem very dubious, im sure it would ring a lot of alarm bells.
    Well, you could get away with it! You'd have to be honest, and say that you want to fly and that's it, so you're going RAF to FAA to AAC to private ballooning before you consider anything else. You'd have to tell the FAA you wanted pilot or nothing else, then if they rejected you, go back to the RAF saying you thought the FAA would be a good second choice but you've realised you really want to be in the RAF. You'd look slightly mad, but I doubt they'd fail you for it outright!
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    (Original post by Wzz)
    "Hello and welcome to your RAF interview. So, what evidence do you have that you really want to join, and really want to be an RAF officer, and really like us and our ethos and everything? What's that? You haven't studied much because you're also learning FAA and AAC things, because you're not remotely interested in being an RAF officer, you just want to fly? Alright, I'll just hand over to my colleague...."

    Do remember the "officer first, pilot second" stuff. Yes, you're keen to fly, but if you're focussed at that at the expense of looking at whether you're more keen on the RAF, FAA or AAC way of life, then I can assure you you're going about it wrong. Being a pilot in one is not the same as being a pilot in another, and you'll find that you spend much much more of your time immersed in your service's life and ethos than you will in the cockpit.

    It strikes me that you've frantically gone "oh my God I want to be a pilot!!" without really looking at it. Are you remotely interested in being an RAF officer? Also, have you looked into the other streams? It's one thing saying "FJ's the dream," but the reality is we're currently sending less than a third of our pilots that way, so you have a 2/3 chance of going other ways.

    What a pretentious so & so! - I love the fact that this person feels they have the right to talk to people in this manner! From what I can gather this guy is in the RAF (cant believe that the RAF now need to recurit people with this elitist, arrogant, so far up there own back side attitude)

    I used this forum for a few years, however when ever I go into a post there seems to be the same few people mocking, and nit-picking at other people who have turned to this website for help from appartently like minded people.

    If the guys who seem to be on this website each and every day, despite being in the RAF or otherwise, are fed up of helping people or repeating them selfs - then stop replying to the posts. If the people asking had any sense they would figure out the search facility and do it them selfs, but they dont need to as the answers are giving - but at the cost of some demeaning, sarcastic remark

    The fact is people such as Wzz, Dowgly, TPD etc get cheap little thrills from *****ing at people - Oh watch your english, huf - why dont you search instead of asking. There is always a snidely comment to be made.

    And Carsomyr if you are reading this, take no notice of what they say. The fact that your are 22 and have only recently shown some interest will go against you - however only ever so slightly. If you can turn round and say - Hey you know what I am a bit older than others that are applying without a degree however after a few years working in a civivie job I can truely appricate the diverse working enivorment the RAF has to offer and I feel that I have developed loads of life exp etc. And yes apply to the FAA if you want - the fact that you acknowledge that you are getting on a bit (for aircrew) is a disadvantage, however you have sufficent maturity to plan in some contingency and dont want to narrow your chances further by delaying any applications by a further year. Perfectly reasonably.

    Guys just think the way in which you talk to people may give a negative impression to some kid who has only just come online to get a bit of friendly advice. Also I can guarantee you that speaking they way you do to airman and NCO will go down will and re-enforce the idea that DE officers lack maturity and experience to manage effectively.
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    To the above poster:

    May I ask what qualifies you to offer such advice and write-off the advice of others?
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    To the above poster. I think his point is that often there is not advice, just 'sarcastic remarks'. I'm not having a dig by the way, just making an observation.
 
 
 
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