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    Sorry if this sounds prejudice, but does anyone apart from me think that not everyone should go to university? I mean what is the point of going to a crap university which is like really low in teh tables, and accepts people with E's, D's and C's?

    I mean, there are so many grads, with goo degrees coming out of good unis - what is the point of people who are simply unable, or less able, to go to uni??? The more able people who actually get somethign out of uni have to suffer, because we have to pay more tuition fees, and later on £3000 per year in fees!!! Isn't it a waste of money to go to such an institution as Hertfordshire or whatever to study media studies or whatever?

    I mean, emplyment does not come easy, and people with degrees from **** unis find it harder to get a job anyway - so do they get anything out of uni, at the expense of increased fees for those who do gain something.

    Hope this doesn't come across as offensive, but we need members in all sects of society. Where will we get our carpenters, gardeners,ane people in other menial jobs from.

    I see this government target of 50% of people going to uni as pointless, frankly - its not a sustainable strategy in the UK's longterm intersts,

    any views?

    Phil
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    they should have a greater emphasis on vocational courses, to balance the number of people with certain qualifications, to ensure there is a good balance between jobs and skills market.

    phil
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    You need to some more reading about government policy because there was never any intention of making 50% of people go to university. Also you can't prejudice people against their grades.

    Also define a crap university.
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    Perhaps they want some fun :beer:
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    (Original post by Davie_Moyes)
    Perhaps they want some fun :beer:
    Thats totaly the wrong reason to go university though, if you want fun get a job at 18-30.

    I do kind of agree that it is too easy to get into some universities however people are making this judgement on grades and thats not fair. I think personal qualities should come into it more than it does.
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    Yep, I remember reading your comments in the Oxbridge subforum and saying they were spot on. The government seem to have created a stigma that you have to go to university to get anywhere, which is not true. As you said, if there were better vocational alternatives, there would be no need, and obtaining a pointless degree from a rubbish university will do you no favours. To be frank, someone achieving Ds and Es at A-level is not going to benefit from university study. I don't see why I should have to pay £3000 a year for my modern languages degree which will allow me to become a teacher when there are people doing degrees like golf course management and wine studies who are only going to end up on the dole or working for McDonald's for the rest of their lives.
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    (Original post by kellywood_5)
    Yep, I remember reading your comments in the Oxbridge subforum and saying they were spot on. The government seem to have created a stigma that you have to go to university to get anywhere, which is not true. As you said, if there were better vocational alternatives, there would be no need, and obtaining a pointless degree from a rubbish university will do you no favours. To be frank, someone achieving Ds and Es at A-level is not going to benefit from university study. I don't see why I should have to pay £3000 a year for my modern languages degree which will allow me to become a teacher when there are people doing degrees like golf course management and wine studies who are only going to end up on the dole or working for McDonald's for the rest of their lives.
    This is just not true though, it seems anybody who has not yet been to university does not realise this. I know plenty of these students with very good jobs. Of course a lot of the E D students are just wasting their time and there is this stigma whichi is wrong, but how can you determine who will be at university and who will not be? Some of the best students on my course left school at 16 and have been working for the last 10 years or so.
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    Im going to Uni because I want to further my education, enjoy Accounting and can't wait to take advantage of the Union.

    Who do you people think you are though? You are critiscing people who go to "lesser" Universities. EVERYONE has the right to an education, even if they doing "lesser" degrees. Get off you moral high ground and let people have the opportunity to make a go of things in their life.
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    (Original post by Davie_Moyes)
    Im going to Uni because I want to further my education, enjoy Accounting and can't wait to take advantage of the Union.

    Who do you people think you are though? You are critiscing people who go to "lesser" Universities. EVERYONE has the right to an education, even if they doing "lesser" degrees. Get off you moral high ground and let people have the opportunity to make a go of things in their life.
    Everybody has the right to university education providing they meet a certain amount of conditions and that they can proove that the course will benefit them. People don't have the right to just walk into HE without any suitable qualifications or experience.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    Everybody has the right to university education providing they meet a certain amount of conditions and that they can proove that the course will benefit them. People don't have the right to just walk into HE without any suitable qualifications or experience.
    People do have the right to go to HE i.e. a college or Uni even if they don't have the qualifications. What kind of place do we live in when you are refused any basic further education?
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    I agree, some people such as mature students don't have qualifications but with experience. They also have the right to go to university.

    There are different types of higher education qualifications for people with different needs. For instance HNC/HND/foundation degrees are for people who usually want a vocational or job based focus with not that high entry requirements. Bachelor degrees for people that want to learn the subject in depth which require high entry requirements.
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    some people might become more focused as they mature @ uni
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    (Original post by Davie_Moyes)
    People do have the right to go to HE i.e. a college or Uni even if they don't have the qualifications. What kind of place do we live in when you are refused any basic further education?
    HE is not basic further education though, adult learning level 1, level 2 and level 3 is further education. HE is level 4 and 5 hardly basic further education.

    If adults want to go to university and don't have the qualifications then they will need to go college first so they can get the qualifications. If you just let any random person on the street university standards will dramaticaly decline.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    HE is not basic further education though, adult learning level 1, level 2 and level 3 is further education. HE is level 4 and 5 hardly basic further education.

    If adults want to go to university and don't have the qualifications then they will need to go college first so they can get the qualifications. If you just let any random person on the street university standards will dramaticaly decline.

    Your orginal point was that people with low grades should be allowed to go to Uni. You've just changed this to something else which incidently I agree on.
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    (Original post by Davie_Moyes)
    Your orginal point was that people with low grades should be allowed to go to Uni. You've just changed this to something else which incidently I agree on.
    If somebody has 10 years of work experience as a programmer and no A levels or just EE of course they should be able to go university. However if a person has E in Media Studies and an E in Sports Studies and have no real reason for this and have a poor statement then I don't think they should go to university.
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    C's are not low grades

    CCC is fine imo. You can go ucl and do chemical engineering with that and have a very good future.
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    I believe that there is still an absence of 50% of the population missing out on higher education. I think HE has a positive impact on the population. Not only does it make them more intelligent as a whole, it also makes people more social, and gives them a better outlook on life. I think people who belive in denying less able students to enter universities are very arrogant. In theory, if more people are going to uni, the population on average will earn more, and therefore pay more tax. This will improve the nation as a whole, and will also make companies more specialed. So denying education is a very negative decision both on moral and economic grounds.
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    (Original post by Phil23)
    Sorry if this sounds prejudice, but does anyone apart from me think that not everyone should go to university?
    I didn't realise everyone is going to university and I also didn't realise anyone in a position of authority on the matter suggested that everyone should go.

    (Original post by Phil23)
    I mean what is the point of going to a crap university which is like really low in teh tables, and accepts people with E's, D's and C's?
    As previously stated, define crap... oh I see you did "low in the tables" always a good approach to such judgements :rolleyes:


    (Original post by Phil23)
    I mean, there are so many grads, with goo degrees coming out of good unis - what is the point of people who are simply unable, or less able, to go to uni???
    That is working on the assumption that people who performed worse at A level will continue to do so, which I suppose is fair enough but by the same reasoning, why let everyone go to secondary school unless they get at least 5-5-5 at KS2...infact if potential isn't being demonstrated by the age of 3, they should be chucked down into the mines :rolleyes:

    (Original post by Phil23)
    The more able people who actually get somethign out of uni have to suffer, because we have to pay more tuition fees, and later on £3000 per year in fees!!! Isn't it a waste of money to go to such an institution as Hertfordshire or whatever to study media studies or whatever?
    If they are so 'able' then £3,000 is hardly going to make to much of a dent in their 6 figure salaries.

    (Original post by Phil23)
    I mean, emplyment does not come easy, and people with degrees from **** unis find it harder to get a job anyway - so do they get anything out of uni, at the expense of increased fees for those who do gain something.
    Those with a lack of social skills will also find it hard to get a job, so lets say your only allowed into uni if you've been invited to at least 10 parties in upper sixth. :rolleyes:

    (Original post by Phil23)
    Hope this doesn't come across as offensive, but we need members in all sects of society. Where will we get our carpenters, gardeners,ane people in other menial jobs from.
    Rather than hoping why do you learn to articulate yourself better than the crazy frog (as seen on tv)

    Actually with the emmergence of new forms of technology the need for such workers is constantly decreasing, sure it'll will never be totally redundant but the days of 95% of the population being farmers are long gone.

    How you defined those jobs to be menial I don't know. But I'll try and work it out

    Carpenters can earn as much as accountants, middle managers etc so it's not down to money.

    Maybe it's the fact that they don't wear suits :rolleyes: or perhaps because the skills required aren't as transferable from academic backgrounds and hence out of the reach of many academic sorts and those whos ideological views control most of society. Maybe not.

    (Original post by Phil23)
    I see this government target of 50% of people going to uni as pointless, frankly - its not a sustainable strategy in the UK's longterm intersts,
    I also find the target ridiculous and quite a poor statement to make, however there is no way people should be discouraged from bettering themselves.


    (Original post by Phil23)
    any views?
    see above.
    (Original post by Phil23)
    Phil
    Hey Phil!
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    (Original post by danmint)
    I believe that there is still an absence of 50% of the population missing out on higher education. I think HE has a positive impact on the population. Not only does it make them more intelligent as a whole, it also makes people more social, and gives them a better outlook on life. I think people who belive in denying less able students to enter universities are very arrogant. In theory, if more people are going to uni, the population on average will earn more, and therefore pay more tax. This will improve the nation as a whole, and will also make companies more specialed. So denying education is a very negative decision both on moral and economic grounds.
    Its a nice idea, but the reaility is we still need road sweepers, toilet cleaners, and binmen otherwise the country would grind to a halt. Are you suggesting that toilet cleaners should have university education?

    Also I have said this 20,0000 times now but there is no target for 50% of people to go university. There is a target for 50% of 21 year olds to have some kind of HE experience. Its two very different things.
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    (Original post by amazingtrade)
    Its a nice idea, but the reaility is we still need road sweepers, toilet cleaners, and binmen otherwise the country would grind to a halt. Are you suggesting that toilet cleaners should have university education?

    Also I have said this 20,0000 times now but there is no target for 50% of people to go university. There is a target for 50% of 21 year olds to have some kind of HE experience. Its two very different things.
    This is true, but if we have a nation of higher intelligence it will attract a lot companies to start up. Also, comparatively poorer countries are also beggining to catch up, and as an advanced country we should do as much as possible to stay ahead and keep companies from moving out.
 
 
 
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