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platinumki
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Will)
Did we even have an official national anthem then? God Save the King came in some time in the 1700s, unless I'm a decade out.
yes, everyone now forgets the 6th verse of the anthem that runs....


Lord, grant that Marshal Wade
May by Thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition crush
And like a torrent rush
Rebellious Scots to crush!
God save the Queen.
Not kidding.
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blissy
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#42
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#42
(Original post by platinumki)
yes, everyone now forgets the 6th verse of the anthem that runs....

Not kidding.
No, I think most people are aware of the latter verses.
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quadrocat
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#43
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#43
I'm quite proud to be British, but I don't like our national anthem, it's dirgy. I like Jerusalem though.

British patriotism is a completely separate thing to nationalism, but some people don't see it that way.
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platinumki
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#44
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#44
(Original post by quadrocat)
I'm quite proud to be British, but I don't like our national anthem, it's dirgy. I like Jerusalem though.

British patriotism is a completely separate thing to nationalism, but some people don't see it that way.
It's because loving your country is often one step away from hating everyone else's.
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quadrocat
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#45
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#45
(Original post by platinumki)
It's because loving your country is often one step away from hating everyone else's.
You can be proud of your country's cultural acheivements without hating other cultures.
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Howard
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#46
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#46
(Original post by platinumki)
It's because loving your country is often one step away from hating everyone else's.
Not really.
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Howard
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#47
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#47
(Original post by quadrocat)
You can be proud of your country's cultural acheivements without hating other cultures.
Not just cultural achievements. What about achievments in battle for example? Show me an Englishman that's not proud of Lord Nelson for example and I'll show you an imposter.
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platinumki
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#48
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not always

however...

I love my country.... my country is the best, ergo all other countries are worse.....
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platinumki
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#49
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#49
(Original post by Howard)
Not just cultural achievements. What about achievments in battle for example? Show me an Englishman that's not proud of Lord Nelson for example and I'll show you an imposter.
come on, I could probably show you a thousand who didn't know who he was!
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Howard
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#50
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#50
(Original post by platinumki)
come on, I could probably show you a thousand who didn't know who he was!
I was talking tongue in cheek. Nevertheless my point was that we don't need to limit our pride in our nation to cultural achievement, the arts, opera, ballet, fine cuisine or whatever "culture" is supposed to be.

We can also celebrate the "culture of battle" through heroes (to me anyway) like Nelson.
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platinumki
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#51
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#51
(Original post by Howard)
I was talking tongue in cheek. Nevertheless my point was that we don't need to limit our pride in our nation to cultural achievement, the arts, opera, ballet, fine cuisine or whatever "culture" is supposed to be.

We can also celebrate the "culture of battle" through heroes (to me anyway) like Nelson.
Irony is difficult to hear in cyber space (ooo, that would make a good song)

Pride... it seems a dodgy emotion to me. Always too close to something sinister.....
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Howard
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#52
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#52
(Original post by platinumki)
Irony is difficult to hear in cyber space (ooo, that would make a good song)

Pride... it seems a dodgy emotion to me. Always too close to something sinister.....
Yes. One minute I'm singing Rule Britannia and reflecting on Nelson's "And England expects....." signal and the next minute I'm off gassing jews and lynching black people.
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Gaz031
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#53
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#53
Is there a lack of patriotism in Britain?
Yes. I believe there is little patriotism and even community spirit is on the decline as the modern world sucumbs to globalisation and we lose our identities.

Is the lack of overt patriotism a good thing?
No. I think it serves a purpose. It envokes national pride and positive feelings.

Does patriotism encourage a yob culture, positive pride, or pride that leads to more reprehensible actions?
It encourages yob culture as people don't feel part of the whole. They just feel bored and have no admiration for anything other than meaningless celebrities.
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an Siarach
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#54
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(Original post by kew96158)
True. If I remember rightly, it became a principality rather than an independant country after it was conquered by Edward I.
It was an independant principality (and recognised as such by England) prior to its annexation by england.
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an Siarach
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#55
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#55
(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
England was founded around 450 AD so the Romans could not have 'conquered' the English since it was around 43 AD, of course, it took them three times to do it, and even then luck went their way :aetsch: . As for the Vikings, we've been through this before. Only parts of England went under their control and when I've read books on it, itheir invasion doesn't seem to count as completely successful. As for the Normans, well, wouldn't have happened if Harold just conceded the thrown to the legal successor, William I. Greed...
Fair enough in reference to the Romans, i was thinking more in terms of the territory of England rather than the nation state. You seem to be acknowledging only the part of English history when you paid tribute to the Vikings - the Danegeld - but England as a whole was conquered and formed part of the great Scandinavian empire of Cnut or Canute the Great; the wikipedia entry records he was King of Denmark,Norway,England and overlord of Pomerania and Schleswig.
(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
Yes. An important battle missed out. You know how Hollywood likes portraying the English as the bad guys :rolleyes:
The hollywood view of history is quite hilarious. Mel Gibson is especially amusing when it comes to his portrayals of Britain (inevitably meaning England) The Patriot was even worse than Braveheart and the only film ive seen where i was actually rooting for the bad guys.
(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
I believe that one of the reasons why there is a lack in British patriotism is that the United Kingdom is not as united as other countries have been. Also the fact that we're no longer a superpower might help. The history of the British Isles and Europe as a whole might have further implications too.
I think the whole issue of 'unpatriotic britain' is horribly overblown and rather self centred. If you go to Spain you will find the nation even more distinctly divided and France+Germany and most large nations are exactly the same. We Brits probably look just as patriotic to the europeans as they seem to us.
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