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I have a PhD from a Russel group uni, a distinction in my master’s, a first class joint honours too.

No one cares.

I am as unemployed as it gets, hoping to get an admin job but I even got rejected for that (I think because my examples were not very admin related).

Point is, as interested as you are in a potential PhD topic, know that if its not in sciences chances are it won't lead to a job. Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

😞

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Original post by Secretariat123
Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

Quite.
Reply 2
Thanks for the honesty. Someone once told me that unless I want to teach at a university, most employers won't care about a PhD. They just want experience and that's true. I still want to pursue a PhD in the future, but that'll be part-time after I get a job and it'll be focused on an area related to my job.

It's sad hearing about your struggles and I wish you the best. I hope you find a job soon.
Original post by Secretariat123
I have a PhD from a Russel group uni, a distinction in my master’s, a first class joint honours too.

No one cares.

I am as unemployed as it gets, hoping to get an admin job but I even got rejected for that (I think because my examples were not very admin related).

Point is, as interested as you are in a potential PhD topic, know that if its not in sciences chances are it won't lead to a job. Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

😞


I’m sorry to hear that things haven’t been working out for you :frown: I wish you all the best with future job applications :smile: If you don’t mind me asking, which degree did you do? I’ve been hearing loads of horror stories along these lines and I want to try and avoid it at least :redface:
Original post by DarylO
Thanks for the honesty. Someone once told me that unless I want to teach at a university, most employers won't care about a PhD. They just want experience and that's true. I still want to pursue a PhD in the future, but that'll be part-time after I get a job and it'll be focused on an area related to my job.

It's sad hearing about your struggles and I wish you the best. I hope you find a job soon.

Thank you. That's a really good shout, good luck!
Original post by sleep_supremacy
I’m sorry to hear that things haven’t been working out for you :frown: I wish you all the best with future job applications :smile: If you don’t mind me asking, which degree did you do? I’ve been hearing loads of horror stories along these lines and I want to try and avoid it at least :redface:

Thanks! Sure i done Politics and Sociology at Brunel, Middle East Politics at SOAS, and a PhD in the department of Theology and Religion in university of Birmingham.

My conclusion is you (everyone) need a 'wasta' as it is called in the middle East, a connection or someone who can open doors figuratively for you.

You (sleep supremacy) can avoid my experiences by applying to the public sector, jobs like civil service where through watching a few youtube vids as well as learning how to answer in the robot method they want, you'll be fine! I've recently been trying this but sometimes I let my personality get in the way and we know that in order to succeed we must not show we are human.

My apologies, I digress...
Original post by Secretariat123
Thanks! Sure i done Politics and Sociology at Brunel, Middle East Politics at SOAS, and a PhD in the department of Theology and Religion in university of Birmingham.

My conclusion is you (everyone) need a 'wasta' as it is called in the middle East, a connection or someone who can open doors figuratively for you.

You (sleep supremacy) can avoid my experiences by applying to the public sector, jobs like civil service where through watching a few youtube vids as well as learning how to answer in the robot method they want, you'll be fine! I've recently been trying this but sometimes I let my personality get in the way and we know that in order to succeed we must not show we are human.

My apologies, I digress...


Thanks for your reply :smile: I’m not planning to apply to the public sector, but I’ll definitely look into some YouTube vids to help me with interviews when I get there :thumbsup:
Original post by Secretariat123
I have a PhD from a Russel group uni, a distinction in my master’s, a first class joint honours too.

No one cares.

I am as unemployed as it gets, hoping to get an admin job but I even got rejected for that (I think because my examples were not very admin related).

Point is, as interested as you are in a potential PhD topic, know that if its not in sciences chances are it won't lead to a job. Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

😞


If you apply for graduate schemes where intelligence is valued, e.g. consultancy with big firms, you might be more successful.
Original post by DarylO
Thanks for the honesty. Someone once told me that unless I want to teach at a university, most employers won't care about a PhD. They just want experience and that's true. I still want to pursue a PhD in the future, but that'll be part-time after I get a job and it'll be focused on an area related to my job.

It's sad hearing about your struggles and I wish you the best. I hope you find a job soon.


Science in industry is a huge field (a lot bigger than academia) where a PhD is highly desirable and often a requirement.
Unfortunately this is true for a lot of areas (not all as Plantagenet Crown says). A lot of employers value practical skills over degrees nowadays.

Too many people have degrees and too many people are at university when they honestly probably shouldn't be.
Original post by Secretariat123
I have a PhD from a Russel group uni, a distinction in my master’s, a first class joint honours too.

No one cares.

I am as unemployed as it gets, hoping to get an admin job but I even got rejected for that (I think because my examples were not very admin related).

Point is, as interested as you are in a potential PhD topic, know that if its not in sciences chances are it won't lead to a job. Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

😞

Spot on. I was at an AC for a consultancy, and got talking to the other candidates. One guy there studied Mechanical Engineering, and had just finished his PhD. In his spare time, he was working on a prototype of an advanced radiation machine. Extremely, extremely intelligent guy, but was struggling to find a job. I was shocked. He got the job in the end and I was so happy for him.

Since I've seen his success with it, I would recommend trying consultancy roles, or analytical research roles - especially opportunities that are grad JOBS rather than grad schemes, as they tend to care less about you potentially being "overqualified". Websites like Graduate Recruitment Bureau and Gradcracker are good places to look. I wouldn't sell yourself short and waste time in admin roles, unless its relevant to your career path. Although I know it's easier said than done. Good luck going forward!
(edited 1 year ago)
Original post by CoolCavy
Unfortunately this is true for a lot of areas (not all as Plantagenet Crown says). A lot of employers value practical skills over degrees nowadays.

Too many people have degrees and too many people are at university when they honestly probably shouldn't be.

I wish this was more widely known amongst the general population and TSR. It's true, nobody gives a single **** about your qualifications.

As for OP I would seriously suggest that they go into teaching or something.
The fundamental problem with all of this is that university teaches you academic skills whereas most people attend because they think that university will get them a better job. The two cannot match up.
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
The fundamental problem with all of this is that university teaches you academic skills whereas most people attend because they think that university will get them a better job. The two cannot match up.

They can, it's just that most places are incredibly bad at doing a good job of it. And this is true across the country, in my experience. A few places can do a good job of it - hidden gems. Jackie Carter at Manc has written about this sorta stuff loads and she is demonstrably right because her way of doing things gets good results. A lot of it is also down to marketing academic skill as practical ones, especially for grad roles. Again, universities are not good at showing people how to do this, and most graduates are spectacularly bad at writing good CVs and cover letters.

So yes, I agree with you that loads of people are at uni who shouldn't be, people do focus on the wrong things. But I think a lot of it is really down to a) poor decision making when on courses, and b) poor investment in people by the universities themselves. They don't show you to how to make the best use of the skills you do have.

OP it's a sad state of affairs but maybe you needed to be doing more whilst at university to develop those other skills. I have no real connections and have the same levels of qualifications as you (well, and a PGCE and PGCHE), but I get work just fine.

It is bonkers to me that people still think just being 'clever' will sort you out. Well, this is actually a pretty daft position, because the really smart ones take the time to round their other skills too.

Also, 'Russell', not 'Russel'.
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
The fundamental problem with all of this is that university teaches you academic skills whereas most people attend because they think that university will get them a better job. The two cannot match up.


So true, there are other routes into jobs like apprenticeships that don't involve university (for the majority of job areas anyway, obviously there are exceptions) that are actually better in terms of employability in some cases. You should only go to university if you are genuinely interested in the course and believe you will enjoy it imo
Original post by gradgirl123
Spot on. I was at an AC for a consultancy, and got talking to the other candidates. One guy there studied Mechanical Engineering, and had just finished his PhD. In his spare time, he was working on a prototype of an advanced radiation machine. Extremely, extremely intelligent guy, but was struggling to find a job. I was shocked. He got the job in the end and I was so happy for him.

Since I've seen his success with it, I would recommend trying consultancy roles, or analytical research roles - especially opportunities that are grad JOBS rather than grad schemes, as they tend to care less about you potentially being "overqualified". Websites like Graduate Recruitment Bureau and Gradcracker are good places to look. I wouldn't sell yourself short and waste time in admin roles, unless its relevant to your career path. Although I know it's easier said than done. Good luck going forward!


Many thanks for your recommendations will defo check it out!
Original post by gjd800
They can, it's just that most places are incredibly bad at doing a good job of it. And this is true across the country, in my experience. A few places can do a good job of it - hidden gems. Jackie Carter at Manc has written about this sorta stuff loads and she is demonstrably right because her way of doing things gets good results. A lot of it is also down to marketing academic skill as practical ones, especially for grad roles. Again, universities are not good at showing people how to do this, and most graduates are spectacularly bad at writing good CVs and cover letters.

So yes, I agree with you that loads of people are at uni who shouldn't be, people do focus on the wrong things. But I think a lot of it is really down to a) poor decision making when on courses, and b) poor investment in people by the universities themselves. They don't show you to how to make the best use of the skills you do have.

OP it's a sad state of affairs but maybe you needed to be doing more whilst at university to develop those other skills. I have no real connections and have the same levels of qualifications as you (well, and a PGCE and PGCHE), but I get work just fine.

It is bonkers to me that people still think just being 'clever' will sort you out. Well, this is actually a pretty daft position, because the really smart ones take the time to round their other skills too.

Also, 'Russell', not 'Russel'.


Indeed, the gift of hindsight.

Fair enough, I shall correct my autocorrect.
Original post by CoolCavy

Too many people have degrees and too many people are at university when they honestly probably shouldn't be.


It's the proliferation of low-quality universities, many of which used to be polytechnics (nothing was wrong with those btw!), with low entrance requirements.
Original post by Failedlawyer33
It's the proliferation of low-quality universities, many of which used to be polytechnics (nothing was wrong with those btw!), with low entrance requirements.

Wrong - students at the newer unis often do a year in industry and get the jobs. It's the RG uni students with no work experience that are struggling.
Original post by Secretariat123
I have a PhD from a Russel group uni, a distinction in my master’s, a first class joint honours too.

No one cares.

I am as unemployed as it gets, hoping to get an admin job but I even got rejected for that (I think because my examples were not very admin related).

Point is, as interested as you are in a potential PhD topic, know that if its not in sciences chances are it won't lead to a job. Employers love skills, and that's from experience and not from how intelligent you are.

😞

This speaks volumes about the quality and utility of education which a lot of people actually receive in university.

If many employers aren't even interested... what is the point? What the use in all this academic stuff? £50,000 of debt just to get rejected.

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