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    (Original post by Mad Caddie)
    Isn't kellywood the exact type of person you are venting your anger at as she is doing a "mickey mouse" course?
    I take it you mean sociology? I won't get into a debate about whether sociology is 'mickey mouse' or not as it's been done a million times before and isn't really the issue here, but I don't think you can call my other subjects 'mickey mouse'. Doing 3 'proper' A-levels and 1 'mickey mouse' shouldn't matter since most people only do 3 anyway. The people we we're 'venting our anger at' are the people who doss about in lessons, do hardly any work, get crap grades and yet still get EMA when they don't deserve to. Why should the government waste a perfectly good £10/20/30 a week plus £500 in bonuses on some waster who's only going to sixth form/college because he/she can't be bothered to get a job? If you're doing A-levels or a recognised vocational alternative such as AVCEs, you go to all lessons unless you have a very good reason not to, you do all work and homework on time and you get Cs and above, you should get EMA, otherwise you shouldn't
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    (Original post by kellywood_5)
    I take it you mean sociology? I won't get into a debate about whether sociology is 'mickey mouse' or not as it's been done a million times before and isn't really the issue here, but I don't think you can call my other subjects 'mickey mouse'. Doing 3 'proper' A-levels and 1 'mickey mouse' shouldn't matter since most people only do 3 anyway. The people we we're 'venting our anger at' are the people who doss about in lessons, do hardly any work, get crap grades and yet still get EMA when they don't deserve to. Why should the government waste a perfectly good £10/20/30 a week plus £500 in bonuses on some waster who's only going to sixth form/college because he/she can't be bothered to get a job? If you're doing A-levels or a recognised vocational alternative such as AVCEs, you go to all lessons unless you have a very good reason not to, you do all work and homework on time and you get Cs and above, you should get EMA, otherwise you shouldn't
    Let is take an example of a student who isn;'t particularly bright but manages to DDE at a-level and they work hard to achieve that. Do you believe that we should not give them money?
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    (Original post by corey)
    Let is take an example of a student who isn;'t particularly bright but manages to DDE at a-level and they work hard to achieve that. Do you believe that we should not give them money?
    I'm actually not too sure.....I mean, I'd have much more admiration for someone who worked their *** off and got DDE than someone who did nothing and got CCC, but unfortunately there are so many people doing A-levels and getting good grades that someone getting DDE is just not going to have great opportunities at the end of it. I'm going to be harsh but realistic and say that someone who is 'not particularly bright' should probably not bother doing A-levels in the first place and would be better off considering one of the other options (although I admit the 'other options' available at the moment are very poor and that really needs to be addressed).
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    (Original post by kellywood_5)
    I'm actually not too sure.....I mean, I'd have much more admiration for someone who worked their *** off and got DDE than someone who did nothing and got CCC, but unfortunately there are so many people doing A-levels and getting good grades that someone getting DDE is just not going to have great opportunities at the end of it. I'm going to be harsh but realistic and say that someone who is 'not particularly bright' should probably not bother doing A-levels in the first place and would be better off considering one of the other options (although I admit the 'other options' available at the moment are very poor and that really needs to be addressed).
    Thats why the EMA money should go to modern apprentiships and improving libraries so people like Gaz dont have to buy text books.
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    (Original post by frost105)
    Thats why the EMA money should go to modern apprentiships and improving libraries so people like Gaz dont have to buy text books.
    While I agree that there needs to be funding for these areas, I also think the EMA is a good idea in principle, but as the thread starter suggested, it needs to be improved so it's not taken advantage of. If it was more strictly monitored and was only given to those students who truly deserved it, a lot of money would be saved and that could be used to fund modern apprenticeships and libraries.
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    (Original post by kellywood_5)
    While I agree that there needs to be funding for these areas, I also think the EMA is a good idea in principle, but as the thread starter suggested, it needs to be improved so it's not taken advantage of. If it was more strictly monitored and was only given to those students who truly deserved it, a lot of money would be saved and that could be used to fund modern apprenticeships and libraries.
    I think its a waste.Students who really want to achieve in their education will be doing it for the goal not the cash. If they need the money they should get a job or just have to learn to go without just like the students before them.
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    Let is take an example of a student who isn;'t particularly bright but manages to DDE at a-level and they work hard to achieve that. Do you believe that we should not give them money?
    No. The DDE they achieved isn't going to help anyone. It won't significantly improve their job prospects, enable them to fulfill an important role in society or allow them into a decent higher course.
    Do you find the opinion that only high achievers should be funded to be elitist? That's where the article comes in. If so, why is it okay to fund the best in sport yet not in academia?
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    (Original post by kellywood_5)
    I take it you mean sociology? I won't get into a debate about whether sociology is 'mickey mouse' or not as it's been done a million times before and isn't really the issue here, but I don't think you can call my other subjects 'mickey mouse'. Doing 3 'proper' A-levels and 1 'mickey mouse' shouldn't matter since most people only do 3 anyway. The people we we're 'venting our anger at' are the people who doss about in lessons, do hardly any work, get crap grades and yet still get EMA when they don't deserve to. Why should the government waste a perfectly good £10/20/30 a week plus £500 in bonuses on some waster who's only going to sixth form/college because he/she can't be bothered to get a job? If you're doing A-levels or a recognised vocational alternative such as AVCEs, you go to all lessons unless you have a very good reason not to, you do all work and homework on time and you get Cs and above, you should get EMA, otherwise you shouldn't
    I don't think any subjects, within reason, should be deemed "mickey-mouse", something you will have noticed if you had read my posts. I was simply referring to the fact that Gaz031 obviously has a problem with "mickey-mouse" courses, and find people who study them, a waste of tax payers money. Yet he went on to say, "I can identify with many of those thoughts...". I was simply making the point that, how can he agree with you if he deems one of your chosen subjects to be "mickey-mouse", something Sociology is seen as.

    Also, you seem to be under the assumption that there is widespread failure of the EMA system, this is not true. You also appear to think that all/most EMA claimants are "dossing" about. You must acknowledge the the majority DO NOT. Almost all turn up to lessons and do the work, at least from what I've seen and know, obviously there will be exceptions.
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    (Original post by Gaz031)
    The point i'm trying to drive home is that in its present state EMA is bringing lazy people into the system, who either do pathetically easy qualifications or don't put the effort in and get mediocre grades. Them staying at sixth form for the money does nobody any good at all.
    Yes, the present system does this, but only to a certain extent. What the present system also does is entice more people into continuing into higher and then further education. This allows more and more generations of the population to have more qualifications and, a greater variety of qualifications given the choices of A Levels, AVCE's etc. This society, which will clearly be more educated than those that do not have these attributes, will boost the economy. I acknowledge that some people will abuse this, but MOST WILL NOT!

    (Original post by Gaz031)
    Obviously they're going to say the workload is difficult, as that will seem difficult relative to them. They won't have been working until 1AM learning P5 etc. Just because the degree is officially recognised doesn't mean employers regard it similarly.
    Who are you to say the workload isn't difficult. I'm a science student myself, and I find science fairly easy if I apply myself. If I was to go and study say, art, I can probably guarantee that I would find it difficult. Why? Because people have different areas in which they excel and which they don't. If we go by your logic, than does that mean that any subjects deemed "mickey-mouse" are easily studied by all, I think not. Also, who are you to know and judge the amount of time and effort a person puts into their work. You don't know, so you can't critisise.

    Also, in terms of the degree, you are confusing whether a degree will be worthwhile studying and its credibility to employers. Statistics show that graduates have a 70% more chance of getting a higher paid job, and better standard of life etc. This means your argument is flawed.

    (Original post by Gaz031)
    The criteria means nothing and the whole thing needs to be tweaked. Students get their EMA regardless of their effort, behaviour or attendance.
    Well, they are not supposed to and this is then a result of poor management in the schools. This is not an issue of the EMA and its purpose or effect.
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    (Original post by frost105)
    I think its a waste.Students who really want to achieve in their education will be doing it for the goal not the cash. If they need the money they should get a job or just have to learn to go without just like the students before them.
    Yes, I do it for the goal and not the cash, and this is probably true of most people. But the EMA definitely helps because books and stationery are quite expensive, and I'm also trying to save up for uni. If I had to get a job, I wouldn't have as much time to get all my work done and my grades might suffer as a result. Just because the students before me didn't get EMA doesn't mean I shouldn't, especially since the students before didn't have to pay top-up fees and I will. The money I get from EMA will help make up for that.
 
 
 
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