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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    The law's interdiction of sexual intercourse between minors who have not yet obtained the age of sixteen does not in any way protect them from 'being taken advantage of';
    the law recognises that 16 is an age where decisions involving sex are likey to have a more significant basis than that of a younger person. whether or not people adhere to the law isn't indicative of the reasons for its establishment. on what basis to you suggest it doesn't deter some people from being taken advantage of? statutory rape, i'm sure, is a valid deterrent for many over-16s considering pre-16 sex.

    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    with respect to nonconsensual sex, that is unlawful under any circumstances; with respect to their psychogenic constitution, as it were, they do not become more 'psychologically equipped' to deal with a particular action because of the existence of a law, nor does the law itself, as statistics on teenage pregnancy testify, serve in any way to undermine or limit the will of others to have sex with minors under sixteen.
    of course people don't become more 'psychologically equipped' because of the existence of a law, they become so because of adolescent biology. IMO, the law serves to recognise the completion of such. the issue discussed isn't a matter of recognising compliance with the law, but realising why 16 is an important average figure.
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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    Most of the posts on this thread really are such rot. Any psychological repercussions someone in need_money's state incurs as a result of sex at a comparatively young age by Western standards are, I daresay, more to do with the censorious, selfrighteous attitude of society towards her acts, than with any moral principle or imperative obtaining in the act itself. I fail to see what precisely society gains from criminalizing the most natural of impulses, and vilifying anyone who contravenes its arbitrary standards of morality as a 'slut', or '*****', or whatever. Surely any enlightened society would recognize the ineluctability of pubescent sexual behavior, and respond rather more sensibly.
    It's not by pointing out that in other societies, certain sexual behaviours that we consider against morality, are tolerated, that you're proving anything.
    The society in which you're raised defines who you are. It's all nice and pretty to imagine that as people, we are our own men, and we can do whatever we feel like, that noone can pigeon-hole us, stick us into a category. But that's just politically-correct *******s.
    Among the Sambians of New Guinea, young boys are brought up by being forced to give oral sex to older men, in order to have a proper puberty.
    Do you think that these habits, because they're standard in one society can be applied to ours. Why do you think so many pornstars end up committing suicide? Because as human beings, in a Western Society, very few of us are emotionally equipped to deal with such habits.
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    (Original post by technik)
    dude, stop talking trash. you have a cut off point or none at all. where would you have it? 10 years old? most girls start getting periods about 11 or 12 so its obviously fair game then? totally wrong. its 16 for many reasons, not totally restricted to biology.

    edit : using big words wont win you arguments here. not everyone would be put off questioning you just because you have a fancy dictionary full of words like interdiction

    I generally find that the bigness of a word is inversely proportional to the intelligence of its auditor. Frankly I'm not using big words, I'm not plowing through a thesaurus, or racking my brain for the most erudite and obscure way to put something, those just happen to be the words that come naturally, if you think that's an attempt to scare off would-be questioners, get over it.

    I was going to respond to your post substantially, but you posted nothing of substance; your argument basically was 'I disagree; I think there has to be an arbitrary limit; that limit should be sixteen, but I won't say why'. Well, frankly, that's crap. For the sake of playing advocatus diaboli, I'll say there should be no limit, consensuality being the only limit (and that being determined by the legal age for the presumption of knowledge between good and evil, or right and wrong, as it were); and it being for a lawfully constitued tribunal to adjudicate on matters refered to them, taking into account the capacity of the "victim" for informed judgment.
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    (Original post by technik)
    me too. notice how the ones who dont are more likely to end up sponging off society before they've even finished their GCSEs
    Yeah... I think its very reasonable us condemning people like need_money... my taxes are going to be paying for the illegitimate children that people like that have.
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    (Original post by SamTheMan)
    It's not by pointing out that in other societies, certain sexual behaviours that we consider against morality, are tolerated, that you're proving anything.
    The society in which you're raised defines who you are. It's all nice and pretty to imagine that as people, we are our own men, and we can do whatever we feel like, that noone can pigeon-hole us, stick us into a category. But that's just politically-correct *******s.
    Among the Sambians of New Guinea, young boys are brought up by being forced to give oral sex to older men, in order to have a proper puberty.
    Do you think that these habits, because they're standard in one society can be applied to ours. Why do you think so many pornstars end up committing suicide? Because as human beings, in a Western Society, very few of us are emotionally equipped to deal with such habits.
    Maybe people who go into porn are predisposed to commit suicide anyway rather than the porn that causes it.
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    (Original post by Luize)
    So would you expect a 11/12 year old to know what to happen and be able to stay calm if a condom split?
    LOL, thats such a stupid stupid thing to say.

    If I was having sex with a random girl and the condom split, a few things would go through my mind, such as

    '****, I didnt get to ***'
    'Bugger, I could have a multitude of diseases now'
    'I could have a mini-me in 9 months time'

    Stay calm? There is nothing you can do at that stage, the damage has been done, and I dont see how at 11/12 it would be any different.
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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    I generally find that the bigness of a word is inversely proportional to the intelligence of its auditor. Frankly I'm not using big words, I'm not plowing through a thesaurus, or racking my brain for the most erudite and obscure way to put something, those just happen to be the words that come naturally, if you think that's an attempt to scare off would-be questioners, get over it.

    I was going to respond to your post substantially, but you posted nothing of substance; your argument basically was 'I disagree; I think there has to be an arbitrary limit; that limit should be sixteen, but I won't say why'. Well, frankly, that's crap. For the sake of playing advocatus diaboli, I'll say there should be no limit, consensuality being the only limit (and that being determined by the legal age for the presumption of knowledge between good and evil, or right and wrong, as it were); and it being for a lawfully constitued tribunal to adjudicate on matters refered to them, taking into account the capacity of the "victim" for informed judgment.

    Right, you say there should be no limit?

    Imagin how many teenagers would have kids? The UK already has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in eroup

    and on that note Walsall has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in the UK, and theres where i am!
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    (Original post by SamTheMan)
    It's not by pointing out that in other societies, certain sexual behaviours that we consider against morality, are tolerated, that you're proving anything.
    The society in which you're raised defines who you are. It's all nice and pretty to imagine that as people, we are our own men, and we can do whatever we feel like, that noone can pigeon-hole us, stick us into a category. But that's just politically-correct *******s.
    Among the Sambians of New Guinea, young boys are brought up by being forced to give oral sex to older men, in order to have a proper puberty.
    Do you think that these habits, because they're standard in one society can be applied to ours. Why do you think so many pornstars end up committing suicide? Because as human beings, in a Western Society, very few of us are emotionally equipped to deal with such habits.

    1. I didn't mention other societies: canard.
    2. I'm not a social determinist, so that doesn't wash; (and, of course, that is no argument against my point, which is essentially that society as constituted in this respect is wrong, and should be changed).
    3. I have no objection to the erastos system.
    4. The pornstars argument is a canard, although, ironically, it confirms my argument; it is nothing to do with psychological or emotional maturity, or the imagined degrading effects of pornography, but social judgment.
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    (Original post by puppy)
    Why does sex have to involve any emotional/psychological involvement anyway, it's a physical act? We're all "ready" to play sports when we're 14, we're all "ready" to have fun, we're all "ready" to masturbate (and thus think of ourselves and others sexually)- put it all together and we're "ready" for sex.
    Masturbation and sports are unlikely to have an end-result of bringing a baby into this world. That is, unless there's a game I haven't heard of yet.
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    (Original post by BhArJ)
    Right, you say there should be no limit?

    Imagin how many teenagers would have kids? The UK already has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in eroup

    and on that note Walsall has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in the UK, and theres where i am!

    What an irony, other societies have lower age limits for consent, and lower rates of teenaged pregnancy; surely, if one were being logical about this, one would concede that perhaps social factors, and not the law, were the issue.

    Give me strength.
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    (Original post by timeofyourlife)
    Masturbation and sports are unlikely to have an end-result of bringing a baby into this world. That is, unless there's a game I haven't heard of yet.
    Hasn't helen told you yet:eek:?:p:
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    (Original post by puppy)
    Why presume couples have sex when the guy wants to? Girls actually want sex sometimes, it's not for the guy to "trick" her.
    I was talking about a girlfriend/boyfriend relationship. A lot of girls only wish to have sex with a guy, once they get the impression that the guy sees her as more than just an easy lay, that he's interested in her personality too.
    It's no wonder that so many girls who are easy feel like ****...
    Some people don't even understand their own emotions properly.
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    (Original post by BhArJ)
    Right, you say there should be no limit?

    Imagin how many teenagers would have kids? The UK already has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in eroup

    and on that note Walsall has the highest teenage pregnancy rate in the UK, and theres where i am!

    Very true, and the law hasn't stopped that so what does that tell you?
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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    What an irony, other societies have lower age limits for consent, and lower rates of teenaged pregnancy; surely, if one were being logical about this, one would concede that perhaps social factors, and not the law, were the issue.

    Give me strength.
    Yup

    E.g. "Chav culture" which seems to be growing around the UK
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    (Original post by puppy)
    Very true, and the law hasn't stopped that so what does that tell you?

    It HAS stoped some people, but more and more people are starting to ignor it.
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    (Original post by Yossarian)
    Am I alone in being unfamiliar with this over emphasis on the psycologically element in what fundamentally is a physical action involving the simple exchange of bodily fluids?
    Yeh I think the same pretty much
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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    I generally find that the bigness of a word is inversely proportional to the intelligence of its auditor. Frankly I'm not using big words, I'm not plowing through a thesaurus, or racking my brain for the most erudite and obscure way to put something, those just happen to be the words that come naturally, if you think that's an attempt to scare off would-be questioners, get over it.

    I was going to respond to your post substantially, but you posted nothing of substance; your argument basically was 'I disagree; I think there has to be an arbitrary limit; that limit should be sixteen, but I won't say why'. Well, frankly, that's crap. For the sake of playing advocatus diaboli, I'll say there should be no limit, consensuality being the only limit (and that being determined by the legal age for the presumption of knowledge between good and evil, or right and wrong, as it were); and it being for a lawfully constitued tribunal to adjudicate on matters refered to them, taking into account the capacity of the "victim" for informed judgment.
    i just tend to think you are actually doing that. finding the most obscure way to say something so the actual meaning (if there was one) isnt there. if you have a point, keep it just that - to the point. dont bubble wrap it fancy lingo, or else the majority of what you try to say will be lost on most people.

    also...hopefully you'll learn to read the thread in its entirity
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    (Original post by BhArJ)
    It HAS stoped some people, but more and more people are starting to ignor it.
    Any basis for that?
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    (Original post by svidrigailov)
    ], but you posted nothing of substance; your argument basically was 'I disagree; I think there has to be an arbitrary limit; that limit should be sixteen, but I won't say why'.
    ....
    (Original post by timeofyourlife)
    Obviously different people develop at different rates, so we have to consider averages when looking at adolescence and establishment of sexual identity. Hormonal changes start to settle down around the 15-17 age group which leads child psychologists to believe this is the age when a full appreciation of the emotive aspects of sex can occur.
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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    Yeh I think the same pretty much
    Wow, we should start a club.
 
 
 
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