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A-level Classical Civilisation Study Group 2023-2024

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Reply 60

Original post
by chappers1234
any predictions for this year, WofTH, Greek religion and Greek theatre?

Wondering the same for WoTH, Greek religion & imperial image 🤔🤔🤔

Reply 61

Original post
by Pwca
:hello: Welcome to the A-level Classical Civilisation Study Group! :hello:

This is where you can chat with other students studying the same subjects as you and support each other as you head towards your exams :grouphugs:
You can post any useful tips and resources that you come across, offer support to others, share your successes, or just have moan when it gets tough! :yes:
Just remember, it’s against the site rules to ask for or offer any copyrighted papers, or to take conversations off-site to do these things. Posts that break these rules will be removed.
A few possible ice breaker questions are:
What exam board are you with?
What do you enjoy most about this subject/ course?
What area do you struggle with in this subject/ course?
Good luck with the next few months. Remember, ask for help, support where you can and together we can do this! :yeah:

Hi!
I do Greek theatre, Love and Realationships and The Odyssey/Aneid
I've nearly finished Greek theatre and The Odyssey. My Mocks are this week and im hoping for the best!
I studied Classics at GCSE last year and loved it!
I'm mainly looking at drama schools next year but my main back-up is Classical Archeology and Ancient History at Oxford. Then Classics/Ancient History at any other univeristy!
What is everyone elses plans after a-levels?

Reply 62

Do we think it is possible they would repeat a vase from a previous year for Greek Theatre? (trying to avoid revising all of them)

Reply 63

Original post
by swift513
Do we think it is possible they would repeat a vase from a previous year for Greek Theatre? (trying to avoid revising all of them)

since there is quite a few they haven't done yet I think probably not? especially considering the questions about them seem to always be pretty similar

Reply 64

Anyone have any idea for world of the hero exam on Tuesday and also any help on how to structure answers for 10, 20 and 30 markets, is it just like point evidence explain paragraphs ? 🙂

Reply 65

Original post
by Hogwarts14
Anyone have any idea for world of the hero exam on Tuesday and also any help on how to structure answers for 10, 20 and 30 markets, is it just like point evidence explain paragraphs ? 🙂

10 markers

I always try and make 6 points, so 6 mini paragraphs to make this clear to the examiner

basically don't waffle, just drop the quote and explain why it makes the passage vivid/dramatic or whatever

for 10 markers since u just need to hit the spec points do it quickly and without flair


20 markers

I do like a sentence ish introduction basically explaining why the topic is important, or establishing whether I agree or not with the statement

I usually do 2 or 3 paragraphs under key headings/topic sentences > make 2/3 points and then fill it up with evidence and close analysis

one or two line conclusion again just evaluating the question, explaining why you agree/disagree etc


30 markers

longer introduction to establish the over arching argument you are reaching for. since I always do the Aeneid question adding some context or background about major scholarly debates abt the topic

3 points > make the point, quote a scholar and then use the evidence in the rest of the para to prove your point and the scholar quote

longer conclusion summarising and evaluating your argument. try to extend it if you can, talk about Virgils intentions etc


hope this helps!

Reply 66

good luck to everyone on tuesday

Reply 67

Original post
by cinmnsoul
10 markers

I always try and make 6 points, so 6 mini paragraphs to make this clear to the examiner

basically don't waffle, just drop the quote and explain why it makes the passage vivid/dramatic or whatever

for 10 markers since u just need to hit the spec points do it quickly and without flair


20 markers

I do like a sentence ish introduction basically explaining why the topic is important, or establishing whether I agree or not with the statement

I usually do 2 or 3 paragraphs under key headings/topic sentences > make 2/3 points and then fill it up with evidence and close analysis

one or two line conclusion again just evaluating the question, explaining why you agree/disagree etc


30 markers

longer introduction to establish the over arching argument you are reaching for. since I always do the Aeneid question adding some context or background about major scholarly debates abt the topic

3 points > make the point, quote a scholar and then use the evidence in the rest of the para to prove your point and the scholar quote

longer conclusion summarising and evaluating your argument. try to extend it if you can, talk about Virgils intentions etc


hope this helps!
Thank you so much, I only started classics in year 12, as in I hadn’t even heard of it before, so I still find it quite confusing :smile:.

Thank you again !!

Reply 68

hey do people have any predictions on what the ody / aen hero paper questions could be on? Im kinda stressing :frown:

Reply 69

Original post
by hfern22
hey do people have any predictions on what the ody / aen hero paper questions could be on? Im kinda stressing :frown:
Slaves or recognition for odyssey ?

Reply 70

Original post
by Sandyfish
Hello!! I'm in year 13 studying (OCR) Greek theater, World of the hero and Politics of the late Roman Republic.
Does anyone have any advice on how to revise for the Greek theater visual sources. I always feel overwhelmed with the detail we seem to be expected to know them in.

Hi :smile:
(I have no clue if someone may have already said this as this thread has become quite long by the time I've gotten here and I have not looked through every message)
My class are all firm believers in flashcards, and what we did is printed off each source and just made our own with the key points on the back. There may also be a chance they are already on Quizlet. But, I agree, the detail they seem to want us to know is a lot.

Reply 71

Original post
by hfern22
hey do people have any predictions on what the ody / aen hero paper questions could be on? Im kinda stressing :frown:

Looking at past papers, Pietas/Duty hasn't come up in a while (since the syllabus change at least) for the Aeneid, but nor have a few others. My teacher thinks there's a high chance it will come up, but obviously don't purely rely on that.
With the Odyssey, they have had women two years in a row (21 it was a 30 mk, 22 it was a 20) so there's a low chance that would appear again.
I'm also starting to freak out at this point.

Reply 72

anyone have a plan for a societies 20 marker for the odyssey/ aeneid? that would be my nightmare question

Reply 73

Hi guys, just a question
I'm studying the aeneid and iliad and have my exam on Tuesday, but I'm really struggling to remember modern scholarship

Any advice?

Reply 74

Original post
by Sademct
Hi guys, just a question
I'm studying the aeneid and iliad and have my exam on Tuesday, but I'm really struggling to remember modern scholarship
Any advice?

brute force it through quizlets/anki is what i'm doing - every day i do a typed answer set of anki notes on scholars where i write their name and what they said

make sure the scholars you have are as broad as possible e.g. beard saying that 'there hasn't been a day since 19 bce where someone in the world has not been reading the aeneid' can be used in every essay in the propaganda point, or servius writing that vergil wrote the aeneid 'to praise augustus', mendelsohn calling aeneas a 'cold fish' for his characterisation, etc

Reply 75

Original post
by alecks
brute force it through quizlets/anki is what i'm doing - every day i do a typed answer set of anki notes on scholars where i write their name and what they said
make sure the scholars you have are as broad as possible e.g. beard saying that 'there hasn't been a day since 19 bce where someone in the world has not been reading the aeneid' can be used in every essay in the propaganda point, or servius writing that vergil wrote the aeneid 'to praise augustus', mendelsohn calling aeneas a 'cold fish' for his characterisation, etc

Thank you, all of them are pretty broad with a few specific ones.
I think I'm panicking a bit because I have English tomorrow too 😓
Praying it goes well, just have to keep pushing. Goodluck for you as well!

Reply 76

Original post
by nabihaaa
anyone have a plan for a societies 20 marker for the odyssey/ aeneid? that would be my nightmare question

Don't worry, there's plenty to say for these! Keep in mind that you'll also have an extract from the 10 mark, which, if it's a particularly good extract, can make up one of your paragraphs. You'll only really need 3 solid, well explained points for a 20.

For the Odyssey, here are some points to mention:

Social structure - Monarchy, with a king leading each city or nation. You can give examples of Nestor and Menelaus as good kings. You could also say that Odysseus' absence as King has brought disorder to Ithaca. As evidence, I'd focus on the assembly in Bk2. From this, you could make a separate point about democracy being important to the greeks.

Civilised/uncivilised societies - The Laestrygonians and Cyclopes are good examples of people from lawless scoieties who don't care about the gods and important customs such as xenia. Odysseus often repeats the phrase 'god-fearing people or lawless savages' on his journey; this emphasises how important the gods were, as those who didn't worship them were viewed as immoral monsters.

Slaves and household workers - You can speak on loyal and disloyal slaves, there are examples of both. Eumaeus and Philoetius juxtaposed against Melantho and Melanthius with treatment of beggar Odysseus. I'd also include the fact that the punishment of the unfaithful maids and Melanthius is much more extreme than the punishment for the suitors. The maids are hanged like dead doves, and Melanthius is butchered and fed to dogs. This is arguably a comment on just how atrocious it was to be disloyal to your master, suggesting that it justified these punishments.

Hero culture and bards - Odysseus' very open praise of Demodocus is your strongest piece of evidence here- he openly states that he values bards the most, above all men. Their ability to tell stories is really necessary for Kleos, which ancient heroes depended on.

The dead/afterlife - There were very specific rituals surrounding the dead and the process of moving into the afterlife. Main point would be Elpenor, he begs Odysseus to give him a proper burial. Odysseus does this without a second thought. The general portrayal of the underworld is also consistent with beliefs of the time; the fact that spirits crave life (blood) and are cold spectres. The underworld is full of misery, Achilles would rather be essentially a nobody and live again than be a king amongst the dead.

Religious rituals - Abundance of examples of these, but the amount of them through the whole epic show how much religion was a part of everyday life. My chosen examples would be Nestor's sacrifices in Bk3 and how he invites Telemachus and Mentor to join, the improper sacrifice (using water instead of wine + oak leaves instead of white barley) carried out by Odysseus' men on the Thrinacie as an example of how there were ways to conduct sacrifices. I'd also mention Odysseus' cleansing of his home at the end of Bk22 using sulphur to remove religious pollution.

Women - I'd keep this point brief because it's easy to get carried away, but you can talk about the gender roles in ancient society, shown through the number of times women are seen carrying out domestic tasks such as weaving (Helen, Penelope, even Calypso) and washing clothes (Nausicaa). There's also an expectation of modesty and loyalty to husbands. Helen refers to herself as a 'shameful creature' for being blinded by love, and Agamemnon spends a long time rebuking women as a whole for being unfaithful in Bk11. Penelope is a good example of a model woman; she delays remarrying with deceit, veils herself in front of the suitors and often weeps for Odysseus.


The Aeneid (most points will consider Rome and the context):

Attitudes towards war - The Aeneid in general is quite anti-war, it's portrayed very negatively because it's main purpose is glorifying Augustus, who famously shut the Gates of Janus and brought peace (Pax) to Rome. For this point, you can mention Jupiter's prophecy that the gates of war will be closed. You could also discuss how war is shown negatively through the death of youths in the epic, and how hard Aeneas tries to avoid it. He begins offerings of peace and attempts to become allies with the Latins almost immediately after arriving in Italy.

Furor vs Severitas - Furor is very much a heroic-age virtue, and it's definitely discouraged/presented as inferior to severitas in the epic. It's something that Augustus really pushed as a Roman virtue, examples would be the simile of a single man quieting an angry, furor-driven crowd as Neptune flattens the sea. Also, Aeneas breaking out of his state of furor at the death of Lausus and honouring him for his sacrifice compared to Turnus' gloating over Pallas. This also brings up the idea of clemency, a quality that's really strongly attributed to Julius Caesar through his forgiveness of Pompey, and willingness to pardon those who asked for mercy. Anything anti-furor in the epic shows that Rome had it's own celebrated virtues and focused a lot more on rationality. If you do the L&R module, you can drop in a reference to stoicism 🙂

Pietas, particularly father/son relationships - Massive massive part of Roman culture, the bond between father and son was really important. There was an expectation for fathers to nurture and teach sons, and in return, a son would take care of his father when he was no longer able to take care of himself. Aeneas and Anchises are the biggest example, you have Aeneas totally unwilling to leave his father behind at Troy, putting on his armour to go back out and fight. He also carries him as they flee, which again shows his responsibility to take care of his father. You can also speak about Aeneas and Ascanius, without Ascanius, Aeneas' fatherly love 'allowed him no rest' without his son. Of course you have other examples in Pallas/Evander, Mezentius/Lausus.

Women - This point would focus on the portrayal of women within the epic, and how that relates to Augustus' views and demands of Roman women. You can mention the Julian laws and focus on the role of women as mothers and not adulterers driven by lust. Dido is infected by love, though not her own fault, she neglects Carthage and prevents the city from functioning. Creusa and Lavinia would be examples of moral women

Gods/Religion - As with the Odyssey, you can address the importance of the Gods to the epic and also Roman society. You could mention in particular the household Gods, including Hestia/Vesta passed to Aeneas by Hector in Bk2, as they have a much greater role in Roman society than Greek.

The underworld/death - Again similar to the Odyssey, the Aeneid shows the culture surrounding death and burial in society. Dido's suicide stands out, though the act of her suicide would have been quite divisive (honourable or not), you can argue that it aids her misery in the Fields of Mourning in the underworld/Virgil warns against it. Aeneas sees Tartarus, but also Elysium, a paradise for heroes after death. From this, you can also address the process of purifying/cleansing souls to be reborn again through Anchises showing Aeneas future Romans.


Hope this is helpful! Any of these can also be used for other questions that are more specific 🥰

Reply 77

Original post
by ladydracula
Don't worry, there's plenty to say for these! Keep in mind that you'll also have an extract from the 10 mark, which, if it's a particularly good extract, can make up one of your paragraphs. You'll only really need 3 solid, well explained points for a 20.
For the Odyssey, here are some points to mention:

Social structure - Monarchy, with a king leading each city or nation. You can give examples of Nestor and Menelaus as good kings. You could also say that Odysseus' absence as King has brought disorder to Ithaca. As evidence, I'd focus on the assembly in Bk2. From this, you could make a separate point about democracy being important to the greeks.

Civilised/uncivilised societies - The Laestrygonians and Cyclopes are good examples of people from lawless scoieties who don't care about the gods and important customs such as xenia. Odysseus often repeats the phrase 'god-fearing people or lawless savages' on his journey; this emphasises how important the gods were, as those who didn't worship them were viewed as immoral monsters.

Slaves and household workers - You can speak on loyal and disloyal slaves, there are examples of both. Eumaeus and Philoetius juxtaposed against Melantho and Melanthius with treatment of beggar Odysseus. I'd also include the fact that the punishment of the unfaithful maids and Melanthius is much more extreme than the punishment for the suitors. The maids are hanged like dead doves, and Melanthius is butchered and fed to dogs. This is arguably a comment on just how atrocious it was to be disloyal to your master, suggesting that it justified these punishments.

Hero culture and bards - Odysseus' very open praise of Demodocus is your strongest piece of evidence here- he openly states that he values bards the most, above all men. Their ability to tell stories is really necessary for Kleos, which ancient heroes depended on.

The dead/afterlife - There were very specific rituals surrounding the dead and the process of moving into the afterlife. Main point would be Elpenor, he begs Odysseus to give him a proper burial. Odysseus does this without a second thought. The general portrayal of the underworld is also consistent with beliefs of the time; the fact that spirits crave life (blood) and are cold spectres. The underworld is full of misery, Achilles would rather be essentially a nobody and live again than be a king amongst the dead.

Religious rituals - Abundance of examples of these, but the amount of them through the whole epic show how much religion was a part of everyday life. My chosen examples would be Nestor's sacrifices in Bk3 and how he invites Telemachus and Mentor to join, the improper sacrifice (using water instead of wine + oak leaves instead of white barley) carried out by Odysseus' men on the Thrinacie as an example of how there were ways to conduct sacrifices. I'd also mention Odysseus' cleansing of his home at the end of Bk22 using sulphur to remove religious pollution.

Women - I'd keep this point brief because it's easy to get carried away, but you can talk about the gender roles in ancient society, shown through the number of times women are seen carrying out domestic tasks such as weaving (Helen, Penelope, even Calypso) and washing clothes (Nausicaa). There's also an expectation of modesty and loyalty to husbands. Helen refers to herself as a 'shameful creature' for being blinded by love, and Agamemnon spends a long time rebuking women as a whole for being unfaithful in Bk11. Penelope is a good example of a model woman; she delays remarrying with deceit, veils herself in front of the suitors and often weeps for Odysseus.


The Aeneid (most points will consider Rome and the context):

Attitudes towards war - The Aeneid in general is quite anti-war, it's portrayed very negatively because it's main purpose is glorifying Augustus, who famously shut the Gates of Janus and brought peace (Pax) to Rome. For this point, you can mention Jupiter's prophecy that the gates of war will be closed. You could also discuss how war is shown negatively through the death of youths in the epic, and how hard Aeneas tries to avoid it. He begins offerings of peace and attempts to become allies with the Latins almost immediately after arriving in Italy.

Furor vs Severitas - Furor is very much a heroic-age virtue, and it's definitely discouraged/presented as inferior to severitas in the epic. It's something that Augustus really pushed as a Roman virtue, examples would be the simile of a single man quieting an angry, furor-driven crowd as Neptune flattens the sea. Also, Aeneas breaking out of his state of furor at the death of Lausus and honouring him for his sacrifice compared to Turnus' gloating over Pallas. This also brings up the idea of clemency, a quality that's really strongly attributed to Julius Caesar through his forgiveness of Pompey, and willingness to pardon those who asked for mercy. Anything anti-furor in the epic shows that Rome had it's own celebrated virtues and focused a lot more on rationality. If you do the L&R module, you can drop in a reference to stoicism 🙂

Pietas, particularly father/son relationships - Massive massive part of Roman culture, the bond between father and son was really important. There was an expectation for fathers to nurture and teach sons, and in return, a son would take care of his father when he was no longer able to take care of himself. Aeneas and Anchises are the biggest example, you have Aeneas totally unwilling to leave his father behind at Troy, putting on his armour to go back out and fight. He also carries him as they flee, which again shows his responsibility to take care of his father. You can also speak about Aeneas and Ascanius, without Ascanius, Aeneas' fatherly love 'allowed him no rest' without his son. Of course you have other examples in Pallas/Evander, Mezentius/Lausus.

Women - This point would focus on the portrayal of women within the epic, and how that relates to Augustus' views and demands of Roman women. You can mention the Julian laws and focus on the role of women as mothers and not adulterers driven by lust. Dido is infected by love, though not her own fault, she neglects Carthage and prevents the city from functioning. Creusa and Lavinia would be examples of moral women

Gods/Religion - As with the Odyssey, you can address the importance of the Gods to the epic and also Roman society. You could mention in particular the household Gods, including Hestia/Vesta passed to Aeneas by Hector in Bk2, as they have a much greater role in Roman society than Greek.

The underworld/death - Again similar to the Odyssey, the Aeneid shows the culture surrounding death and burial in society. Dido's suicide stands out, though the act of her suicide would have been quite divisive (honourable or not), you can argue that it aids her misery in the Fields of Mourning in the underworld/Virgil warns against it. Aeneas sees Tartarus, but also Elysium, a paradise for heroes after death. From this, you can also address the process of purifying/cleansing souls to be reborn again through Anchises showing Aeneas future Romans.


Hope this is helpful! Any of these can also be used for other questions that are more specific 🥰

you are an absolute lifesaver thank you so so much!!! 🥰 best of luck for your exams x

Reply 78

Original post
by Sademct
Hi guys, just a question
I'm studying the aeneid and iliad and have my exam on Tuesday, but I'm really struggling to remember modern scholarship
Any advice?

When revising them, try to remember the scholar's name as if it's part of the quote, for example "Scholar Bowra says that the suitors are the opposite of the heroic ideal" instead of just "the suitors are the opposite of the heroic ideal." Some scholars prefer to talk about specific themes, so this can help you remember.

If you're struggling to remember lots of scholars, you can simplify the quote, as you wont be expected to write them verbatim in your essays, particularly if they're long. A quote like "Jones says Odysseus is the loyal hero-husband whose eyes are fixated on only one goal: return home" can become "Jones says Odysseus is a loyal hero-husband focused on returning home."

I'd also say that, if you're struggling to remember loads of scholarship, try to pick quotes that can be used for many different points rather than very niche comments about specific parts of the books.

Another really important thing to remember is that it's not just scholar quotes that count towards the marks you get for wider knowledge. You can also include comments such as 'a modern feminist critic may argue that Helen is portrayed as...' which can count as academic interpretation. Equally, any clear reference to other modules you do also counts, which is easy to incorporate if you do topics such as Greek Religion, Theatre, L&R. I'd learn scholars as a priority as it's much easier for an examiner to recognise them and circle that box on the mark scheme, but you can definitely incorporate scholarship/academic knowledge in other ways.

Reply 79

Original post
by hfern22
hey do people have any predictions on what the ody / aen hero paper questions could be on? Im kinda stressing :frown:

I've seen a lot of people bounce around the idea that there will be a question on family for Aeneid, which I think is plausible. If it's a 20 mark, it could be on father/son relationships.

For the Odyssey, I think that Telemachus is a contender for the 20 mark, he's been absent from a lot of recent papers and it would tie in nicely for the comparison with a family Aeneid question. Disguise/deception is also possible. 30 mark is unlikely to be on Odysseus' character specifically, but I think that it'll feature him still- it's hard not to. My guesses are something on society, heroism in general, or even justice or good and evil.

The Odyssey 2023 question will have had a lot of complaints because it was so cumbersome to answer, so perhaps OCR will atone and be a little kinder to us this year.
(edited 1 year ago)

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