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Discrimination against English A level students 2023

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Original post by cuddly kittens
In 2023 : 26% of English students received A grades, 37% of NI students received A grades, 33% of Welsh students received A grades.


And a school one side of town gets 40% A-grades, while one the other side of town gets 20%.

Different areas, different demographics, different funding.

Original post by cuddly kittens
There is no consistency between the grades between three three countries, but there should be!!


Why should there?

These aren't the same populations. The demographics of the students aren't the same. The demographics of the teachers aren't the same. The funding isn't the same. Why should the aggregate outcomes be the same when literally none of these variables are controlled?

Original post by cuddly kittens
We all supposedly live in the United Kingdom, yet Welsh and NI students are given an easier ride to the higher grades.


Are they? You have to do a lot better that just citing aggregate outcome stats to back up this claim.

You seriously need to grow up and drop the victim complex. If you aren't getting the results that you think you should be; it's very likely to be you that is the problem rather than the world at large.
Reply 21
Original post by cuddly kittens
OFQUAL is guilty of race discrimination under the 2010 Equality Act by allowing Wales and Northern Ireland to have lower grade boundaries than England. It makes a mockery of the exam system, when English students achieving the same exam mark as a Welsh student were awarded up to 2 grades less in their A level assigned grade. It is pure discrimination based on nationality, which is illegal. I would urge everyone to contact OFQUAL and lodge a direct complaint, and also to lodge a complaint with EHRC (the Equality and Human Rights Commission). Both forms are available online and are quick and easy to fill out. The EHRC stepped in and made OFQUAL change all the grades retrospectively in 2020 for a similar reason and the same should happen again this year. It makes a total mockery of the exam system - Welsh, NI and English students all compete for the same university places and the same jobs. This discrimination will materially impact English students for the rest of their lives on many levels including financially and mentally. It is illegal, and for a good reason. Imagine if grades were awarded based on colour, or gender? No one would stand for it. Awarding grades based on nationality is no different.

Education is devolved, so your argument about it being discrimination is a total non starter I’m afraid. That would be like saying that Scots are being discriminated against as they have a higher income tax band. I’m not saying it’s fair, but it is not discrimination either.
Original post by lalexm
Education is devolved, so your argument about it being discrimination is a total non starter I’m afraid. That would be like saying that Scots are being discriminated against as they have a higher income tax band. I’m not saying it’s fair, but it is not discrimination either.

Then they should not call them all A levels. They should have different names for the different exams, to show that the grades are not equivalent.
Original post by cuddly kittens
Then they should not call them all A levels. They should have different names for the different exams, to show that the grades are not equivalent.

Who shouldn’t call their qualifications A-levels? Wales and NI?
Original post by Talkative Toad
Who shouldn’t call their qualifications A-levels? Wales and NI?


Doesn't matter who changes the names. Something needs to be added to each to identify which grading system was used. They are not equivalent. English A level, Welsh A level and NI A level is as good as anything else. But the grades awarded are not equal, and therefore they should be easily distinguishable for now and for the future.
Original post by cuddly kittens
Doesn't matter who changes the names. Something needs to be added to each to identify which grading system was used. They are not equivalent. English A level, Welsh A level and NI A level is as good as anything else. But the grades awarded are not equal, and therefore they should be easily distinguishable for now and for the future.

I think that it’s pointless. Devolved nations are allowed to have their own education system, nothing discriminatory about it as everyone else has said.
Original post by Talkative Toad
I think that it’s pointless. Devolved nations are allowed to have their own education system, nothing discriminatory about it as everyone else has said.


But the A levels are not equivalent. An A in Northern Ireland is equivalent to a B in England. I did not realise that until this year. Universities admissions departments may be aware of it, but many students are not and employers are definitively not. It is misleading and makes a mockery of the grades if they do not mean the same. By all means, have different grading systems, but there has to be a way to distinguish the results between the 3 countries because they are not equivalent. There has to be clarity between the countries, if they are to have different grading systems, to make it crystal clear to everyone that the grades are not comparable nor equivalent.
Original post by cuddly kittens
But the A levels are not equivalent. An A in Northern Ireland is equivalent to a B in England. I did not realise that until this year. Universities admissions departments may be aware of it, but many students are not and employers are definitively not. It is misleading and makes a mockery of the grades if they do not mean the same. By all means, have different grading systems, but there has to be a way to distinguish the results between the 3 countries because they are not equivalent. There has to be clarity between the countries, if they are to have different grading systems, to make it crystal clear to everyone that the grades are not comparable nor equivalent.

That won't happen.
Original post by Talkative Toad
That won't happen.

It will not happen unless this knowledge gains momentum, because at the moment most people are ignorant of this.

By giving the different exam systems a generic title Ofqual has found an easy way to hide positive discrimination in favour of Welsh and Northern Irish students. It only became grossly apparent this year to people like me who had a vested interest, that the A levels grades mean vastly different things between the countries. There would be more of an outcry if everyone was aware.

There needs to be honesty and transparency for anyone to have faith in those exam grades. Ofqual should not try and hide it, they should be open and honest and refer to it as English A level, Welsh A level and Northern Irish A level. The systems are devolved and not equal, and this needs to be publicly recognised. Honesty, openness, fairness and integrity is key when it comes to exams in order for those exams to mean anything, and Ofqual have failed in their duty to ensure this. How else will they pervert the system in the future? How would you feel if they award different grade boundaries based on gender, race or sexuality? Don't think it won't ever happen, because this current situation proves that it can easily be applied in the future due to the ignorance of the majority.

Also, don't think that the different grade standards do not hurt anyone - they cause mental harm and financial harm to English students, and they can negatively change the course of people's lives both now and in the future. If someone in England gets a B and the equivalent in Northern Ireland gets an A it will affect the self esteem and ambitions of the B grade students, and on a practical level it can stop them getting a uni place or a job. It leads to depression and a lack of motivation - why work hard when someone else can do less work and get a better grade? What is the point of making an effort when the system is rigged against you? It is demotivational and on a macro scale this will have repercussions on all their future decisions.
Reply 29
damn you gonna be some lawyer…
Original post by cuddly kittens

It will not happen unless this knowledge gains momentum, because at the moment most people are ignorant of this.

By giving the different exam systems a generic title Ofqual has found an easy way to hide positive discrimination in favour of Welsh and Northern Irish students. It only became grossly apparent this year to people like me who had a vested interest, that the A levels grades mean vastly different things between the countries. There would be more of an outcry if everyone was aware.

There needs to be honesty and transparency for anyone to have faith in those exam grades. Ofqual should not try and hide it, they should be open and honest and refer to it as English A level, Welsh A level and Northern Irish A level. The systems are devolved and not equal, and this needs to be publicly recognised. Honesty, openness, fairness and integrity is key when it comes to exams in order for those exams to mean anything, and Ofqual have failed in their duty to ensure this. How else will they pervert the system in the future? How would you feel if they award different grade boundaries based on gender, race or sexuality? Don't think it won't ever happen, because this current situation proves that it can easily be applied in the future due to the ignorance of the majority.

Also, don't think that the different grade standards do not hurt anyone - they cause mental harm and financial harm to English students, and they can negatively change the course of people's lives both now and in the future. If someone in England gets a B and the equivalent in Northern Ireland gets an A it will affect the self esteem and ambitions of the B grade students, and on a practical level it can stop them getting a uni place or a job. It leads to depression and a lack of motivation - why work hard when someone else can do less work and get a better grade? What is the point of making an effort when the system is rigged against you? It is demotivational and on a macro scale this will have repercussions on all their future decisions.


There’s no discrimination that’s the point that you’re failing to understand. If there’s anything Ofqual need to investigate right now in my opinion, it’s the AQA exam board (this exam board lacks integrity and fairness and misleads candidate+ is known for giving students off spec questions).
Reply 31
honestly, at this point you'd be better off doing a proper study and getting it published in whatever relevant sociology/economics/educational journal might accept it than rant on. one shouldn't say it [whatever it is in this case] "can" "cause" "harm" without an applicable study; I doubt any reputable journal would publish an op-ed or autobiographical case study esp considering conflicts of interests lol.

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