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kingslaw
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#21
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(Original post by an Siarach)
When was the last time you saw the Irish/Welsh/Scots rioting abroad? Its an observation based on what actually happens and i make no statement regarding why i think it is as it is as i dont know and the fact that the english seem to be the only british grouping to end up in such trouble puzzles me because(as stated)its not as if the peoples of the other nations are astoundingly better behaved or of higher moral fibre generally.
OK, I can't think of Scots or Welshmen rioting abroad. However, I've seen plenty of footbally matches involving Cardiff and Wrexham in particular, and some of their fans are the lowest, scummiest type of scallies that are simply intent on causing trouble and rioting.
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hitchhiker_13
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#22
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All I know is when I'm in Spain, people generally assume I'm English, and when I tell them I'm actually Irish a lot of them seem to be friendlier (although they weren't unfriendly before).
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kingslaw
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#23
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The most interesting theory on English (not British) behaviour abroad is that its a manifestation of post-imperialist nationalism. Whilst society tells us to be abhorrent to violence, in our schools we've been brought up on nationalist triumphalism through the imperialist conquests of the great British Empire. The glorification of the British Empire, which is inherently associated with violence and brutality, instills some form of superiority complex in the English in association to foreign nations - which reproduces itself in the violence demonstrated by some when visiting these countries.

I don't subscribe to that myself, but its food for thought.
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kateington
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#24
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#24
(Original post by kingslaw)
The most interesting theory on English (not British) behaviour abroad is that its a manifestation of post-imperialist nationalism. Whilst society tells us to be abhorrent to violence, in our schools we've been brought up on nationalist triumphalism through the imperialist conquests of the great British Empire. The glorification of the British Empire, which is inherently associated with violence and brutality, instills some form of superiority complex in the English in association to foreign nations - which reproduces itself in the violence demonstrated by some when visiting these countries.

I don't subscribe to that myself, but its food for thought.
I've never thought of that before but IF it is just the English who are responsible for behaviour like that then that's a good reason why
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jamieuk20
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#25
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#25
(Original post by an Siarach)
When was the last time you saw the Irish/Welsh/Scots rioting abroad? Its an observation based on what actually happens and i make no statement regarding why i think it is as it is as i dont know and the fact that the english seem to be the only british grouping to end up in such trouble puzzles me because(as stated)its not as if the peoples of the other nations are astoundingly better behaved or of higher moral fibre generally.

All you have to do is compare travel documentaries showing classroom upon classroom in China of well-behaved 5 year olds to the oversexualised little materialite brats of the Western world. If I were you I'd substantially revise your opinion on the comparative behaviours of the peoples of other nations.
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katiesado
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#26
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(Original post by jamieuk20)
All you have to do is compare travel documentaries showing classroom upon classroom in China of well-behaved 5 year olds to the oversexualised little materialite brats of the Western world. If I were you I'd substantially revise your opinion on the comparative behaviours of the peoples of other nations.

I can testify that 5 year olds in China are not any more well-behaved than any other 5 year olds!

It is true however that Chinese media does not oversexualize young chinese girls the way we sexualize children in the west. Children's innocence is prized as the highest gift society can bestow upon it's young people and even teenagers and 20 somethings remain fairly naive. This is one thing I like very much about China and I wish it wasn't so easily dismissed in the west.
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NDGAARONDI
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#27
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(Original post by kingslaw)
OK, I can't think of Scots or Welshmen rioting abroad. However, I've seen plenty of footbally matches involving Cardiff and Wrexham in particular, and some of their fans are the lowest, scummiest type of scallies that are simply intent on causing trouble and rioting.
Celtic and Rangers anyone? And people thought rioting was over between Chelsea and Millwall.
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jamieuk20
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#28
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(Original post by katiesado)
I can testify that 5 year olds in China are not any more well-behaved than any other 5 year olds!

It is true however that Chinese media does not oversexualize young chinese girls the way we sexualize children in the west. Children's innocence is prized as the highest gift society can bestow upon it's young people and even teenagers and 20 somethings remain fairly naive. This is one thing I like very much about China and I wish it wasn't so easily dismissed in the west.

I can see Asia being the world's next superpower in the not too distant future. situation in the West: RMT holds government to ransom in union pay dispute
situation in China: people have no choice but to work otherwise they starve
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an Siarach
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#29
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#29
(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
Celtic and Rangers anyone? And people thought rioting was over between Chelsea and Millwall.
There hasnt been major trouble with celtic or rangers since the 80s. Although in the international context rangers fans are up there with the english for poor behaviour; theyre the only club not to have been presented with the trophy theyd won - the European Cup Winners Cup - as their fans were rioting all over the place at the time. They were also stopped from defending the title as they were banned from european competition as a result.
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an Siarach
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#30
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(Original post by kingslaw)
The most interesting theory on English (not British) behaviour abroad is that its a manifestation of post-imperialist nationalism. Whilst society tells us to be abhorrent to violence, in our schools we've been brought up on nationalist triumphalism through the imperialist conquests of the great British Empire. The glorification of the British Empire, which is inherently associated with violence and brutality, instills some form of superiority complex in the English in association to foreign nations - which reproduces itself in the violence demonstrated by some when visiting these countries.

I don't subscribe to that myself, but its food for thought.
Along the same lines is the 'Fight Club' theory regardint the emasculation of men in modern society and that foreign trips allow men to get into the warrior/fighter mentality which they can no longer legitimately experience.
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NDGAARONDI
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#31
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(Original post by an Siarach)
There hasnt been major trouble with celtic or rangers since the 80s.
It seems most of the football hooliganism is from the 1980s.
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an Siarach
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#32
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(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
It seems most of the football hooliganism is from the 1980s.
Yeah it really was quite a crap decade.
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NDGAARONDI
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#33
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(Original post by an Siarach)
Yeah it really was quite a *****y decade.
Well, the music was pretty good.
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jamieuk20
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#34
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(Original post by an Siarach)
Yeah it really was quite a crap decade.
It would be except for 3 things,

1. Duran Duran
2. Fun House
3. Rolf's Cartoon Show
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an Siarach
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(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
Well, the music was pretty good.
It had its moments although overall it doesnt compare with other decades.
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Howard
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#36
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(Original post by an Siarach)
It had its moments although overall it doesnt compare with other decades.
Well, perhaps not with the 60's or 70's but it was a lot lot better than the 90's and the **** produced these days. I thought the 80's was fantastic!
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an Siarach
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#37
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(Original post by Howard)
Well, perhaps not with the 60's or 70's but it was a lot lot better than the 90's and the **** produced these days. I thought the 80's was fantastic!
I think id rather the 90s to the 80s but its certainly far better than the 00s.
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NDGAARONDI
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(Original post by Howard)
I thought the 80's was fantastic!
Lef Leppard, Metallica, Megadeth, Antrax, Queen, Bon Jovi....

Big hair :p:
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jamieuk20
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#39
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(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
Lef Leppard, Metallica, Megadeth, Antrax, Queen, Bon Jovi....

Big hair :p:
Don't forget Bryan Adams lol.
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kaisersalsek
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#40
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The other countries you speak of aren't "chavvy and loud" because they have a different group of people causing the trouble, in different ways from here.

I went to mocsow a couple of years ago and there were loads of kids in like "biker rebel" leather clothes and stuff. Some were just standing round drinking and smoking whilst the others were virtually having sex up the walls with each other.
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