Police Stopped with no insurance
I am here in bit of lost, I was driving down in a 30 limit speed and it was downhill so my speed went up by 4, the police stopped and asked me to pull over. They asked me for my driver lience and they come back saying I don’t have insurance but I did have temp cover that stated last night but I told them it would start today they asked me to the certificate of insurance which took me 30min to provide but I did provide, however they were still not convince so they call the company/ (someone) to check if policy exists which didn’t and they said the policy is not showing up in the system however. The police officer said that the certificate I provide does look legit but can be fake too, he then explained this and that in past his given very legit looking certificate of insurance but in fact it’s fake. So he was like if you can get insured in the car and that he will let me go, while I was doing insurance I check for a year and in the mean time he comes and say those words “Anything you say and do will be used in court” and said how I am getting on and I said oh I’m gonna get full year insurance but then I didn’t have that much money so I went head and did a temp cover again with different company and he let me go. But he did say just 2 hour insurance.
However just today after 2 days I get a letter in post of Fixed Plenty Notice. Or appeal
My question is he didn’t mention about anything of getting fixed penalty notice he said he will let me go if I have temp cover with different company. Secondly I have the proof of the old and new temp covers.
However just today after 2 days I get a letter in post of Fixed Plenty Notice. Or appeal
My question is he didn’t mention about anything of getting fixed penalty notice he said he will let me go if I have temp cover with different company. Secondly I have the proof of the old and new temp covers.
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Original post by PruthviLalji
I am here in bit of lost, I was driving down in a 30 limit speed and it was downhill so my speed went up by 4, the police stopped and asked me to pull over. They asked me for my driver lience and they come back saying I don’t have insurance but I did have temp cover that stated last night but I told them it would start today they asked me to the certificate of insurance which took me 30min to provide but I did provide, however they were still not convince so they call the company/ (someone) to check if policy exists which didn’t and they said the policy is not showing up in the system however. The police officer said that the certificate I provide does look legit but can be fake too, he then explained this and that in past his given very legit looking certificate of insurance but in fact it’s fake. So he was like if you can get insured in the car and that he will let me go, while I was doing insurance I check for a year and in the mean time he comes and say those words “Anything you say and do will be used in court” and said how I am getting on and I said oh I’m gonna get full year insurance but then I didn’t have that much money so I went head and did a temp cover again with different company and he let me go. But he did say just 2 hour insurance.
However just today after 2 days I get a letter in post of Fixed Plenty Notice. Or appeal
My question is he didn’t mention about anything of getting fixed penalty notice he said he will let me go if I have temp cover with different company. Secondly I have the proof of the old and new temp covers.
However just today after 2 days I get a letter in post of Fixed Plenty Notice. Or appeal
My question is he didn’t mention about anything of getting fixed penalty notice he said he will let me go if I have temp cover with different company. Secondly I have the proof of the old and new temp covers.
For what offence was the Fixed Penalty Notice issued? If you were originally stopped for excess speed, then it could be that this is the offence - and not driving without insurance.
If the fixed penalty notice was issued for driving without insurance, and have evidence that you did have valid insurance, then just follow the process outlined on the form for providing that evidence.
It was for driving without insurance, however I had the certificate of insurance, but officer said they couldn’t find it on the system and they called up someone and they also said there is no policy under my name or something like that.
Altho I did show him the certificate of insurance, but it took a while to find it cuz it wasn’t in my email and I was under the stress.
When he was checking the certificate and came to conclusion that they unable to find the policy he started saying things like “I had been handed perfectly legitimate looking certificate of insurance but it turns out to be fake”. I don’t know what he meant by that, did he say the one I have is fake?
Also he never mention that I will get fixed penalty or any letter or any further actions after he let me go, when I got the insurance.
Altho I did show him the certificate of insurance, but it took a while to find it cuz it wasn’t in my email and I was under the stress.
When he was checking the certificate and came to conclusion that they unable to find the policy he started saying things like “I had been handed perfectly legitimate looking certificate of insurance but it turns out to be fake”. I don’t know what he meant by that, did he say the one I have is fake?
Also he never mention that I will get fixed penalty or any letter or any further actions after he let me go, when I got the insurance.
(edited 9 months ago)
Original post by DataVenia
For what offence was the Fixed Penalty Notice issued? If you were originally stopped for excess speed, then it could be that this is the offence - and not driving without insurance.
If the fixed penalty notice was issued for driving without insurance, and have evidence that you did have valid insurance, then just follow the process outlined on the form for providing that evidence.
If the fixed penalty notice was issued for driving without insurance, and have evidence that you did have valid insurance, then just follow the process outlined on the form for providing that evidence.
However when he asked me when my insurance started, I said it should start today however it had started the pervious night in the certificate of insurance which I kind a forgot cuz of this stressful situation.
He then said something along the lines “In past I have been certificate of insurance that looks legitimate and all but it’s turns out of be fake” something like this he said and I don’t know what he meant by that to me. Was he assuming that the certificate I gave him is fake.
I still don’t understand why did I get the letter. Because he never mention I will get anything. He said if I am able to get insurance right now in under 30/40 minutes he will let me go with the car, other else he will seize the car and I’ll have to pay and go to court. Other than this there was nothing else he mention about fixed penalty.
So, I believe the officer made a mistake or soemthing
It's very simple. You had insurance at the time you were stopped whilst driving.
You can prove you had insurance at that time.
Therefore you shouldn't pay the PCN. You should respond by saying that you had insurance at that time.
You should also request the body worn video of the incident. It's possible you may be able to claim compensation for misconduct or unlawful behaviour by the officer.
It's not your fault if the officer has taken the stance that you are guilty until proven innocent.
Fight this PCN as much as you can and as cleverly as you can.
You can prove you had insurance at that time.
Therefore you shouldn't pay the PCN. You should respond by saying that you had insurance at that time.
You should also request the body worn video of the incident. It's possible you may be able to claim compensation for misconduct or unlawful behaviour by the officer.
It's not your fault if the officer has taken the stance that you are guilty until proven innocent.
Fight this PCN as much as you can and as cleverly as you can.
Original post by Dunnig Kruger
It's very simple. You had insurance at the time you were stopped whilst driving.
You can prove you had insurance at that time.
Therefore you shouldn't pay the PCN. You should respond by saying that you had insurance at that time.
You should also request the body worn video of the incident. It's possible you may be able to claim compensation for misconduct or unlawful behaviour by the officer.
It's not your fault if the officer has taken the stance that you are guilty until proven innocent.
Fight this PCN as much as you can and as cleverly as you can.
You can prove you had insurance at that time.
Therefore you shouldn't pay the PCN. You should respond by saying that you had insurance at that time.
You should also request the body worn video of the incident. It's possible you may be able to claim compensation for misconduct or unlawful behaviour by the officer.
It's not your fault if the officer has taken the stance that you are guilty until proven innocent.
Fight this PCN as much as you can and as cleverly as you can.
Yes, I can prove it, but I only had the certificate at the time and they said they couldn’t find it in the “system”. So I am just worried that based on this they will say I don’t, as it was temp cover I don’t know how it works.
If I request for the body camera footage, how long will that take and will that be before court date and how does that work?
I’ve got the letter with Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty with £300 and 6 points on license and I passed recently so if I were to take this I would have to do everything again theory practical.
Something about all this just doesn't seem right - I can believe a temp insurance certificate not showing on the database... but it's wild that you've just meekly accepted what they told you and bought more insurance, making yourself look guilty.
I'm not seeing any mention of you contacting the insurer yourself with your details at the time, why not?
2 days later there's still no mention of you contacting this insurer to clarify your cover and situation, why not? it would be the first thing I'd do.
The officer was seemingly still working on the basis they had stopped you with no proof of insurance, taking out the new policy on the spot just meant they let you and the vehicle continue driving, you'll still get wrote up for seemingly having no insurance when stopped.
Did you honestly have legit & valid insurance when you were pulled over? As if you did there's nothing to be worrying about here and everything can be proved. If innocent why would you even think of taking the fine & points and basically banning yourself?
I'm not seeing any mention of you contacting the insurer yourself with your details at the time, why not?
2 days later there's still no mention of you contacting this insurer to clarify your cover and situation, why not? it would be the first thing I'd do.
The officer was seemingly still working on the basis they had stopped you with no proof of insurance, taking out the new policy on the spot just meant they let you and the vehicle continue driving, you'll still get wrote up for seemingly having no insurance when stopped.
Did you honestly have legit & valid insurance when you were pulled over? As if you did there's nothing to be worrying about here and everything can be proved. If innocent why would you even think of taking the fine & points and basically banning yourself?
No, I am not thinking of taking the fine and points.
It was temp cover and it not showing up when they looked up put me in stress as I was heading to work and was already late.
The officer said that the insurance I showed he believe is invalid and he wanted to see if I can get a new insurance temp for letting me go
It was temp cover and it not showing up when they looked up put me in stress as I was heading to work and was already late.
The officer said that the insurance I showed he believe is invalid and he wanted to see if I can get a new insurance temp for letting me go
I agree 100% with @StriderHort (PRSOM, by the way).
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
Original post by DataVenia
I agree 100% with @StriderHort (PRSOM, by the way).
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
The fact that it was temporary cover is irrelevant. If you have valid insurance at the time you were stopped then you're fine - regardless of whether this particular officer was able to locate the details on-line or not.
The fact that you purchased additional insurance on-the-spot is also irrelevant to the fixed penalty notice.
Original post by DataVenia
I agree 100% with @StriderHort (PRSOM, by the way).
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
From where did you get your certificate of insurance? If it from some guy in a pub, then it's dodgy. If you obtained it from an insurance company, then why haven't you contacted them to sort this out?
When the officer let me go, I didn’t think of much and thought the matter is solved and as it was cheap temp cover I didn’t wanted to go through hassle waiting for hours in end. But now I guess I have to contact now and ask for written explanation
Original post by PruthviLalji
No, I am not thinking of taking the fine and points.
It was temp cover and it not showing up when they looked up put me in stress as I was heading to work and was already late.
The officer said that the insurance I showed he believe is invalid and he wanted to see if I can get a new insurance temp for letting me go
It was temp cover and it not showing up when they looked up put me in stress as I was heading to work and was already late.
The officer said that the insurance I showed he believe is invalid and he wanted to see if I can get a new insurance temp for letting me go
I can get it was stressful and no one likes being late for work, but at the end of the day police stops and/or insurance database errors are outwith your control - but the fact you didn't try to contact the company that originally insured you and instead contacted a totally different insurance company to buy more cover is crazy, it's not like that was any faster or less stressful surely? It does look a bit suspicious, like you never had valid insurance in the first place and saw being told to get another policy as a potential lifeline.
Have you even contacted this insurance company today? to say what happened and explain your digital certificate wasn't accepted and you'll need to provide further proof of insurance for that date?
Original post by PruthviLalji
Yes, I can prove it, but I only had the certificate at the time and they said they couldn’t find it in the “system”. So I am just worried that based on this they will say I don’t, as it was temp cover I don’t know how it works.
If I request for the body camera footage, how long will that take and will that be before court date and how does that work?
I’ve got the letter with Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty with £300 and 6 points on license and I passed recently so if I were to take this I would have to do everything again theory practical.
If I request for the body camera footage, how long will that take and will that be before court date and how does that work?
I’ve got the letter with Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty with £300 and 6 points on license and I passed recently so if I were to take this I would have to do everything again theory practical.
Request their video footage of the incident today. You should receive it, or access to it (eg it's uploaded to a location you can access with a password provided by them) within a few days.
Ask for all information they have regarding you and this incident.
This info isn't required in order for you to defend the PCN. It may be vital for claiming for compensation in the event of unlawful behaviour by the police.
Do some research on your rights and how to get compensation from the police when they've acted unlawfully.
There's a very high chance the insurance issue will never go to court, as they have no chance of winning.
Your certificate of motor insurance is all you need to provide (way more than) reasonable doubt as to your guilt. Because you are totally innocent of all wrongdoing.
Couple of tips for your next police interaction:
1 video record the interaction (in the context of a traffic stop after switching off your engine and putting the parking brake on).
2 don't talk to the police. Or at least not beyond telling them that you don't answer questions. If you're required to identify yourself under the Road Traffic Act, you can do that, for example, by jotting your details on a piece of paper and showing it to them.
Did you have temporary insurance like the kind that is supplied by a main dealer for a new car until you arrange full insurance - or was it gig type insurance for single trips etc like the "Cuvva" app?
The issue might be that you only had app type insurance on the car. This isn't sufficient. The car itself must have some kind of policy on it, and not just one (or more) people using temporary insurance policies.
How you interact with police is up to you, but turning yourself into a "I know my rights" type person, when you actually don't (because you read a few posts on the internet) is a fast track to getting yourself into a whole load of trouble uneccessarily.
The issue might be that you only had app type insurance on the car. This isn't sufficient. The car itself must have some kind of policy on it, and not just one (or more) people using temporary insurance policies.
How you interact with police is up to you, but turning yourself into a "I know my rights" type person, when you actually don't (because you read a few posts on the internet) is a fast track to getting yourself into a whole load of trouble uneccessarily.
Original post by Dunnig Kruger
Request their video footage of the incident today. You should receive it, or access to it (eg it's uploaded to a location you can access with a password provided by them) within a few days.
Ask for all information they have regarding you and this incident.
This info isn't required in order for you to defend the PCN. It may be vital for claiming for compensation in the event of unlawful behaviour by the police.
Do some research on your rights and how to get compensation from the police when they've acted unlawfully.
There's a very high chance the insurance issue will never go to court, as they have no chance of winning.
Your certificate of motor insurance is all you need to provide (way more than) reasonable doubt as to your guilt. Because you are totally innocent of all wrongdoing.
Couple of tips for your next police interaction:
1 video record the interaction (in the context of a traffic stop after switching off your engine and putting the parking brake on).
2 don't talk to the police. Or at least not beyond telling them that you don't answer questions. If you're required to identify yourself under the Road Traffic Act, you can do that, for example, by jotting your details on a piece of paper and showing it to them.
Ask for all information they have regarding you and this incident.
This info isn't required in order for you to defend the PCN. It may be vital for claiming for compensation in the event of unlawful behaviour by the police.
Do some research on your rights and how to get compensation from the police when they've acted unlawfully.
There's a very high chance the insurance issue will never go to court, as they have no chance of winning.
Your certificate of motor insurance is all you need to provide (way more than) reasonable doubt as to your guilt. Because you are totally innocent of all wrongdoing.
Couple of tips for your next police interaction:
1 video record the interaction (in the context of a traffic stop after switching off your engine and putting the parking brake on).
2 don't talk to the police. Or at least not beyond telling them that you don't answer questions. If you're required to identify yourself under the Road Traffic Act, you can do that, for example, by jotting your details on a piece of paper and showing it to them.
This advice is unrealistic and unhelpful. I assume that you are not a lawyer.
The OP has suffered no loss, and it is not sensible to encourage him to waste his time and public resources claiming for imaginary compensation. As pointed out above, it is not clear that the OP did have insurance when stopped. His action in calling another insurer to arrange cover was odd.
If the police arrest you for murder, you should say nothing until you have a lawyer present. In an interaction with a police officer about a motoring matter, however, it makes sense to be forthright and communicative.
OP, if you can show that you had valid insurance when stopped, you can and should contest the FPN. If you need professional advice, go here -
https://www.counsel.direct/
The original poster HAS suffered loss, because the process has been the punishment.
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
Given that they were pulled for no insurance, refusing to talk would have been about the worst approach possible.
I also don't follow the OP's logic that arranging a second policy at the roadside was any easier than calling the existing provider. All very odd.
I also don't follow the OP's logic that arranging a second policy at the roadside was any easier than calling the existing provider. All very odd.
Original post by Dunnig Kruger
The original poster HAS suffered loss, because the process has been the punishment.
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
Yeah but the OP is (almost certainly*) guilty of having no insurance and was correctly pulled, not seeing 1 bit of it being an unlawful stop or action where you can object and demand money,
*Given their suspicious actions and lack of clarification I need to presume guilt of some sort.
Original post by Dunnig Kruger
The original poster HAS suffered loss, because the process has been the punishment.
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
You defer to two Youtube channels who earn money from getting clicks by people who want to behave badly and get away with it. "I know my rights" tube is so lucrative that Daniel ShenSmith prefers making youtube videos over the actual practise of law. So much so that he started his channel when he had only 2 years experience post call, and indeed seems to be far more a businessman and content creator than practising barrister. People start these channels because silly people want to believe in them and know that they have an enormous automatic audience.
Also, what you are saying about "no reasonable grounds" is rather questionable. The OP was stopped and after a faff, managed to produce a certificate of insurance which clearly wasn't verified by an MIB check. The OP has then given inconsistent information regarding when the insurance started, which might seem suspicious. If the OP produced a certificate which was not accepted, then there is no reason why the officer should not suspect that an offence had been commited and subsequently a FPN was issued. The OP had been cautioned so nothing is untoward or unlawful. The insurance that the OP purchased on the spot was so that he could drive the vehicle away and not have it seized.
By giving advice like "there's a high chance the insurance issue will never go to court", you're betting big with someone else's money. What's the police penalty for a no insurance ticket at s.143? £300 and 6 points. What happens if you go to court? The court can impose an unlimited fine and take your licence. The only way this works out is if the OP can prove absolutely that he had valid insurance at the time - and then best case he gets the FPN cancelled. There is almost no scenario under which the court says "the police have acted unlawfully" - because they haven't.
(edited 7 months ago)
Original post by Dunnig Kruger
The original poster HAS suffered loss, because the process has been the punishment.
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
The police may have acted unlawfully in this matter by proceeding with action when there were no REASONABLE grounds for them to do so.
There's hundreds of youtube videos from the last 5 years showing the police paying compensation to the victims of their unlawful behaviour - usually when police have proceeded with detentions, searches and arrests when they had no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
In this case it appears that we had the issuance of a FPN when there were no reasonable grounds on which to do so.
As for not talking to the police, I defer to these guys:
The OP has suffered no loss. He or she was not arrested. Youtube videos are no substitute for an understanding of the law, which you evidently do not have.
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