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psychic_satori
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#21
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#21
Why bother making this thread when you have http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/t39735-0.html ?
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Luize
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#22
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#22
(Original post by Woodsy)
Nah, I can't hate America - I mean they saved our asses in World War II .
ahahahah.
I tend to not judge people on where they were born...bit pointless.
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Yossarian
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#23
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#23
(Original post by PadFoot90)
Doesnt like american sports, doesnt like american people hmm :p:
Good one my American friend. Hows the NFL?

I have nothing against American people. I just hate it when the Russian role in the Second World War is forgotten.
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F1 fanatic
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#24
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#24
(Original post by Yossarian)
Good one my American friend. Hows the NFL?

I have nothing against American people. I just hate it when the Russian role in the Second World War is forgotten.
Would someone explain American football to me, I dont get it. Ive always felt its rugby players running around in padding but Im sure there must be more to it
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Mr Brightside
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#25
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(Original post by Yossarian)
America didn't save our assess. The Russians did.
To say the 'Russians' is derogatory to Russians today, we don't call the Nazis the Germans (not formally anyway). Communist Russia was an evil regime (killing fields? - indiscriminately as well), Churchill stated he would have made a 'pact with the devil' if it were to end Hitler's regime, thus comparing the Russians to the devil. Remember just after Potsdam 'An iron curtain has been drawn across Europe' - the Russians were never our allies and threatened the World for 50 more years afterwards. It was the Americans that led D-Day, that took the greatest suffering of that day (Ohmaha Beach), they ended the war both in Europe and in Asia - without them Europe would have crumbled. The defence of the French coast from the allies gave the Russians an oppurtunity to head for Berlin (an army of amateurish leadership)
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Harv616
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#26
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#26
ermmmmmmm so they would rather be called the Soviets?
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Apollo
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#27
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#27
(Original post by Yossarian)
Good one my American friend. Hows the NFL?

I have nothing against American people. I just hate it when the Russian role in the Second World War is forgotten.
Great, hows the football?
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Apollo
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#28
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#28
(Original post by F1 fanatic)
Would someone explain American football to me, I dont get it. Ive always felt its rugby players running around in padding but Im sure there must be more to it
http://www.nfluk.com/aboutthegame/ab...game-rules.php
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~Raphael~
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#29
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ok fine, but 2 million russians died fighting the Nazis and Hitler made major mistakes in taking them on...If he hadn't been fighting them he would have DESTROYED Europe...As to Britain, Hitler didn't necessarily want to invade, and I believe a certain Battle of Britain, predominanly by the British, helped to dissuade the Germans...
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Harv616
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#30
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(Original post by Woodsy)
To say the 'Russians' is derogatory to Russians today, we don't call the Nazis the Germans (not formally anyway). Communist Russia was an evil regime (killing fields? - indiscriminately as well), Churchill stated he would have made a 'pact with the devil' if it were to end Hitler's regime, thus comparing the Russians to the devil. Remember just after Potsdam 'An iron curtain has been drawn across Europe' - the Russians were never our allies and threatened the World for 50 more years afterwards. It was the Americans that led D-Day, that took the greatest suffering of that day (Ohmaha Beach), they ended the war both in Europe and in Asia - without them Europe would have crumbled. The defence of the French coast from the allies gave the Russians an oppurtunity to head for Berlin (an army of amateurish leadership)
The reason they had such heavy losses is because they had very few floating tanks and declined the british tanks.

The russians/soviets did fight back by them selfs. By the time stalingrad had been retaken then russians/soviets were back on the offencive, and were winning with sheer numbers.
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F1 fanatic
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#31
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#31
cheers much appreciated
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Mr Brightside
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#32
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(Original post by BhArJ)
The reason they had such heavy losses is because they had very few floating tanks and declined the british tanks.

The russians/soviets did fight back by them selfs. By the time stalingrad had been retaken then russians/soviets were back on the offencive, and were winning with sheer numbers.
Let's be honest here though, if the Russians could have swept through Europe, including France and Britain they would have done. Communist Russia was as evil as Hitler's Nazis, sure they played a part, but it was out of sheer greed and the unworkable ideology of Communism (spread it through the world). The allies knew what they were doing, let's be honest, the Cold War was going on from the Bolshevik revolution.
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Yossarian
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#33
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#33
(Original post by Woodsy)
To say the 'Russians' is derogatory to Russians today, we don't call the Nazis the Germans (not formally anyway).
The majority of people who fought in the Russian army were Russians and therefore to call them Russians is not a knock on their character or a suggestion of any political/ideological viewpoint they possessed. In the same way the German army should not be referred to as Nazi's. The political hierachy of Germany were Nazi's and the leader of Russia were Communists. Whether the public supported them is open to debate.

(Original post by Woodsy)
Communist Russia was an evil regime (killing fields? - indiscriminately as well), Churchill stated he would have made a 'pact with the devil' if it were to end Hitler's regime, thus comparing the Russians to the devil.
Churchill also made a pact with Roosevelt. (Or the devil as you may like to call him if we extend your logic)


As for American involvement in D-Day - This I cannot and would not deny. But the whole situation was aided, if not created, by Red Army strength in the East which had, consequently, crippled the Wehrmacht when Hitler launched Operation Barbarossa. Hitler had his troops fighting a war on two front when there existed no evidence to suggest that Stalin wished to be aggressive towards Germany (see the Nazi-Soviet Pact)

Hitler made a grave tactical error and embroiled Russia in a war they sought to avoid. But I agree that US forces were crucial - however, they were less important than the Russians
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Yossarian
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#34
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#34
(Original post by PadFoot90)
Great, hows the football?
Super
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Harv616
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#35
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(Original post by Woodsy)
Let's be honest here though, if the Russians could have swept through Europe, including France and Britain they would have done. Communist Russia was as evil as Hitler's Nazis, sure they played a part, but it was out of sheer greed and the unworkable ideology of Communism (spread it through the world). The allies knew what they were doing, let's be honest, the Cold War was going on from the Bolshevik revolution.
Yeah true they could have. Id still say the russains were better than the natizs.

Oh and the only reason american enterd the war was cause they were attacked at pearl harbour. Not for democracy or any of that crap. They saw a threat to AMERICA and reacted, thats why it took to long to actualy enter the war. :eek:
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Yossarian
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#36
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#36
(Original post by BhArJ)
Yeah true they could have. Id still say the russains were better than the natizs.

Oh and the only reason american enterd the war was cause they were attacked at pearl harbour. Not for democracy or any of that crap. They saw a threat to AMERICA and reacted, thats why it took to long to actualy enter the war. :eek:
They only declared war only Japan and it is possible would not have physically entered the European war had Hitler not decided (in his infinate wisdom) that declared war on the US was a good, common sense reaction to Pearl Harbor
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Harv616
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#37
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(Original post by Yossarian)
They only declared war only Japan and it is possible would not have physically entered the European war had Hitler not decided (in his infinate wisdom) that declared war on the US was a good, common sense reaction to Pearl Harbor
yeah true, + they did take a few british bases for there help :rolleyes:
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psychic_satori
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#38
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(Original post by Yossarian)
The majority of people who fought in the Russian army were Russians and therefore to call them Russians is not a knock on their character or a suggestion of any political/ideological viewpoint they possessed. In the same way the German army should not be referred to as Nazi's. The political hierachy of Germany were Nazi's and the leader of Russia were Communists. Whether the public supported them is open to debate.
you are incorrect. There was no "Russian Army." It was the Soviet Army, and it was made up of--you guessed it--Soviets.

As for the Soviet involvement, a great proportion of the Soviet casualties were brought about because the Soviet Army was run poorly and, as the Soviet Union had an army of millions, they had little concern for the lives of their soldiers.
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Yossarian
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#39
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#39
(Original post by psychic_satori)
you are incorrect. There was no "Russian Army." It was the Soviet Army, and it was made up of--you guessed it--Soviets.

As for the Soviet involvement, a great proportion of the Soviet casualties were brought about because the Soviet Army was run poorly and, as the Soviet Union had an army of millions, they had little concern for the lives of their soldiers.
You are wrong. In 1918 and then to a greater extent following the German invasion conscription was introduced. 15-20 million were drafted in WWII alone. Were all these Soviets/Communist? Could they all possibly be Soviets? I would think not.

As for Soviet involvement - as you say a significant proportion of Russian casualties were due to poor practices and a willingness to simply throw bodies at bullets. But it did work.
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Harv616
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#40
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#40
(Original post by Yossarian)
As for Soviet involvement - as you say a significant proportion of Russian casualties were due to poor practices and a willingness to simply throw bodies at bullets. But it did work.
+ The purges a few years before done by stalin which killing most of the experienced officers and poor traning etc

dam i should have taken history
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