The Student Room Group

Any Evidence of UK Unis actually admitting Indian ISC students for undergraduate?

While all unis declare their criteria for judging ISC scores (comparable to A Level). Do Uni admission officers really put in the effort to assess and evaluate indian ISC student applications?

e.g. Courses that are A*A*A specify 95% for ISC. Is there any evidence that this was actually followed and offers were made?
Thousands of Indian students join UK undergrad programmes with Class XII results every year.
Reply 2
Original post by Admit-One
Thousands of Indian students join UK undergrad programmes with Class XII results every year.

thank you, thats indeed true.

I was more interested in courses that require A*A*A, whether have an indian ISC intake
Original post by chiragindia
thank you, thats indeed true.

I was more interested in courses that require A*A*A, whether have an indian ISC intake


Well even taking as a singular example of Cambridge (where all STEM courses and economics have a standard offer of A*A*A), 287 Indian students applied last year, 25 were made offers, and 15 ended up meeting their offer conditions and accepting their places. I think it's unlikely all 25 of those offers were for non-STEM subjects and all 287 applicants did not apply to STEM courses, so therefore obviously yes it does happen.

This is stated directly in the admissions statistics data they publish every year: https://www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/sites/www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/files/publications/ug_admissions_statistics_2023_cycle.pdf

You are free to peruse previous year statistics as well: https://www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/apply/statistics

I don't think in either case it's particularly illuminating beyond proving that yes, there is evidence universities in the UK do accept these students for courses with such entry criteria. Which I don't think is something that realistically would be held in any doubt anyway by any rational individual regardless.
(edited 2 weeks ago)
Reply 4
Original post by artful_lounger
Well even taking as a singular example of Cambridge (where all STEM courses and economics have a standard offer of A*A*A), 287 Indian students applied last year, 25 were made offers, and 15 ended up meeting their offer conditions and accepting their places. I think it's unlikely all 25 of those offers were for non-STEM subjects and all 287 applicants did not apply to STEM courses, so therefore obviously yes it does happen.
This is stated directly in the admissions statistics data they publish every year: https://www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/sites/www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/files/publications/ug_admissions_statistics_2023_cycle.pdf
You are free to peruse previous year statistics as well: https://www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/apply/statistics
I don't think in either case it's particularly illuminating beyond proving that yes, there is evidence universities in the UK do accept these students for courses with such entry criteria. Which I don't think is something that realistically would be held in any doubt anyway by any rational individual regardless.

Thanks, the statistics still miss my question. Admits to ISC qualification.

India students study 4 main qualifications - IB, A levels, ISC, CBSE. Of the applicants (287), offer (25), and acceptace (15) - which was their qualification? That detail is not available, to the best of my knowledge.

Further, if you notice there is a drop in % from applicant to acceptance for India where as for Singapore it actually increases. Which means Singapore applicant converts an application to an acceptance much better than an Indian.

The other problem is most Indian schools (particularly the CBSE and ISC ones) are not adept at the UCAS procedure or in providing the reference. Very likely this is not upto standards available to a typical home student.

This is not a race thing, but just wanted to understand how the ISC qualification is viewed by UK top unis.

Judging by the %, UK Uni admission officers would have invested resorces to understand China students, because the number of applicants is significantly larger than India. It would be justified from the Uni's perspective.
Original post by chiragindia
Thanks, the statistics still miss my question. Admits to ISC qualification.

India students study 4 main qualifications - IB, A levels, ISC, CBSE. Of the applicants (287), offer (25), and acceptace (15) - which was their qualification? That detail is not available, to the best of my knowledge.

Further, if you notice there is a drop in % from applicant to acceptance for India where as for Singapore it actually increases. Which means Singapore applicant converts an application to an acceptance much better than an Indian.

The other problem is most Indian schools (particularly the CBSE and ISC ones) are not adept at the UCAS procedure or in providing the reference. Very likely this is not upto standards available to a typical home student.

This is not a race thing, but just wanted to understand how the ISC qualification is viewed by UK top unis.

Judging by the %, UK Uni admission officers would have invested resorces to understand China students, because the number of applicants is significantly larger than India. It would be justified from the Uni's perspective.

If you want that detailed information you will need to put in a FOIA request but I think it's a fruitless endeavour because clearly they dk understand it since they set offers and accept students from India with it and they as with most igher major universities in the UK clearly outline the specific requirements they have for Indian students sitting those qualifications in their international qualifications section.

You also cannot assume that the difference in offer vs acceptance rates mean anything specifically as you have no data to back that up. There are myriad potential explanations - Indian students who meet their offers nay choose not to go because they ultimately find it to expensive, or they also got offers frome equivalently good universities in India or elsewhere in the world e.g. the US, or they decide they don't want to go so far away for uni. Additionally yes some may fail to meet their offer requirements - that does not suggest that the university doesn't understand the system worse for India than for elsewhere.

Bear in mind also under the UCAS contract unis have if they make an offer to a student and they meet the requirements then the uni is required to accept them, legally.

These universities will have been accepting students doing these qualifications longer than either of us have been alive and I think it's unrealistic and presumptuous to suggest they don't understand them...not only do they have experience understanding them in terms.of offers they will also have experience of seeing how well those they have accepted in the past ultimately.perform on the course.

It is worth noting all Cambridge offers for CBSE students are conditional on achieving also certain grades in STEP, IIT-JEE (Advanced) or APs.

Ultimately if the students need those requirements and can pay the international fees they have no reason not to accept them. However as UK universities including "top" universities have very limited offerings for scholarships etc, it is very likely such well qualified students may simply choose as noted above to go to e.g. MIT or Harvard or something where their full financial need will be covered.
(edited 2 weeks ago)
Reply 6
Original post by artful_lounger
If you want that detailed information you will need to put in a FOIA request but I think it's a fruitless endeavour because clearly they dk understand it since they set offers and accept students from India with it and they as with most igher major universities in the UK clearly outline the specific requirements they have for Indian students sitting those qualifications in their international qualifications section.
You also cannot assume that the difference in offer vs acceptance rates mean anything specifically as you have no data to back that up. There are myriad potential explanations - Indian students who meet their offers nay choose not to go because they ultimately find it to expensive, or they also got offers frome equivalently good universities in India or elsewhere in the world e.g. the US, or they decide they don't want to go so far away for uni. Additionally yes some may fail to meet their offer requirements - that does not suggest that the university doesn't understand the system worse for India than for elsewhere.
Bear in mind also under the UCAS contract unis have if they make an offer to a student and they meet the requirements then the uni is required to accept them, legally.
These universities will have been accepting students doing these qualifications longer than either of us have been alive and I think it's unrealistic and presumptuous to suggest they don't understand them...not only do they have experience understanding them in terms.of offers they will also have experience of seeing how well those they have accepted in the past ultimately.perform on the course.

all fair points, thanks for engaging on this topic. All good learning.

An ISC kids take 4 optional and 2 English compulsory subjects. I believe an A Level kid is good to go with 3.

An A level kid has far better bandwidth to engage in subject specific super-currics and thus have a better chance to churn out a meatier PS. Whilst her ISC counterpart shall be strethed thing across 6 subjects. Such qualitiative nuance is important.

Now an admission counsellor is looking at may be about 20+ qualifications from China, India and the top 20 PISA countries. They would have their time, resource limitations to understand each nuance.
Original post by chiragindia
all fair points, thanks for engaging on this topic. All good learning.

An ISC kids take 4 optional and 2 English compulsory subjects. I believe an A Level kid is good to go with 3.

An A level kid has far better bandwidth to engage in subject specific super-currics and thus have a better chance to churn out a meatier PS. Whilst her ISC counterpart shall be strethed thing across 6 subjects. Such qualitiative nuance is important.

Now an admission counsellor is looking at may be about 20+ qualifications from China, India and the top 20 PISA countries. They would have their time, resource limitations to understand each nuance.


I don't think the supercurricular point is relevant - IB students do 6 subjects. However they don't do all of them to the same depth and breadth as A-level students. US students do a ton of random classes. They still are able to and expected to achieve the same things as A-level students. You're assuming that the 6 subjects ISC students do are all the same number of contact hours and depth and breadth as A-levels when there's no reason to suggest that.

Also "suoer curricular" activities aren't a formally required part of the application and admissions tutors know different students from even the same qualification system have differing levels of access to some activities and do NOT preferentially admit those going to e.g. expensive private schools where these are handed to students on a platter compared to students going to state schools with limited access to these. Wider reading is perfectly sufficient as a "supercurricular" activity.

I've not yet seen any evidence provided suggesting there is any discriminating against thay qualification and your objections apply to any number of other commonly accepted qualifications and I do not see that they hold any water as a result.

If you do find concrete evidence and data proving categorically this is the case I would certainly he interested in seeing it. Until you provide this I am unconvinced there is anything untoward happening.
As someone who’s worked in admissions for a well ranked uni with high entry requirements, I’ve certainly not seen any discrepancies between Indian and other international applicants. We advertise our requirements and anyone that meets them gets considered.

Refs are universally fine and in most cases the least important aspect of an app.

Indian applicants typically have significantly more extra curricular activities. Although you could argue that they lose focus on super curriculars.

Personal Statements are often a bit of a sticking point as they fall into the trap of being too autobiographical. Anyone that has read about countless Indian applicants discussing the subject over the dinner table will be aware of this.

So broadly we could say the PS’s receive less decent coaching, but there are countless sources of info if you look for them.
Reply 9
Original post by Admit-One
As someone who’s worked in admissions for a well ranked uni with high entry requirements, I’ve certainly not seen any discrepancies between Indian and other international applicants. We advertise our requirements and anyone that meets them gets considered.
Refs are universally fine and in most cases the least important aspect of an app.
Indian applicants typically have significantly more extra curricular activities. Although you could argue that they lose focus on super curriculars.
Personal Statements are often a bit of a sticking point as they fall into the trap of being too autobiographical. Anyone that has read about countless Indian applicants discussing the subject over the dinner table will be aware of this.
So broadly we could say the PS’s receive less decent coaching, but there are countless sources of info if you look for them.
Great feedback.

Glad that Acad ref are least important. This area is particularly deficient.

Question on Predictives: Should the school share the predictives with the student?
For example if the student is applying for a course requiring A* / 95%, but the school marks it as A / 91% in the predictives section. The student, unaware, will just waste one UCAS application. For no fault of his. Absolutely stupid.
Original post by chiragindia
Great feedback.

Glad that Acad ref are least important. This area is particularly deficient.

Question on Predictives: Should the school share the predictives with the student?
For example if the student is applying for a course requiring A* / 95%, but the school marks it as A / 91% in the predictives section. The student, unaware, will just waste one UCAS application. For no fault of his. Absolutely stupid.

In the UK it's pretty standard for students to be told their predicted grades, therefore they will apply to unis based on what they know their predicted grades to be.

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