The Student Room Group

Best unis for law

Could someone in the know rank the top unis for me based on career prospects in law.
My main focus is whether the uni will make a competetive candiate for a top London firm or a top firm elsewhere.

I have been told that the top ones are Oxbridge, UCL, LSE, Durham, Bristol and Warwick.

Are these actually considerd above the rest and would they give me an advantage?

I am particualry interested in the reputations of Exeter and Cardiff both compared to those ones I have metioned and compared against eachother and others. I.E is Cardifff uni thought of highly in field or not?
For example, would a degree from Cardiff be competetive for a place at a top London firm or not? Same thing for Exeter.

I understand that all of these unis are great options.
I don't mean to come across as demeaning.
It is simply quite difficult to guage the reputation of the unis and I don't want to complete a challenging law degree only to find that it limits me becuase of where I did it, or doing it there restricts me where I can work geogrpahically, or worse, I cant find a good opportunity.

If anyone replys, thanks.
Hi, KCL is another good university to look into as it is another university that is great for grads. Oxford (91.8%), LSE (91.8%), Durham (89.8%), Cambridge (87.3%) and King's College London (87.3%) - Legal Cheek (2 Jun 2021). However, it more about the degree you get as most firms look for a 2:1 or a 1st which can give you an advantage and applying to vacation schemes to get experience.
Have you been to Open Days at any of these Unis?
Do you think you would happy studying there?
Reply 3
Original post by AlexWestlake
Could someone in the know rank the top unis for me based on career prospects in law.
My main focus is whether the uni will make a competetive candiate for a top London firm or a top firm elsewhere.
I have been told that the top ones are Oxbridge, UCL, LSE, Durham, Bristol and Warwick.
Are these actually considerd above the rest and would they give me an advantage?
I am particualry interested in the reputations of Exeter and Cardiff both compared to those ones I have metioned and compared against eachother and others. I.E is Cardifff uni thought of highly in field or not?
For example, would a degree from Cardiff be competetive for a place at a top London firm or not? Same thing for Exeter.
I understand that all of these unis are great options.
I don't mean to come across as demeaning.
It is simply quite difficult to guage the reputation of the unis and I don't want to complete a challenging law degree only to find that it limits me becuase of where I did it, or doing it there restricts me where I can work geogrpahically, or worse, I cant find a good opportunity.
If anyone replys, thanks.

Probably not the news you want to hear, but you will struggle to get a training contract with a top London law firm with a degree from Cardiff or Exeter. Certainly not impossible, but it will be very challenging as competition is so high, and top firms will prefer to recruit from Oxbridge, and the next Tier down which tends to consist of UCL, LSE, Kings, Durham and maybe Bristol/Notts. There is no fixed Tier but these are the unis that tend to do well at getting students into training contracts compared to the others, and taking into account the uni size, as for example LSE is very small but still get lots in.
2019 research : Law firms' preferred universities - Chambers Student Guide

"Law firms are beginning to show that they're less obsessed with university name and grades. Instead they're becoming more interested in simply sourcing candidates with the right qualities to make them a great lawyer. City heavies Clifford Chance and Macfarlanes set the ball rolling with 'CV blind' interviews; a recruitment method which (you guessed it) leaves interviewers in the dark about candidates' educational backgrounds. Other firms have since followed suit, in a bid to help remove bias from the process and allow recruiters to focus solely on an individual's qualities and responses. We expect that more firms will adopt techniques like this in the years ahead as they acknowledge the need to be more diverse"
Reply 5
Original post by McGinger
2019 research : Law firms' preferred universities - Chambers Student Guide
"Law firms are beginning to show that they're less obsessed with university name and grades. Instead they're becoming more interested in simply sourcing candidates with the right qualities to make them a great lawyer. City heavies Clifford Chance and Macfarlanes set the ball rolling with 'CV blind' interviews; a recruitment method which (you guessed it) leaves interviewers in the dark about candidates' educational backgrounds. Other firms have since followed suit, in a bid to help remove bias from the process and allow recruiters to focus solely on an individual's qualities and responses. We expect that more firms will adopt techniques like this in the years ahead as they acknowledge the need to be more diverse"

Probably make sense from a business perspective that they are slowly starting to change in order to recruit from a bigger talent pool.
Thanks for all the help.

Bristol seems to be the best fit for me.

Please correct me if I am wrong. Getting a 1st from Bristol wouldn't restrict me or put me at a real competitive disadvantage compared to other students in the tier below Oxbridge. (If the training contract process is not carried out blindly)

Is the gap between UCL, LSE, Kings and Durham comapred to Bristol and Notts sizeable or is it a case of the stongest candidates from any of those having basically equal chance?
Original post by McGinger
Have you been to Open Days at any of these Unis?
Do you think you would happy studying there?

I have only been to KCL. However, you can look at TikTok videos of people who are currently at these universities to get an idea of what it is like being there.
You should read this: https://www.chambersstudent.co.uk/where-to-start/newsletter/law-firms-preferred-universities-2019

I would ignore those saying you'd struggle to obtain a TC with a degree from Exeter or Cardiff as the research doesn't show that. Truth is while there is Oxbridge and then a handful of others that might offer some slight advantage, the reality is a degree from any RG uni will allow you to progress in your career as long as you do well and pursue work experience opps etc. Looks like there are plenty of Exeter grads with high flying London law careers.
(edited 1 month ago)
Reply 9
Original post by AlexWestlake
Thanks for all the help.
Bristol seems to be the best fit for me.
Please correct me if I am wrong. Getting a 1st from Bristol wouldn't restrict me or put me at a real competitive disadvantage compared to other students in the tier below Oxbridge. (If the training contract process is not carried out blindly)
Is the gap between UCL, LSE, Kings and Durham comapred to Bristol and Notts sizeable or is it a case of the stongest candidates from any of those having basically equal chance?

I’m only in Y13 so feel free to ignore this advice but I think Bristol is a great uni with brilliant prospects. I don’t think you’ll be restricted at all if you go to Bristol. This isn’t about TCs, but I’ve seen many barristers and pupils from Bristol who were amazing. If you went to Open Days and liked Bristol best and think you would be happiest there, go for it!

Note - Bristol uses the LNAT. I would start doing practice papers for that around 2 months before you sit the test. When you’re applying, I would strongly suggest you don’t pick 5 universities that all use the LNAT.
Reply 10
Original post by RustyMoon
You should read this: https://www.chambersstudent.co.uk/where-to-start/newsletter/law-firms-preferred-universities-2019
I would ignore those saying you'd struggle to obtain a TC with a degree from Exeter or Cardiff as the research doesn't show that. Truth is while there is Oxbridge and then a handful of others that might offer some slight advantage, the reality is a degree from any RG uni will allow you to progress in your career as long as you do well and pursue work experience opps etc. Looks like there are plenty of Exeter grads with high flying London law careers.

Although your comment about ignoring those saying “you'd struggle to obtain a TC from Cardiff and Exeter” was directed at me, I don’t necessarily disagree with it.

I guess the point I was trying to make is that getting into a top City law firm as per the original question is really tough, even for those with the advantage of going to an elite uni. I know some great law students from Cambridge that have struggled to land TCs. Most that have persevered have landed something, but often not in top firms or in corporate law.

Maybe I shouldn’t be pessimistic at Christmas but just wanted people to have some realistic understanding of the challenge.
Original post by lalexm
Although your comment about ignoring those saying “you'd struggle to obtain a TC from Cardiff and Exeter” was directed at me, I don’t necessarily disagree with it.
I guess the point I was trying to make is that getting into a top City law firm as per the original question is really tough, even for those with the advantage of going to an elite uni. I know some great law students from Cambridge that have struggled to land TCs. Most that have persevered have landed something, but often not in top firms or in corporate law.
Maybe I shouldn’t be pessimistic at Christmas but just wanted people to have some realistic understanding of the challenge.

Did you read the link though? According to that research Exeter was the fifth most popular university with City law firms.
So, yes, I did feel your earlier post was a little pessimistic, particularly when you said, "you will struggle to get a training contract with a top London law firm with a degree from Cardiff or Exeter."

I'd probably say that Exeter was so popular because many of the students there are from London and the South East and Exeter doesn't have much of a local legal market to hold on to them after graduation (unlike Manchester / Birmingham).

But to answer the OP's question a good law degree from Exeter isn't going to close too many doors.
Reply 12
Original post by RustyMoon
Did you read the link though? According to that research Exeter was the fifth most popular university with City law firms.
So, yes, I did feel your earlier post was a little pessimistic, particularly when you said, "you will struggle to get a training contract with a top London law firm with a degree from Cardiff or Exeter."
I'd probably say that Exeter was so popular because many of the students there are from London and the South East and Exeter doesn't have much of a local legal market to hold on to them after graduation (unlike Manchester / Birmingham).
But to answer the OP's question a good law degree from Exeter isn't going to close too many doors.

Yes fair enough, I probably should not have lumped Exeter together with Cardiff. The report is a bit skewed by the fact that Exeter has about twice as many law undergrads as Camb/Ox/Durham but it still does well.
Original post by AlexWestlake
Could someone in the know rank the top unis for me based on career prospects in law.
My main focus is whether the uni will make a competetive candiate for a top London firm or a top firm elsewhere.
I have been told that the top ones are Oxbridge, UCL, LSE, Durham, Bristol and Warwick.
Are these actually considerd above the rest and would they give me an advantage?
I am particualry interested in the reputations of Exeter and Cardiff both compared to those ones I have metioned and compared against eachother and others. I.E is Cardifff uni thought of highly in field or not?
For example, would a degree from Cardiff be competetive for a place at a top London firm or not? Same thing for Exeter.
I understand that all of these unis are great options.
I don't mean to come across as demeaning.
It is simply quite difficult to guage the reputation of the unis and I don't want to complete a challenging law degree only to find that it limits me becuase of where I did it, or doing it there restricts me where I can work geogrpahically, or worse, I cant find a good opportunity.
If anyone replys, thanks.

Hiya!

In general, the Cardiff Law course has pretty good rep and lots of links to the industry - though in particular, the Welsh industry. I think that the Cardiff course is competitive in the sense that it offers Pro Bono schemes, involvement in the university's Innocence Project, paid industrial placements, and connections to the Welsh Government, city law firms, courts, and advice centres. Because of this, students do go to pretty decent places after their degree.

I think whether or not it is competitive for London firms however, is probably something academic staff might know better, as they'd have the best knowledge on where their students typically go to after their degree :smile: This goes the same with any university, to be honest. The best place I would say is going to an open day, but if you don't have the time, then contacting the School of Law and Politics by their number (+44 (0)29 2087 6705) or email ([email protected]) is your next best bet. Contacting the course enquiries team might also be helpful :smile:

~ Fatiha, Cardiff University Student Rep
TL/DR. 1. Please stop obsessing about university rankings. 2. Please thknk carefully about heading down the Suits route.


I may be one of the few people here who has conducted selection exercises in each of a magic circle barristers' chambers and a large law firm.

Those of you fretting about the possibility that university X is slightly above or below university Y are wasting energy on a MYTH.

Law firms and barristers' chambers recruit on the basis of individual qualities. They do NOT say "Candidate A studied at University X, so she gets a job. Candidate B studied at university Y, so he doesn't get a job."

I am wasting my time saying this, because the myth is pervasive and persistent. Nobody here will believe me. The cousin of your friend's dentist saw something on the internet saying that you can only work at Linklater's if you have a quadruple first from one of three colleges at Oxford or two colleges at Cambridge. That must be true, right?

But I shall say this anyway -

University-blind selection procedures are now widespread. The fact that job candidates from some universities may out-compete candidates from other universities (those with the most resources being most successful), is attributable to the ability of some universities to be selective about admissions and to provide good quality education to people who are in the upper echelons of academic performance. The law is an intellectually demanding field of employment, so those with the strongest academic profiles tend to be the strongest candidates for employment in that field.

There can be many reasons for choosing one university over another. Calculations as to job prospects ought, I suggest, to play little or no part in the decision.

But please note this: Most of those here who aspire to work in what people here call "corporate law"* will NOT end up doing so.

There has been a vast increase in the number of people studying law degrees and PGDLs. There has been no such increase in the number of jobs available in the legal sector.

I urge students to stop fretting about university rankings, and instead to think about what they want to do and why they want to do it.

Why do so many of you want to be commercial lawyers, finance bros, and so on? Do you know what those jobs are like in reality, as opposed to in TV and movie fictions, or as showcased by employers in open days and vacation schemes?

In any event, please be realistic. Those who say " I have BCD at A level. I want to be a partner in Clifford Chance by 35" sadly need to balance aspiration with realism. Those who have AAA etc and are heading to one of the "usual suspect" universities, by all means crack on, but be realistic too. Simple supply and demand economics make the odds of succeding quite tough.

Good luck to you all, but have a Plan B.



*Corporate law is a sub-set of commercial law. Working in the corporate team in a large law firm is arguably one of the most boring things that a person can do in such a firm, but for some reason "corporate law" has become student-speak for commercial law.

PS: AI may soon be able to do quite a lot of the procedural and formulaic work done by non-contentious legal teams. If this happens, the number of jobs available in such teams will go down.

AI that can do dispute resolution may still be some way off. But if that is true, competition to become a disputes lawyer will increase. Doing disputes is a bloody business, an intellectual contact sport. It requires a certain personality type and most aspirant lawyers don't want to do it.
Reply 15
Original post by Stiffy Byng
TL/DR. 1. Please stop obsessing about university rankings. 2. Please thknk carefully about heading down the Suits route.
I may be one of the few people here who has conducted selection exercises in each of a magic circle barristers' chambers and a large law firm.
Those of you fretting about the possibility that university X is slightly above or below university Y are wasting energy on a MYTH.
Law firms and barristers' chambers recruit on the basis of individual qualities. They do NOT say "Candidate A studied at University X, so she gets a job. Candidate B studied at university Y, so he doesn't get a job."
I am wasting my time saying this, because the myth is pervasive and persistent. Nobody here will believe me. The cousin of your friend's dentist saw something on the internet saying that you can only work at Linklater's if you have a quadruple first from one of three colleges at Oxford or two colleges at Cambridge. That must be true, right?
But I shall say this anyway -
University-blind selection procedures are now widespread. The fact that job candidates from some universities may out-compete candidates from other universities (those with the most resources being most successful), is attributable to the ability of some universities to be selective about admissions and to provide good quality education to people who are in the upper echelons of academic performance. The law is an intellectually demanding field of employment, so those with the strongest academic profiles tend to be the strongest candidates for employment in that field.
There can be many reasons for choosing one university over another. Calculations as to job prospects ought, I suggest, to play little or no part in the decision.
But please note this: Most of those here who aspire to work in what people here call "corporate law"* will NOT end up doing so.
There has been a vast increase in the number of people studying law degrees and PGDLs. There has been no such increase in the number of jobs available in the legal sector.
I urge students to stop fretting about university rankings, and instead to think about what they want to do and why they want to do it.
Why do so many of you want to be commercial lawyers, finance bros, and so on? Do you know what those jobs are like in reality, as opposed to in TV and movie fictions, or as showcased by employers in open days and vacation schemes?
In any event, please be realistic. Those who say " I have BCD at A level. I want to be a partner in Clifford Chance by 35" sadly need to balance aspiration with realism. Those who have AAA etc and are heading to one of the "usual suspect" universities, by all means crack on, but be realistic too. Simple supply and demand economics make the odds of succeding quite tough.
Good luck to you all, but have a Plan B.
*Corporate law is a sub-set of commercial law. Working in the corporate team in a large law firm is arguably one of the most boring things that a person can do in such a firm, but for some reason "corporate law" has become student-speak for commercial law.
PS: AI may soon be able to do quite a lot of the procedural and formulaic work done by non-contentious legal teams. If this happens, the number of jobs available in such teams will go down.
AI that can do dispute resolution may still be some way off. But if that is true, competition to become a disputes lawyer will increase. Doing disputes is a bloody business, an intellectual contact sport. It requires a certain personality type and most aspirant lawyers don't want to do it.

I think it’s law applicant culture at this point to obsess over uni rankings. If I had a pound for everytime someone told me there’s no way I could be a barrister if I went to X university, I would probably have more money than Harvey Specter.

Edit - I spelt Harvey Specter wrong. That's my legal career gone before it even started, surely?
(edited 1 month ago)
I think it’s law applicant culture at this point to obsess over uni rankings. If I had a pound for everytime someone told me there’s no way I could be a barrister if I went to X university, I would probably have more money than Harvey Spector.


I suggest that you pay no attention to the views of random people who probably have no relevant experience.

The route to being a barrister involves being studious, industrious, academically distinguished, confident, determined, and lucky.

The name of the university you graduate from will play no role in the success or failure of the attempt at the route. Published university rankings will play less than no role. Nobody in the legal profession pays those rankings any heed. The quality of the learning experience at university will play a significant role.

Most barristers are at least a bit like Mr Dove, from "The Eustace Diamonds".

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/7381/7381-h/7381-h.htm#c25
Reply 17
Original post by Stiffy Byng
I suggest that you pay no attention to the views of random people who probably have no relevant experience.
The route to being a barrister involves being studious, industrious, academically distinguished, confident, determined, and lucky.
The name of the university you graduate from will play no role in the success or failure of the attempt at the route. Published university rankings will play less than no role. Nobody in the legal profession pays those rankings any heed. The quality of the learning experience at university will play a significant role.
Most barristers are at least a bit like Mr Dove, from "The Eustace Diamonds".
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/7381/7381-h/7381-h.htm#c25

Thank you. I suppose many people assume high rankings = high quality of education; I don't know how much truth there is in that, but that's because I genuinely have no idea how rankings are calculated in the first place. As a whole, some of the rankings make sense - I can get behind the idea that UCL will deliver a higher quality of legal education than the University of Law, for example. But when it comes to position 4 versus position 9, it all seems a bit arbitrary.

Side note - the author's writing is brilliant, haha. Out of the very few barristers I have met, none meet this rather scathing yet simultaneously complimentary description so far. Perhaps a whole different personality comes out when they're in court (and not trying to encourage enthusiastic and naive teenagers into their profession).
(edited 1 month ago)
Anthony Trollope is one of the best novelists of the nineteenth century. "The Eustace Diamonds" is one of Trollope's best novels. For more of Mr Dove, see chapter 28.

University rankings are compiled by nonsensical methods by lazy journalists and others. Quite often the measurements applied are merely quantitive, but they are presented as qualitative. Subjective views are presented as objective facts.

The rankings are click bait. Ignore them.

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