Year 12s: what will be the first way you research your future options? >>

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Reply 1300

Laus

Ninja, I still haven't read your post but I will do :redface:

. Sorry. Thanks for replying... I'm just watching this Jesus Camp thingy on channel 4. It's quite :s-smilie:

Reply 1301

~Kirsty~

Ana

That sounds really cool... never been to anything like that. I'm somewhat envious :redface:

I had friends who went last year, and said it was awesome. They even have camping this year!! :biggrin:

(not that I need it since i have a flat in edinburgh!)

Reply 1302

ImperceptibleNinja

Oooh, having camping is an awesome idea. There's no excuse for me not to see you all there now :biggrin:

Is the Jesus Camp thingy up online anywhere? It sounds as if it has... potential. What're they doing?

Reply 1303

~Kirsty~

it might be up on the demand thingy - maybe there will be a repeat sometime.

Reply 1304

NathanL

it's on google video! i watched it several months ago on that.

Reply 1305

Laus

I thought it was very strange :dontknow:

. It made me cringe. It was emotionalism taken to the extreme. They were kids; they haven't had time to 'sin'. I just wanted to scream at the TV that it's all OK; you don't have to worry because you are only little children. Jesus said, "Let the little children come to me, for such is the kingdom of heaven"… not, "make the little children think that Satan is after them, burden the little children with things that should not concern them".

No wonder I can't be a Christian…

Reply 1306

NJA

Laus

. . .No wonder I can't be a Christian…

Oh you can find salvation . .. but all the while you put the true way to one side and find fault with people doing it wrong you never will.

Reply 1307

Laus

NJA

Oh you can find salvation . .. but all the while you put the true way to one side and find fault with people doing it wrong you never will.

I am not finding fault in anyone. I have been brought up in a Christian household.

You are the most intensely annoying person I have ever encountered on TSR. I hate how people like you think they are better than other people are. I have not once seen you encourage or uplift a person. You have never offered proof that God exists. I have never seen you persuade one member of TSR to turn to God.

Haha. It may seem as though I have contradicted what I said but I haven't because I know that I respect some Christians on this forum.

Kids do not need to carry the world on their shoulders. They are Children for cheese and rice sake. :mad:

Reply 1308

NJA

Laus

. . . You have never offered proof that God exists. . . .

This is pure madness!

I have done little else but show the truth of God's word on related threads and personal messages.

I have testified of myself and people I'm with, I have affirmed what God promises and what he has done historically, and I have invited you to come and see for yourself.

Have you been open-mineded enough to visit? or do you assume that being brought up in "a christian household" is the same thing?

Reply 1309

Laus

I have been and I continue to be open-minded. I have not assumed that my being brought up in a Christian household is the same thing. I have been there, done that and bought the T-shirt.

The idea of God will always be incomprehensible to me, just as an idea of purple giraffe with twelve legs will remain beyond my understanding. I cannot believe in something/someone that leaves the path of evidence. The loch ness monster is bigger than we are but that does not make it real. Perhaps some philosophers turn to God because it placates their existential anxiety. I cannot found anything on the incomprehensible. I want to know if I can live with what I know and that alone.

I do know what it is to be a Christian and I hold nothing against them.

Reply 1310

NJA

Laus

. . . I have been there, done that and bought the T-shirt.
The idea of God will always be incomprehensible to me,

If the idea of God is incomprehensible to you, you definately have not been there.

Laus

I do know what it is to be a Christian and I hold nothing against them.

If you want to know, God will show you.
His words and actions through Jesus indicate that he thinks it's really important and really good!

Of course, many get get wrong, but why not be part of the answer not part of the problem!

Reply 1311

~Kirsty~

totally off the above discussion, but i'm going to Frenzy!!!!!! yay! Theres a group of people from a church i know going! Its going to be awesome!!!!

Reply 1312

Laus

ImperceptibleNinja

I think there are different answers to prayers... this sounds really harsh given that context, but there's the options 'yes', 'no', and 'not yet, later' - keep reading, don't get angry at me for saying that :redface:

. For example, I really like the idea of marriage, and could find myself yearning for that now, but I've got lots of other constructive things to do by myself at the moment, and that's a great opportunity in itself.

I'm not sure how that fits to your situation exactly. How do you want God to take away your depression/anxiety? A lot of stuff takes a lot of working with God, if you see what I mean by that. I'm going to come back to this in a minute or two.

First of all, I would like God to prove to me that he exists. I know this contradicts what I have been saying but I think it's important because I don't have anything or anyone else to pin all of my hopes on to. This is why I see Christianity as a comfort; it placates a person's existential anxiety and it gives them something - eternity - to look forward to.

Many Christians believe that God created a perfect world but that human's have made it imperfect. We cannot blame God for the way the world is since we are to blame. They may argue that God gave humans freewill but that we abused this freedom to fulfil our own fleshy desires. Eve longed to eat the forbidden fruit because she wanted what she couldn't have: God's infinite wisdom. Now, this all makes sense and it does demonstrate that we are free to do as we wish. However, one thing that strikes me contradictory to the Christian faith is the fact that God is, by his very nature, benevolent and forgiving. What is more, God is said to be omnipotent (all-powerful) and omniscient (all knowing). If this were true, then, before God created this magnificent universe, he would have known every event, every thought, every disaster, every triumph, every tribulation and every mishap that would ensue. He gave Adam and Eve freewill but the very fact that he knew his imperfect creatures would sin and go against his will in the first place, generates a human autonomy that seems pointless and predictable. God instructed Adam and Eve not to do something, knowing full well that they would go ahead and do it anyway.

Even if you (as a Christian) are not consciously thinking or believing it at the time, you know, in your heart of hearts, that this life, 'isn't it', and that, one day, you will be with your creator. This idea is so very appealing and I wish so much that I could believe what other people believe. I wish I could believe that we can all have faith and that this faith can be instilled and strengthened by some incomprehensible entity that loves me and wants what is best. If only I could feel content with not knowing. This blind faithfulness would probably do me good but I know that there will always be a niggling doubt at the back of my mind. If only I could ignore the unanswered questions and my own inability to comprehend something so incomprehensible.

In fact, I see that Christianity is necessarily incomprehensible if it is to be consistent. How can finite beings created in a time-space framework understand everything about an infinite, eternally transcendent God?

While this is true, I cannot found anything on the incomprehensible. I want to stay on a path where intelligence can remain clear.

ImperceptibleNinja

I know what you mean; I look at a lot of stuff and get incredibly angry, frustrated and confused by why it's allowed to happen. This doesn't just explain it all away, but there's the idea of giving the option for things to go wrong if this also allows the option for things to go amazingly better. Is it worth allowing everything to end up in the sorry little mess it is, if this also generates the option for people to experience the best thing ever afterwards? Going back to what I was saying above... if something fantastic comes as a result of you being depressed/anxious, do you think you'd be able to look back on that and say, 'given this outcome, it was worth going through all that.'? I'm not trying to say, 'you're suffering for good reasons, so there' :s-smilie:

I see what you are saying. How can we appreciate the good if we don't go through the bad stuff, right? While this is true, it doesn't make a person's suffering any less intolerable. I guess I'm looking at life from a very pessimistic viewpoint. Not everyone pulls through and not everyone who is destroyed by life gains something out of it. I don't think I could ever say that my depression is/was worth going through. Perhaps that's just me, though.

ImperceptibleNinja

it's not an easy thing to do. I don't really manage that well at all. Sometimes, looking at Christians, it's easy to think, 'wow, that's amazing, I wish I had their faith', but if you ask them about it, they sometimes struggle more than you realise. Even if you don't manage something, struggling for it is still very significant.

I realise this. Sorry, I know you don't have all the answers.

ImperceptibleNinja

=/ I hope I didn't come across as pushing a load of stuff at you. It's more my general responses to the points you made - I'm not going to go mental if you tell me you think it's a load of nonsense.

Not at all. Unlike NJA, you haven't presumed anything about my past or present faith and you have given me something to think about. Thank you :smile:

.

Laus

Reply 1313

Laus

NJA

If the idea of God is incomprehensible to you, you definately have not been there.

Oh but I have.

NJA

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist".

I am not part of the problem, you are :p: