University of Nottingham
Nottingham
Is the University of Nottingham considered to be a "prestigious" university.
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River85
This is a long post, so bear with me.
Not reputation as such, just popularity (the two aren't interchangeable as I'll explain). Nottingham experience a massive rise in popularity and then the inevitable dip. Newcastle then experienced a significant rise in applications (due largely to its party city image) then fell. It'll probably happen to two or three unis over the next ten years.
Durham, KCL and St Anderws were perhaps not well thought of by applicants (though I could still contest this). But then they are generally cluless about unis and their history and strength and rely too much on league tables. But even back then (2002) Durham must have been popular with applicants as, along with LSE, Warwick, Nottingham and Bristol, Durham had the highest typical offers outside Oxbridge.
Back in the late 90s, when Durham was only around 19th and had modest typical offers, it will still recognised as being one of the top unis in the country by academic peers and the establishment in general. To quote a newspaper article from 1999, when Prince William allegedly placed Durham on his uni shortlist: -
"Despite slipping five places to 18th in this year's university league table, Durham is still regarded as one of Britain's best."
Now, applicants who only really go by league tables may not have seen it like that (I imagine it would have been different amongst the privately educated who'd be more informed, especially as their parents attended uni and possibly even Durham). But the point is Durham graduates were well represented in the elite sections of society and this was recognised. Many members of the public had some vague idea of it being a top, prestigious uni.
Now I'm not using this as an opportunity to "big up Durham" as it's important I set this out before turning to Nottngham.
I really don't see why you're so upset about Nottingham's standing. We both know that it's only really been during the 90s and early part of this decade that it really built up this popularity and "prestige". So it's achieved a hell of a lot in such a short time. It's still very recent and hasn't had the same time that Durham, London or Bristol have to establish themsleves or curry favour with the upper classes and the establishment. But it has still built such a name for itself that it's arguably right up there alongside UCL, Durham and Bristol in law and also in IB (possibly even has the edge over some of those in IB). This is during a shorter time frame. As they years go buy and its representation in the bar, banking and business (politics and the media too as these are quite influential) then
It's gone down a few places in a league table. I don't think its teaching quality has suffered. Its research quality hasn't (as far as I'm aware), I don't think its peer reviews have and it's still one of the most heabily targeted universities in the country. So why the fuss over a few places in league tables (whose measures can change year on year)? I really don't think they've been lowering standards and have a academically inferior students when compared to UCL's, Warwick's, Durham's and Bristol's.
If it continues to establish itself in law, banking the media and politics it will continue to be influential. Just like Durham had most positions in the first few years of the league tables, but was still considered to be an excellent university, Nottingham hasn't suddenly fallen out of favour. It's lost some of its favour amongst applicants but this is inevitable. They probably couldn't sustain it. I don't think the quality of student has significantly declined post 2006.
Not reputation as such, just popularity (the two aren't interchangeable as I'll explain). Nottingham experience a massive rise in popularity and then the inevitable dip. Newcastle then experienced a significant rise in applications (due largely to its party city image) then fell. It'll probably happen to two or three unis over the next ten years.
Durham, KCL and St Anderws were perhaps not well thought of by applicants (though I could still contest this). But then they are generally cluless about unis and their history and strength and rely too much on league tables. But even back then (2002) Durham must have been popular with applicants as, along with LSE, Warwick, Nottingham and Bristol, Durham had the highest typical offers outside Oxbridge.
Back in the late 90s, when Durham was only around 19th and had modest typical offers, it will still recognised as being one of the top unis in the country by academic peers and the establishment in general. To quote a newspaper article from 1999, when Prince William allegedly placed Durham on his uni shortlist: -
"Despite slipping five places to 18th in this year's university league table, Durham is still regarded as one of Britain's best."
Now, applicants who only really go by league tables may not have seen it like that (I imagine it would have been different amongst the privately educated who'd be more informed, especially as their parents attended uni and possibly even Durham). But the point is Durham graduates were well represented in the elite sections of society and this was recognised. Many members of the public had some vague idea of it being a top, prestigious uni.
Now I'm not using this as an opportunity to "big up Durham" as it's important I set this out before turning to Nottngham.
I really don't see why you're so upset about Nottingham's standing. We both know that it's only really been during the 90s and early part of this decade that it really built up this popularity and "prestige". So it's achieved a hell of a lot in such a short time. It's still very recent and hasn't had the same time that Durham, London or Bristol have to establish themsleves or curry favour with the upper classes and the establishment. But it has still built such a name for itself that it's arguably right up there alongside UCL, Durham and Bristol in law and also in IB (possibly even has the edge over some of those in IB). This is during a shorter time frame. As they years go buy and its representation in the bar, banking and business (politics and the media too as these are quite influential) then
It's gone down a few places in a league table. I don't think its teaching quality has suffered. Its research quality hasn't (as far as I'm aware), I don't think its peer reviews have and it's still one of the most heabily targeted universities in the country. So why the fuss over a few places in league tables (whose measures can change year on year)? I really don't think they've been lowering standards and have a academically inferior students when compared to UCL's, Warwick's, Durham's and Bristol's.
If it continues to establish itself in law, banking the media and politics it will continue to be influential. Just like Durham had most positions in the first few years of the league tables, but was still considered to be an excellent university, Nottingham hasn't suddenly fallen out of favour. It's lost some of its favour amongst applicants but this is inevitable. They probably couldn't sustain it. I don't think the quality of student has significantly declined post 2006.
Youve slightly misinterpreted my post but never mind. The point is that whilst I and other students might have perceived Durham for example to not be 'that' good when i applied because of its rankings, not many applications per place (compared to now at least), that was simply because i didnt know as much about HE as I do know. After doing more research I can fully appreciate just how wrong I was about Durham (and other unis like Edinburgh for example) back then. Now I definitely see it as a top ten, one of the best after Oxbridge.(although I contest your belief about Durham currying favour with the upper classes, its loved at public schools, but its alumni list is hardly a tatler whose who) A lot of students nowadays are the same. Universities that the average student thought were 'the best' 5 years ago, are deemed nothing special now. York and Nottingham are prime examples of that. It just gets my goat a little when you have snotty nosed 17 year old on here talking like they know everything about British universities, yet when they say that Nottingham and York are ''just about top 15 universities,'' you think to yourself, how on earth did you arrive at that!
University of Nottingham
Nottingham
Broadsword
(although I contest your belief about Durham currying favour with the upper classes, its loved at public schools, but its alumni list is hardly a tatler whose who)
I didn't say it was. When you have two universities that are just so dominant and powerful for so many years then it's hard for others to get a look in. If Durham was established in the 1500s (like Henry VIII tried to do, then Cromwell a century later) then who knows?
It's well and truly a league behind Oxford and Cambridge (plus St Andrews, Edinburgh and perhaps Glasgow). But I think it's up there and challenges any English uni. Maybe it and Bristol together. In fact, its more religious character probably places it above Bristol when it comes to the clergy (which, historically at least, was an important part of the middle and upper classes and enormously influential)
It was created just as the Empire was really starting to reach its peak so it was quite in favour during the time of Imperialism, particularly in the Civil Service and colonial service. A second class institution it may be argued but, in England at least, arguably second only to Oxbridge.
London were busy educating the academics and business men (and their fair share of politicans and civil servants too, don't get me wrong) Durham educated some of the future Bishops and Archbishops, diplomats, governors of the colonies and prime minister once they reached independence, aristocracy and some royalty.
Earls, Dukes, Princes, Kings, Sheiks and sons of Prime Ministers. True, maybe only a handful and not exactly a "who's who" list, but I don't think any English uni can offer anything quite like Oxford or Cambridge can.
Can you find a good alumni list? I've never found a definitive one.
Anyway, back to Nottingham, that's my point, just top 15. What's so wrong about that? Maybe I'm just not elitist enough, I don't know, but I don't see there being a definitive top ten and a "top ten" university" is no better than some "top twenty" ones. The idea there's this drop in quality over a few league table positions is nonsense.
I can appreciate that it may be frustrating for some little snotty nosed 17 year old to come along and say it's only "top 15" or the same level as the redbricks. But then you admit that, in your days as an applicant, you weren't particularly well informed and thought unis like Durham weren't as good. Ultimately, the opinion of some 17 year old doesn't matter. What does matter is how you enjoy your time and university and, for many, how well targeted it is/what employers think of the uni. Those employers who do care about these things are not as ignorant as a snotty notes 17 year old.
I could understand if they were saying Nottingham was awful or that it doesn't provide a good education. I got tired of comments like that (but directed at Durham) in a recent Imperial v. Durham thread as those posting just had no idea about Durham or its physics department. So that I can understand. If someone said to a, say, prospective law applicant "Don't go to Nottingham as it's only known for economics" or "you'll get a crap education" that certainly is annoying and probably offensive.
River85
Whenever anyone tries to say uni x > uni y I always know that either they're trolling or just ignorant. Higher education is complex, you can't just boil it down to such simplified terms.
Oxford, Cambridge
LSE and Imperial (as specialist institutions)
UCL, Warwick, Duham, Bristol, Nottingham......I really don't think the difference between them is particularly great overall. UCL gives some advantages due to its size it can offer a wider range of programmes that many others can't. It's also in London which doesn't do any harm reputation or facilities-wise. But for undergraduate education really don't think it's stronger amongst most of its students, weaker in some (particularly engineering).
Warwick doesn't even offer many social sciences (a tiny number compared to Durham's and Nottingham's with most of Durham's "top three to five" departments and Nottingham are no slackers, especially in economics) and it's no stronger than unis like Durham or Bristol in the arts and sciences. Actually, Durham, Bristol and probably Nottingham have more than an edge in the sciences and engineering. Warwick's saving grace is its economics and maths departments. It's top class in these, especially maths, but outside those it's no stronger than the other provincial unis (and weaker in some respects).
Stop bandying terms like "prestigious" around unless you define them first and then are willing to back your arguments up. Many would say Durham (or UCL, Warwick etc.) are prestigous and many don't. Doesn't that tell you it's all just subjective, abstract crap?
Durham and UCL are prestigious in law, and, most importantly Nottingham too. Warwick is, but arguably slightly less so (it's not helped by its lack of age compared to the other unis).
Oxford, Cambridge
LSE and Imperial (as specialist institutions)
UCL, Warwick, Duham, Bristol, Nottingham......I really don't think the difference between them is particularly great overall. UCL gives some advantages due to its size it can offer a wider range of programmes that many others can't. It's also in London which doesn't do any harm reputation or facilities-wise. But for undergraduate education really don't think it's stronger amongst most of its students, weaker in some (particularly engineering).
Warwick doesn't even offer many social sciences (a tiny number compared to Durham's and Nottingham's with most of Durham's "top three to five" departments and Nottingham are no slackers, especially in economics) and it's no stronger than unis like Durham or Bristol in the arts and sciences. Actually, Durham, Bristol and probably Nottingham have more than an edge in the sciences and engineering. Warwick's saving grace is its economics and maths departments. It's top class in these, especially maths, but outside those it's no stronger than the other provincial unis (and weaker in some respects).
Stop bandying terms like "prestigious" around unless you define them first and then are willing to back your arguments up. Many would say Durham (or UCL, Warwick etc.) are prestigous and many don't. Doesn't that tell you it's all just subjective, abstract crap?
Durham and UCL are prestigious in law, and, most importantly Nottingham too. Warwick is, but arguably slightly less so (it's not helped by its lack of age compared to the other unis).
Are you trolling?
what i mean by prestigious, it is something that top companies look for. Durham not sure about that.. after all it is not even in the russel group.
130ss
Are you trolling?
what i mean by prestigious, it is something that top companies look for. Durham not sure about that.. after all it is not even in the russel group.
what i mean by prestigious, it is something that top companies look for. Durham not sure about that.. after all it is not even in the russel group.
What are "companies" and "employers"? There are a hell of a lot in this world and vastly different areas Durham's certainly right up there at the top in law, behind only Oxbridge. So to are Nottingham, more or less. In IB then that's not the case but that's largely due to a lack of demand and interest from Durham students and, to a slightly lesser exent, Notts students. Both still do quite well though, up there with Nottingham and Bristol and second only to Oxbridge, London and Warwick.
In other career areas things are a lot cloudier and more complex. It's whether employers think individuals can offer what employers are looking for and not universities. Durham's still right up there as one of the most targeted unis. So too is Nottingham.
Being in the Russell Group means nothing. It's just a collection of large unis, Durham is part of the 1994 Group of smaller unis. One isn't better than the other. A RG uni isn't better than a 94 Group uni.
Durham has produced more CEOs of the world's current top 200 companies than UCL and LSE put together. Nottingham hasn't done too badly either in recent years. Now stop trolling.
River85
What are "companies" and "employers"? There are a hell of a lot in this world and vastly different areas Durham's certainly right up there at the top in law, behind only Oxbridge. So to are Nottingham, more or less. In IB then that's not the case but that's largely due to a lack of demand and interest from Durham students and, to a slightly lesser exent, Notts students. Both still do quite well though, up there with Nottingham and Bristol and second only to Oxbridge, London and Warwick.
In other career areas things are a lot cloudier and more complex. It's whether employers think individuals can offer what employers are looking for and not universities. Durham's still right up there as one of the most targeted unis. So too is Nottingham.
Being in the Russell Group means nothing. It's just a collection of large unis, Durham is part of the 1994 Group of smaller unis. One isn't better than the other. A RG uni isn't better than a 94 Group uni.
Durham has produced more CEOs of the world's current top 200 companies than UCL and LSE put together. Nottingham hasn't done too badly either in recent years. Now stop trolling.
What are "companies" and "employers"? There are a hell of a lot in this world and vastly different areas Durham's certainly right up there at the top in law, behind only Oxbridge. So to are Nottingham, more or less. In IB then that's not the case but that's largely due to a lack of demand and interest from Durham students and, to a slightly lesser exent, Notts students. Both still do quite well though, up there with Nottingham and Bristol and second only to Oxbridge, London and Warwick.
In other career areas things are a lot cloudier and more complex. It's whether employers think individuals can offer what employers are looking for and not universities. Durham's still right up there as one of the most targeted unis. So too is Nottingham.
Being in the Russell Group means nothing. It's just a collection of large unis, Durham is part of the 1994 Group of smaller unis. One isn't better than the other. A RG uni isn't better than a 94 Group uni.
Durham has produced more CEOs of the world's current top 200 companies than UCL and LSE put together. Nottingham hasn't done too badly either in recent years. Now stop trolling.
you keep trolling dont you..
what do you think of southamption uni?
130ss
you keep trolling dont you..
what do you think of southamption uni?
what do you think of southamption uni?
Yep. I'm a big dirty troll with countless warnings for trolling. How on earth did I become a mod
Believe me or don't believe me. There's a world university ranking out there (I'll try and find it) which ranks universities according to how many CEO's of the world's top 200 companies they've produced. Durham and the entire University of London are equal (quite considerable due to the massive difference in size between the two). This doesn't just include UCL and LSE but also (at the time) Imperial, SOAS, QMUL.....Nottingham's also there (or not far off).
In the past handful of years Durham can count a former CEO and President of Ford and an MD of Goldman Sachs. Nottingham has produced a CEO of GlaxoSmithKline and Chairman of Vauxhall (amongst others).
You clearly have no idea about graduate employment (otherwise you wouldn't make such stupid statements you have) or you're too corrupted by IB thinking that's unfortunately so prevalent on these fora. Whichever of the two it is I really don't care. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion the can you please leave. Thanks
River85
Yep. I'm a big dirty troll with countless warnings for trolling. How on earth did I become a mod
Believe me or don't believe me. There's a world university ranking out there (I'll try and find it) which ranks universities according to how many CEO's of the world's top 200 companies they've produced. Durham and the entire University of London are equal (quite considerable due to the massive difference in size between the two). This doesn't just include UCL and LSE but also (at the time) Imperial, SOAS, QMUL.....Nottingham's also there (or not far off).
In the past handful of years Durham can count a former CEO and President of Ford and an MD of Goldman Sachs. Nottingham has produced a CEO of GlaxoSmithKline and Chairman of Vauxhall (amongst others).
You clearly have no idea about graduate employment (otherwise you wouldn't make such stupid statements you have) or you're too corrupted by IB thinking that's unfortunately so prevalent on these fora. Whichever of the two it is I really don't care. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion the can you please leave. Thanks
Believe me or don't believe me. There's a world university ranking out there (I'll try and find it) which ranks universities according to how many CEO's of the world's top 200 companies they've produced. Durham and the entire University of London are equal (quite considerable due to the massive difference in size between the two). This doesn't just include UCL and LSE but also (at the time) Imperial, SOAS, QMUL.....Nottingham's also there (or not far off).
In the past handful of years Durham can count a former CEO and President of Ford and an MD of Goldman Sachs. Nottingham has produced a CEO of GlaxoSmithKline and Chairman of Vauxhall (amongst others).
You clearly have no idea about graduate employment (otherwise you wouldn't make such stupid statements you have) or you're too corrupted by IB thinking that's unfortunately so prevalent on these fora. Whichever of the two it is I really don't care. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion the can you please leave. Thanks
how did you become a mod.. because your lonely and spend all your time on tsr.. they want people like you...
soo what do you think of southamption uni
River85
Yep. I'm a big dirty troll with countless warnings for trolling. How on earth did I become a mod
Believe me or don't believe me. There's a world university ranking out there (I'll try and find it) which ranks universities according to how many CEO's of the world's top 200 companies they've produced. Durham and the entire University of London are equal (quite considerable due to the massive difference in size between the two). This doesn't just include UCL and LSE but also (at the time) Imperial, SOAS, QMUL.....Nottingham's also there (or not far off).
In the past handful of years Durham can count a former CEO and President of Ford and an MD of Goldman Sachs. Nottingham has produced a CEO of GlaxoSmithKline and Chairman of Vauxhall (amongst others).
You clearly have no idea about graduate employment (otherwise you wouldn't make such stupid statements you have) or you're too corrupted by IB thinking that's unfortunately so prevalent on these fora. Whichever of the two it is I really don't care. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion the can you please leave. Thanks
Believe me or don't believe me. There's a world university ranking out there (I'll try and find it) which ranks universities according to how many CEO's of the world's top 200 companies they've produced. Durham and the entire University of London are equal (quite considerable due to the massive difference in size between the two). This doesn't just include UCL and LSE but also (at the time) Imperial, SOAS, QMUL.....Nottingham's also there (or not far off).
In the past handful of years Durham can count a former CEO and President of Ford and an MD of Goldman Sachs. Nottingham has produced a CEO of GlaxoSmithKline and Chairman of Vauxhall (amongst others).
You clearly have no idea about graduate employment (otherwise you wouldn't make such stupid statements you have) or you're too corrupted by IB thinking that's unfortunately so prevalent on these fora. Whichever of the two it is I really don't care. If you don't have anything constructive to add to the discussion the can you please leave. Thanks
So middlesex is better than lse?
http://www.ensmp.fr/Actualites/PR/EMP-ranking.html
Swansea is better than lbs! wow..wasnt expecting that :P
prospectivEEconomist
So middlesex is better than lse?
http://www.ensmp.fr/Actualites/PR/EMP-ranking.html
Swansea is better than lbs! wow..wasnt expecting that :P
http://www.ensmp.fr/Actualites/PR/EMP-ranking.html
Swansea is better than lbs! wow..wasnt expecting that :P
First of all, that wasn't the table I was referring to. I also wasn't saying that just because on university has produced more global CEOs than another that makes it academically stronger.
philjw
You must be thinking of Manchester.
No. Though Moss Side in Manchester and Croxteth in Liverpool have huge incidents of violent crime too, as a city, Nottingham is worse statistically.
It's a decent uni - probably prestigious for some courses. What course are you considering?
ElemenT'
Go and read this exact thread in the notts forum.
Or the one before that (now locked, found on the second page). There's probably more.
I find it quite grand and have a great deal of respect for it and consider it to be amongst our top universities and can pretty much match any of our other provincial universities like Warwick, Durham, Bristol etc. Prestige is abstract (there'll be many who think only Oxford and Cambridge are prestigious) but it's certainly more than a "decent Russell Group university" in my opinion.
In fact, I'm moving this to the thread in the Nottingham forum. If this question is supposed to be directed to Non-Nottingham students as well as Nottingham students then I'm sure it was still get plenty of input from both (just like that thread has)
What he said ^^^
Whenever I hear of Nottingham Uni, I'm impressed.
Whenever I hear of Nottingham Uni, I'm impressed.
Nottingham is good, but only 'prestigious' for certain fields - the great benefit is that we are making so much money, and throwing cash at problems, that I dare say Notts will be back in the top 10 within 5 years - we have just bought some of the best scholars in the world, and it shows.
League tables are all internal politics anyway, as are even the RAE to an extent, although their findings are more accurate.
Nottingham doesn't fit the label of 'prestigious exactly imo, but it's bloody good nonetheless.
League tables are all internal politics anyway, as are even the RAE to an extent, although their findings are more accurate.
Nottingham doesn't fit the label of 'prestigious exactly imo, but it's bloody good nonetheless.
Calm down whoever negged me...
Nottingham is 10th in the UK according to the Academic Ranking of World Universities and within their top 100. It is also important which subject is considered. For exemple their research in Psychology is 5 (RAE), so if that is not prestigious enough... And if i.e. you would like to study for a masters degree in Cognitive Neuroscience, even Oxbridge doesn't provide that (only PhD), so your options are "only" UCL, York, Durham, Notts (out of the first 20) and Nottingham has a Noble Prize Winner for developing the MRI scanner (which is used for Cog Neuroscience) and therefore the best neuroimaging facilities in the UK. Then I think Nottingham is very prestigious - at least in that subject and people are usually studying for a subject and not all the subjects that a university has.
Hedgehunter
BTW doesnt Nottingham have the worst rates of violent crime outside of South London?
I guess its ironic that I'm leaving South London to go to Nottingham
It is considered quite prestigious, yes. A RG university with a top 10 REF ranking.
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